USS Constitution Model -A different Post

Thank you very much Grymm.

cheers,

Julian

Lots of nice-looking models in this thread.  It should lay to rest the argument that plastic sailing ship models have to look like - well, like "plastic models," as so many people seem to conceive the phrase.  (Somebody once - with the best of intentions - told me one of my plastic models "looked like a wood model."  I replied, probably a bit snippily, "it isn't supposed to look like a wood model.  It's supposed to look like a ship."  The models in this thread certainly look like ships.)

Regarding the crowsfeet, I agree with Schoonerbum.  Their absence from the old Isaac Hull model would be enough to stop me from putting them on a War of 1812-vintage model of the Constitution myself (and the fact that Marquardt shows them would not counterbalance that fact in my mind).  But the evidence isn't strong enuough to make me pronounce a Constitution with crowsfeet "wrong."

Grem56 wrote:

Okay, on request a few photos of where my Constitution stands now (there you go Marcus). Not even near the same class as the model mentioned at the beginning of this thread (and I was feeling so happy about my build ) Rather blotchy at the moment, needs to be toned down. This as far as I have come . Cheers, Julian

What are you talking about?  Your build looks fantastic!  The weathering is just enough to give the hull a lively character.  Don't let someone elses build get you down.  Hell, I've been working on Heller's Soleil Royale for 3 years now.  Aside from being a much maligned kit but stunning kit, my build is full of errors and my impatience with rigging shows.    But, I've been complimented every time someone sees it and it occupies a great place in the living room.  I also finished my Heller Chebec and it comes nowhere near the quality of Big Jake's build.  But I'm still proud of it. 

Set aside the fact that just taking on or finishing a monster build like the Constitution is worthy of commendation, you should be proud of your skill.  Keep posting photos!  I have a library of photos of the Revell Constitution and yours would be a welcome addition.  I have the USS United States waiting in my stash and these photos will come in handy.

Good job and keep posting..

Grymm

Thanks for the reference Alan, I also checked Lees who says that they were generally going out of use by the late 18th century, which is not to say that they were not being used in the early 19th century.

I fitted them to my Norkse Love model, but not to the Victory, still I think if there are grounds to fit them they are a nice feature, and I would include them.

Crowsfeet appear to be appropriate for the Constitution. John Harland's "Ships and Seamanship, The Maritime Prints of JJ Baugean" shows them on several warships from the early 19th century, including an American frigate on page 39. Based on the limited number of warship prints shown with them, they may not have been common, but they are clearly shown.

Baugean was a contemporary artist to the Napoleanic and 1812 wars, producing accurate representations of naval warships into the 1820s from direct observation.

John Harland and Heinz Marquardt are recognised experts on 18th and 19th century rigging.

I probably would not place crowsfeet on my Constitution model but I would not consider them incorrect.

"I was a little puzzled by the fitting of Crowsfeet and Euphroe blocks, but when I checked Marquardt's Anatomy of the Constitution book they are shown in his drawings, but my understanding is that these fittings belonged more to the seventeenth and early eighteenth centuries, particularly where round tops were involved."

Hello Scott,

thank you for your encouragement!

If you can manage with so many animals one should think I should be able to manage it with only two kids. ... but unfortunatly its more than this. Any hobby should help to relax and should not increase the stress-level. Today I have much to much tasks to do - and much to few time. Its sufficient to read here and there - or do look here in internet for your results and discussions. But for more .. well not today. But as soon as I start doing something you soon will know it - because I will confront you with a lot of questions then ;-)))

scottrc wrote:

Don't let the little ones keep you from building, I have two cats and four dogs who own the house I live in.  Just makes things a little more interesting.    Marcus.K. wrote: ...   Hey anyone here building the Constitution or another beauty from the age of sail. You might complain about Maros state of art and that your version seems far away from it. But at least you are doing something! And all I can see is very precise and beautiful work! I still collect books and pictures - and I still do not dare to start my old hobby again. I fear the painting. I fear the work with the rigging! I am so jealous if I see and hear about your models ... But wait .. in a few years, when my little boys got older and when I have my own desk so that I can leave my stuff on it  .. then I start glueing and painting - and later on rigging ... Until then: keep me impressed with your art and give me more samples to follow!

Hey Scott - I visited your web-page! Very impressive!

What is a "step masting" ?

Marcus.K. wrote:

Don't let the little ones keep you from building, I have two cats and four dogs who own the house I live in.  Just makes things a little more interesting.    Grem56 wrote: Okay, on request a few photos of where my Constitution stands now (there you go Marcus). Not even near the same class as the model mentioned at the beginning of this thread (and I was feeling so happy about my build ) ... Rather blotchy at the moment, needs to be toned down. This as far as I have come . Hello Julian,  thanks for showing us your version. We discussed earlier - and I very much like the colour scheme. Your version gave me the idea, that the 1814-version with yellow gun strike is more intersting than the usual 1812 black and white one. And seems the Revell Kit does have the additional bridle ports the scheme looks very likely! I like it! It looks very good to me.   Hey anyone here building the Constitution or another beauty from the age of sail. You might complain about Maros state of art and that your version seems far away from it. But at least you are doing something! And all I can see is very precise and beautiful work! I still collect books and pictures - and I still do not dare to start my old hobby again. I fear the painting. I fear the work with the rigging! I am so jealous if I see and hear about your models ... But wait .. in a few years, when my little boys got older and when I have my own desk so that I can leave my stuff on it  .. then I start glueing and painting - and later on rigging ... Until then: keep me impressed with your art and give me more samples to follow!

I am returning to the forum after being gone awhile with a diabetes-related issue.  It seems appropriate to respond to this particular thread given my love for sailing ships.  Here goes . . . "WOW!"

Bill Morrison

  That's one beautiful Constitution. I'll not comment on any of the questioned details. I've only built one Constitution. This builder's attention  to detail is impressive whether right or wrong.

Grem56 wrote:

Okay, on request a few photos of where my Constitution stands now (there you go Marcus). Not even near the same class as the model mentioned at the beginning of this thread (and I was feeling so happy about my build ) ... Rather blotchy at the moment, needs to be toned down. This as far as I have come .

Hello Julian,

 thanks for showing us your version. We discussed earlier - and I very much like the colour scheme. Your version gave me the idea, that the 1814-version with yellow gun strike is more intersting than the usual 1812 black and white one. And seems the Revell Kit does have the additional bridle ports the scheme looks very likely! I like it! It looks very good to me.  

Hey anyone here building the Constitution or another beauty from the age of sail. You might complain about Maros state of art and that your version seems far away from it. But at least you are doing something! And all I can see is very precise and beautiful work!

I still collect books and pictures - and I still do not dare to start my old hobby again. I fear the painting. I fear the work with the rigging! I am so jealous if I see and hear about your models ...

But wait .. in a few years, when my little boys got older and when I have my own desk so that I can leave my stuff on it  .. then I start glueing and painting - and later on rigging ... Until then: keep me impressed with your art and give me more samples to follow!

I am at the point of stppeing my masts on the one I'm building.  Looking at these pictures, yup I am just building this kit, This person is crafting a work of art.

Thanks Jake for the post.

Scott

Okay, on request a few photos of where my Constitution stands now (there you go Marcus). Not even near the same class as the model mentioned at the beginning of this thread (and I was feeling so happy about my build )

Rather blotchy at the moment, needs to be toned down. This as far as I have come .

Cheers,

Julian

I have had a look at the translated version Jake, and there is very little description of his techniques etc;

This is the tool to use if you want to check it out (no pun intended)

http://www.google.com/language_tools?hl=en

Really puts my quarter built USS Constitution to shame. This gentleman has really gone to town on the old Revell model. Just love the colours and shades of the masts. Thanks for drawing attention to this build MArcus and Jake.

Julian

Hello GeorgeW,

I believe, you are right! I did not check jet in the Marquardt-book - but I would guess Marquardt is mistaken!

If you look at the Isaac Hull Modell (I think the photos are linked here somewhere), you will notice that its rigging is different in this point! I am affraid here Marquardt is wrong too! His studies concerning the USS Constitution are not that much reliable, I am affraid.

Our friend in the Czech Republik seems to follow Marquardt - so his Modell will be an interpretation of Marquardts findings (or mistakes). Look at the stove, he did! I like the colour-scheme, he added wallthickness in the gun ports ! This is one of the best Constitution-modells I ever saw. ... only to follow Marquardt seems to be not the best advice - you pointed out with your hint.

You're right Jake it is a beautifully finished model, it looks a lot older than its actual years.

I was a little puzzled by the fitting of Crowsfeet and Euphroe blocks, but when I checked Marquardt's Anatomy of the Constitution book they are shown in his drawings, but my understanding is that these fittings belonged more to the seventeenth and early eighteenth centuries, particularly where round tops were involved.

Still they are an interesting feature to rig on a model, and have been nicely done.

Thanks for finding it out.