Revell's 1/144th, DD-445

I have one in my stash unstarted as yet. Railings will benefit from being replaced with PE parts. To get you primed for the build take a look here: http://modelshipwrights.kitmaker.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=134929&page=1

The oilcanning effect is very impressive, don't think I have the nerve to try it

Julian

i see the flecther class destroyer in the u.k is now priced at £60 a rise of £20

 oil canning by steve h on the modelshipwrights site very intresting, my next model i am doing is a 1/96 th scale destroyer, the uk's latest ship hms.daring, i was on her last week, looking at the hull up close, was thinking to myself how do i get the same effect on a fibre glass hull, you can scape away plastic but not fibre glass, my other thought was to mark the hull out then glue say cotton thread to give me the squares then spray over the whole lot with mr surfacer, or is it better just to leave it alone, the model i will be doing is just over 5 foot long,  keith

Why don't you try your theorie out on a large piece of scrap? You will need big brass ones if you do decide to tackle a 5 foot long hull in this fashion Keith 

Cheers,

Julian

On the July FSM issue reciew of this kit, is the 'can' mounted on the torpedo launcher on the wrong launcher? Shouldn't it be on the aft launcher?

Not as far as I know, Larry Schramm mentioned using the wrong colours for the 'midships DC's  but apart from that his build looks PDG.

Julian

 

Aurora-7 wrote:

On the July FSM issue reciew of this kit, is the 'can' mounted on the torpedo launcher on the wrong launcher? Shouldn't it be on the aft launcher?

Yes, it should be on the aft torpedo bank.   The purpose of the can was to protect the torpedo crew from the blast effects of the superfiring 5"/38 gun

Grem56 wrote:

Not as far as I know, Larry Schramm mentioned using the wrong colours for the 'midships DC's  but apart from that his build looks PDG. Julian

 

It's an AWESOME build!

But as Ed stated above, I thought the purpose of the can was blast protection from the aft gn.

 

I also see now what you gentlemen mean by the "can"

Julian

keef666 wrote:

oil canning by steve h on the modelshipwrights site very intresting.........

Actually, does anyone know why it's called 'oil canning'? Is it because it buckles like the old oil cans?

Aurora-7 wrote:

Actually, does anyone know why it's called 'oil canning'? Is it because it buckles like the old oil cans?

Yup, that's the source

Any word of square bridged variant or plans for and after market producer to make a conversion kit of one?

James @ Nautilus has said that he has experimented with his wood burning laser to cut sheet styrene to build a square-bridge version.   I think it is his cost containment solution since a solid hunk-o-resin to replace the bridgehouse would be almost as expensive as the basic kit

Grem56 wrote:

I have one in my stash unstarted as yet. Railings will benefit from being replaced with PE parts. To get you primed for the build take a look here: http://modelshipwrights.kitmaker.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewtopic&topic_id=134929&page=1 The oilcanning effect is very impressive, don't think I have the nerve to try it Julian

That is a brilliant thread on oilcanning!!!  I recall having a prolonged argument in reference to the Dragon USS Buchanan in this forum some time ago, as I hoped one day a model company might be able to simply mold-in some oilcanning effects.  However, I was completely shouted down by all and sundry that this was 'impossible' and 'undesirable,' and 'we wouldn't even think of producing such a thing!!'  In any case, the 1/144 Revell destroyer is a much larger scale, so perhaps the effects are better suited to this size.  Certainly looks outstanding in this example, no doubt about it!!

James at Nautilus has announced his new walkway anti-skid mat decals for the 1:144 scale Fletcher.    These are the rubber "bath mat" tiles applied to the decks to prevent slipping.

The sheet has about 850 scale feet total plus special patterns for the 40mm twin tubs found in the kit and in the Nautilus aftermarket sets, 20mm guns, pilothouse top, fwd deckhouse, and even the amidships 40mm tubs added in 1944 and later.

searat12 wrote:

That is a brilliant thread on oilcanning!!!  I recall having a prolonged argument in reference to the Dragon USS Buchanan in this forum some time ago, as I hoped one day a model company might be able to simply mold-in some oilcanning effects.  However, I was completely shouted down by all and sundry that this was 'impossible' and 'undesirable,' and 'we wouldn't even think of producing such a thing!!'  In any case, the 1/144 Revell destroyer is a much larger scale, so perhaps the effects are better suited to this size.  Certainly looks outstanding in this example, no doubt about it!!

 Oh come on I didn't shout you down. I simply disagreed with you on the desirability of the oil canning. It is not impossible to add to the model, just time consuming and hard on my computer due to all the extra curved surfaces. In 350 scale the effect would have to be greatly exaggerated to make it show up anyway. The hull mold is pretty complicated and in this case there was only going to be one built so it was either yay or nay on oil canning. There are more modelers building their ships in pristine condition than those who weather them. So in this case the majority was served. I am not opposed to doing an oil canned version, but it would take a new tool and I don't see that happening right now. But you never know, someday Dragon may want to revive interest in the Benson/Gleaves kits and that would be one way to do it. But for now, it is up to those awesome superdetail nuts to add it to the kit and make their models stand out in the crowd. 

  HI .... To start out , why would anyone want to put the dents in a ship known as oilcanning . ???? The scales are usually to small and would make the models in smaller scales look less than right . When I scratch build a train scale ship the oilcanning , as you call it is there . Why? well I plate these ships just like the yards do and they don,t come out smooth . Now ,I do sand them down prior to painting and the effect is hardly noticable , except when the light hits them just right . That,s the way it should be . NOW , in 1/350 or even 1/144 the effect would be to tedious to include in the build . LINDBERG,S U.S.S, MELVIN has some sink marks that when after sanding the hull ,look like the oilcanning you speak of . The 1/200 S.M.S. KRONPRINZ that I am doing as a takeoff on the paper kit has that effect . WHY ? Well every plate from centerline to the main deck is there , each , individually installed so the line of hull has some oilcanning . This phenomena is also caused by tugs AND very rough seas . You can paint for effect but at smaller (1/350 ) scale ,do you really want to do it ????

  HI  Well the interest in squared bridge fletchers certainly is there. The truth of it is , I,ve only seen the square bridge in r.c. size ships and the LINDBERG kit , of course the old REVELL fletcher (The small one ) If you use the drawings from scale shipyard or just copy the U.S.S. MELVIN,S (from lindberg )  That bridge is not fully accurate ,but, it,s a start .

tankerbuilder wrote:

HI  Well the interest in squared bridge fletchers certainly is there. The truth of it is , I,ve only seen the square bridge in r.c. size ships and the LINDBERG kit , of course the old REVELL fletcher (The small one ) If you use the drawings from scale shipyard or just copy the U.S.S. MELVIN,S (from lindberg )  That bridge is not fully accurate ,but, it,s a start .

If you are going to invest  your resources (time, money, styrene, etc.) in a scratchbuilding a square bridge, you would be better served in obtaining a copy of the Floating Drydock's Fletcher plan eBook than copying the POS Lindberg kit.   The eBook has detailed plans for both round and square-bridge variants and is chocked full of photos and scrap-view drawings to detail the items shown on the larger plans.  

Bob Steinbrunn, builder of the award-winning USS Kidd model which FSM featured a few years back said that this plan book was his single most important reference in detailing his model.

The eBook is available from the Floating Drydock (floatingdrydock.com) and is in PDF format on a CD.  It also costs less than the Lindberg offering.

Oh, and BTW, the square-bridge Fletcher is available in other ship modeling scales, from 1:2400 (GHQ) to 1:192 (Iron Shipwright)

EdGrune wrote:

These are the rubber "bath mat" tiles applied to the decks to prevent slipping.

Not rubber... essentially paint with sand in it to make it extra rough. Rubber would be too flammable. I've got a document I'm Sloooooowwwwwly working on (it's a snoozer to code but of some historical interest) detailing the Navy's transition to metal decks on carriers and how they tested the paint on them.

ModelWarships wrote:

searat12 wrote: That is a brilliant thread on oilcanning!!!  I recall having a prolonged argument in reference to the Dragon USS Buchanan in this forum some time ago, as I hoped one day a model company might be able to simply mold-in some oilcanning effects.  However, I was completely shouted down by all and sundry that this was 'impossible' and 'undesirable,' and 'we wouldn't even think of producing such a thing!!'  In any case, the 1/144 Revell destroyer is a much larger scale, so perhaps the effects are better suited to this size.  Certainly looks outstanding in this example, no doubt about it!!  Oh come on I didn't shout you down. I simply disagreed with you on the desirability of the oil canning. It is not impossible to add to the model, just time consuming and hard on my computer due to all the extra curved surfaces. In 350 scale the effect would have to be greatly exaggerated to make it show up anyway. The hull mold is pretty complicated and in this case there was only going to be one built so it was either yay or nay on oil canning. There are more modelers building their ships in pristine condition than those who weather them. So in this case the majority was served. I am not opposed to doing an oil canned version, but it would take a new tool and I don't see that happening right now. But you never know, someday Dragon may want to revive interest in the Benson/Gleaves kits and that would be one way to do it. But for now, it is up to those awesome superdetail nuts to add it to the kit and make their models stand out in the crowd.

.... And the shouting begins again!  I don't recall naming any names, but it looks like you just jumped right in anyways!  At this point, I don't care, but I was very pleased to see what an amazing amount of effort could do to produce the effect I had been discussing before, and what some of those modellers 'who don't want that sort of weathering' will do to produce it anyways...

Lets not get the panties all bunched up about adding or not adding what comes down to dents in a model ship If you want to try this without taking a risk contact Revell of Germany: they were prepared to supply spare hull parts for the very nice price of 15 euros so that if I plooked the oilcanning I would still have a pristine hull left. I didn't take up on their very kind offer because I got side tracked by a large number of Dragon armour models so as I said before, the Fletcher sits pretty in my stash waiting on better times. An alternative is adding shading with different tones of gray which at this scale will give the same effect (I did this in 1/72 scale on my Revell U-boat).

Julian

searat12 wrote:

And the shouting begins again!

Seriously, you think that is shouting?

You miss the point... the MAJORITY of modelers do not want oil canning. Snap quiz: do you know how that was determined?

I have the 1/144 Fletcher and I found the hull plating to be grossly overscale to the point that it's distracting. It will be okay, I think, once the paint is down and hiding the plating somewhat, but even in that scale it shouldn't really be any thicker than a piece of tape.

Tracy White wrote:

You miss the point... the MAJORITY of modelers do not want oil canning. Snap quiz: do you know how that was determined?

Humor me, tell me how you know the "MAJORITY" of modelers do not want oil canning?

Julian

This looks great. I was wondering how hard this kit would is for a non ship builder? As my father was on a Fletcher class in Korea and wanted to build it.

Jason

 Jay, If you have been building for as long as it has taken you to write 500+ posts, DIVE IN buddy! This scale should be an easier build than say 1/700th.

                                                                           doc

Tracy White wrote:

searat12 wrote: And the shouting begins again! Seriously, you think that is shouting? You miss the point... the MAJORITY of modelers do not want oil canning. Snap quiz: do you know how that was determined? I have the 1/144 Fletcher and I found the hull plating to be grossly overscale to the point that it's distracting. It will be okay, I think, once the paint is down and hiding the plating somewhat, but even in that scale it shouldn't really be any thicker than a piece of tape.

...and once again, the shouting begins!  Get it straight; I don't CARE what you want in a model, or what you think other people want in a model.  I know what I would like in a model, and apparently, there are others who think likewise, enough to go through enormous effort in order to achieve it.  And really, that's all there is to say about it, so can we drop this NOW, and get back to the subject at hand?  The Revell Fletcher, at 1/144 scale, looks to be a quite splendid kit, and because of its size, apparently lends itself better to a variety of weathering and detailing features than the Dragon 1/350 Buchanan, don't you agree?

I really give up here. Apparently two grown men want to go head to head on a non-issue. Time to pop a beer and get a bag of munchies, sit down and watch the fun .

Julian

 Now, now, Let's not bicker over who killed who (Monty Python). Let's just try to have fun at our hobby, besides, do you not build to please yourself? If you want "oil canning" do it, if not, build it that way. If you need to have a pissing match, "PM" each other. Because I would Guess... most of us here are here for enjoyment and commaradary. Definately not what you have turned this thread into.

                                                                         doc 

Exactly!  I don't want to discuss the other thread, what interests me is the method by which this guy achieved the oilcanning effect.  Apparently, he used the eraser end of a pencil with a bit of sandpaper on it, slowly sanding away each of the indentations.... dozens of them!  A remarkable effort with remarkable results!  I know I sure don't have the patience for that sort of thing, but it always amazes me when someone does....

As for the Revell Fletcher, has anyone seen if there are brass replacement barrels for the 5" guns available yet?