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SMS Schleswig-Holstein

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  • Member since
    January, 2006
  • From: istanbul/Turkey
SMS Schleswig-Holstein
Posted by kapudan_emir_effendi on Monday, November 23, 2009 5:00 PM

When we think about German battleships we naturally think the last about pre-dreadnoughts of that nation. Legend of Bismarck, Scharnhorst class sisters, pocket battleships and the battlecruisers of Kaiser's High Seas fleet instantly come to the mind. However, I think that more than any of these, SMS Schleswig-Holstein of the Deutschland class was perhaps the most "succesful" or "lucky" battleship of German nation by virtue of her battle honors and service period. She was present of that fateful 31 of May in 1916, actively engaging and being damaged by the most powerful of all British battlesquadrons (2nd) and survived. She escaped the bottom of Scapa Flow or breaker's yard which swallowed Kaiser's Navy. Apart from being fleet flagship of Weimar Republic, she fired the first shots of Second World War on September 1, 1939 and continued to be active right through the end of the conflict, meeting a fighting end. Her career is almost like a symbol of 20th century Germany. I'd really like to have a model of her in 1/350. Considering how low the prospect of seeing a styrene kit, I'm even ready to swallow my hatred for resin but unfortunately this workmanly old ship seems to be forgotten even by small scale producers.

Here a link for motivation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgENjoWBFf4

Don't surrender the ship !
  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Monday, November 23, 2009 5:58 PM
I share your pain, effendi. Whenever I see one in plastic, I grab it. So far though just the Mikasa, Suvurov; wouldn't an Agamemnon be grand! Or Texas?
  • Member since
    January, 2006
  • From: istanbul/Turkey
Posted by kapudan_emir_effendi on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 12:50 AM
We should not forget the "oldie but goldie" Heller's battleship Potemkin also. I would be happy to see USS Oregon in 1/350 scale in form of a decent new kit above any other US battleship. If we return back to subject; SMS Schleswig-Holstein is no doubt seen as historically quite significant not only by you and me but also by Jane's; it is included into their little pocket book "Battleships of World War II" even. So, a 1/350 model of her would be really fitting. However what we can get in the next few years will be another model of IJN Yamato or USS Iowa in a different fit; that's sure.
Don't surrender the ship !
  • Member since
    October, 2009
Posted by Tom L. on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 1:30 AM

HP Models used to do (still does, perhaps?) several of the Deutschland class in WWI fit, and Schliesen in WWII fit, all in 1/700 scale.

  • Member since
    May, 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 6:38 AM
I seem to recall that the German company Wilhelmshaven Models made a large-scale Schleswig-Holstein in paper.  And those German paper kits were/are extremely sophisticated, with literally thousands of individual parts.  Not for the faint-hearted, but capable of producing extremely impressive models.  I have the vague impression that the Wilhelmshaven kits are still available; maybe some Forum member who knows the paper modeling scene better than I do can comment more intelligently.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    March, 2004
  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 8:08 AM
I was watching the first episode of "The World at War" last night and sure enough, there was Schleswig-Holstein blasting Westerplatte with her guns at lowest elevation and her trim on her port side (where the guns were trained) a bit low. Speaking of the Devil!

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
    December, 2002
Posted by Dreadnought52 on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 9:55 AM
If you are going to go 1/700 for Schleswig-Holstein I suggest the WSW kit rather than the H-P kit as it is a more accurate rendering of the ship. Combrig of Russia is now producing very nice models of the Worth class of pre-dreadnoughts and may move into more of them as time goes by. H-P Models has produced an amazing variety of Imperial German Navy ships. However, given a choice of the same ship produced by WSW, Combrig, or NNT I would choose the other manufacturers over H-P. WS
  • Member since
    January, 2006
  • From: istanbul/Turkey
Posted by kapudan_emir_effendi on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 10:32 AM
Thanks for suggestions. Though the 1/700 German resin models are quite nice, they do not fit to my collection unfortunately. Besides I have a lot more kits in my to do list before I shall think about SMS Schleswig-Holstein and I have the hope that a 1/350 scale model of it may appear from one of the ever proliferating range of large scale models from one of these Russian companies until that time. If not though, I can try the paper model that professor Tilley suggests as a last resort.
Don't surrender the ship !
  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 10:43 AM

We now consider you "our man in Kiev" so you'll have access to Zvezda stuff. They seem to be churning out ever better subjects now, not just old Novo rereleases. I've bought a couple of their little 1/72 armor models, and those compare positively with Trumpeter.

There is also the revell Emden/ Dresden in plastic

PM me please and I'll give you my email. I would really like to read your thesis. Congratulations!

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Wednesday, November 25, 2009 9:07 AM
I agree that a 1/350 scale kit would be extremely nice! I have given up building 1/700 as being too small for my aging eyesight. And, I agree that the historical importance of the Schleswig-Holstein is overlooked in favor of more famous but less successful German capital ships.

Bill Morrison
  • Member since
    August, 2008
Posted by tankerbuilder on Friday, November 27, 2009 10:32 AM
Hello, J .Tilley. Well, here it is the day after turkey and trimmings and I am thinking ships.I don,t know about P.M.I. out of OREGON.I used to get my papermodels from them.Presently I do have the SMS KRONPRINZE.I am using the paper model as patterns to re-create her in plastic.This particular shipmodel is from POLAND and comes in BOOK format at 1/200 scale .there are some,I know in 1/350 and others at the scale I mentioned.The SCHLESWIG-HOLSTEIN ,I believe is in this companys catalogue, I am not sure. I also don,t know what scale the model would be. I do believe that WILEMSHAVEN has her or mine in 1/350 ,I would have to check and see. My catalogue is now three years old. I had heard that PAPERMODELS INTERNATIONAL was for sale and that,s the last info I had.Someone might want to try to look them up! the last address I had was in BEAVERTON, OR.
  • Member since
    May, 2008
Posted by tucchase on Friday, November 27, 2009 9:24 PM

Another possible good subject might be the SMS Goeben.  I just read a sci-fi short story about this ship and it's run for Istanbul with the cruiser Breslau about August 6, 1914, right after the start of WWI.  In the story, this ship was intercepted by a British Cruiser squadron and forced to run aground.  I looked up this ship and it really existed, and really did make the run to Istanbul.  All the other ships listed in the story were real also.  In reality, she slipped by the cruiser squadron and made it to the Ottoman Empire.  Since Turkey was supposed to be neutral at that time, Turkey agreed to make both ships part of their fleet in order to protect them from the British.  When she was transferred to Turkey, her officers and crew remained aboard.  The Goeben became the Yavuz (and the Flagship of the Fleet) and served on active duty until 1960 when she was finally decommissoned.  This made her the longest active duty Dreadnaught class ship in the world. By comparison, the New Jersey only had 21 years of active duty.  This info is per Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SMS_Goeben

 

  • Member since
    July, 2014
  • From: Philadelphia Pa
Posted by Nino on Saturday, August 10, 2019 1:44 PM

kapudan_emir_effendi

When we think about German battleships we naturally think the last about pre-dreadnoughts of that nation. Legend of Bismarck, Scharnhorst class sisters, pocket battleships and the battlecruisers of Kaiser's High Seas fleet instantly come to the mind. However, I think that more than any of these, SMS Schleswig-Holstein of the Deutschland class was perhaps the most "succesful" or "lucky" battleship of German nation by virtue of her battle honors and service period. ...she fired the first shots of Second World War on September 1, 1939 and continued to be active right through the end of the conflict, meeting a fighting end. Her career is almost like a symbol of 20th century Germany. I'd really like to have a model of her in 1/350. Considering how low the prospect of seeing a styrene kit, I'm even ready to swallow my hatred for resin but unfortunately this workmanly old ship seems to be forgotten even by small scale producers.

Here a link for motivation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SrF5D0udkJQ

bondoman
I share your pain, effendi. Whenever I see one in plastic, I grab it. So far though just the Mikasa, Suvurov; wouldn't an Agamemnon be grand! Or Texas?
 

 

 

  Didn't want to start a new thread so an update to this one seemed appropriate.

There has been a bit of interest on the Trumpeter Schleswig-Holstein what with Trumpeter releasing 2 different versions of it.

If interested take a look at this:

http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=168291&p=792511#p792511

     Nino

 

 

(Zombies Live!)

  • Member since
    May, 2013
  • From: From the Mit, but live in Mason, O high ho
Posted by hogfanfs on Saturday, August 10, 2019 2:08 PM

Nino, thanks for giving this thread life. I am interested in a Deutschland class, and I see ICM has 4 Konig class ships as well. I believe I've seen a few dreadnoughts from Hobby Boss too.

 Bruce

 

 On the bench:  1/48 Eduard MiG-21MF

                        1/35 Takom Merkava Mk.I

 

  • Member since
    September, 2003
  • From: USA
Posted by mstazz62 on Saturday, August 10, 2019 2:56 PM

Trumpeter models makes the Schleswig-Holstein in 1/350 injected plastic in both the 1904 and 1935 fits - the kit is readily available - in fact I'm in the process of building that kit right now - nice kit, good fit , a bit basic in detail but there is a german model site that has a large scratch-built 1/70 scale model that I've been using as a guide to detail my kit up - the link is on Modelshipwrights site - go to the shiplovers heading, then the Deutchland class heading - 

Mark

mstazz62
  • Member since
    July, 2014
  • From: Philadelphia Pa
Posted by Nino on Tuesday, August 13, 2019 9:09 AM

Mark,

 That 1/70 scratch-build is really something.  In my opinion the 1/70 scale model is accurate for the ship at the Start of War.  So far the WSW 1/700 resin kit seems accurate for the number of 2.0cm guns carried on Sept 1, 1939.   For those 2.0cm AA...location, location, location, is the all important factor.  I expect to add more updates on the 1939 ship for the 2.0cm gun locations shortly.

     I'm still looking for proof as to what secondary Guns were aboard in 1935. The info I have used to post over on Modelwarships is conflicting on when and how many 17.0cm vs 15.0cm guns were on board that year. To my thinking there is an "issue" caused by statements about when the last upper deck secondary guns were removed. Fortunately for those trying for a late 1939 version, it's all 15.0 cm casemates on the hull.

 

  For those planning to build the model, be careful on what photos you use as reference.  There have been incorrect ship indentification captions posted. Schleswig-Holstein and Schlesien do have several differences that seem to get missed for proper ship indentification.

 

Mark, How far along are you with your model?

 

    Nino

  

EDIT...

  The 1/70 scratch-build link mentioned previously:

http://www.der-lustige-modellbauer.com/ ... stein-1-70

 

The Modelwarships link, I mentioned:

http://www.shipmodels.info/mws_forum/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=168291&p=792511#p792511

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