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How many sails on the 'Soverign of the Seas'

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  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Sunday, March 13, 2011 11:27 AM

warshipguy

Indeed!  If you choose to display the ship without sails, check the references to determine proper placement of the yards.  I have seen so many builders display their ships with bare yards in the positions they would be in wearing a full suit of sails, which, of course, is incorrect.

Bill Morrison

Yes, that is the tradition I speak of. It has long been very common to display warships this way, also with gunports open.  Not scale, but sort of a tradition.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    March 2011
Posted by BigOleBob on Saturday, March 12, 2011 10:26 PM

Thank you everyone for your support.  With your information I've decided to keep the top sails. The model is full of innacuracies and I accept this as one of many. At first I was scared of atempting to do my own shrouds due to my drill having a tendency to melt the plastic then through friction melting larger holes. Then I realized I could simply notch the edges of those oversized chain plates and then glue a strip of plastic outside that once rigging was complete.  Though atempting such small ramheads seem impossible. I've contemplated ripping the individual ramheads from the plastic rigging and glueing them in proper place Then having the hand done shrouds above. The only thing similar to a 'block' i have at that scale are jewry 'seed beads' which can handle 2 threads going through the center but the outside is curved and smoothe. not idea for simulateing those elements. What do you guys suggest as the plastic shrouds are not even spaced properly for the cannons.

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Saturday, March 12, 2011 7:52 PM

Indeed!  If you choose to display the ship without sails, check the references to determine proper placement of the yards.  I have seen so many builders display their ships with bare yards in the positions they would be in wearing a full suit of sails, which, of course, is incorrect.

Bill Morrison

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Saturday, March 12, 2011 9:58 AM

Indeed both topgallants AND toproyal yards were often taken down when not in use.

Also, looking at eigtheenth century and earlier ships for guidance of rigging of nineteenth century ships is not a good idea.  Rigging changed over the centuries.  And clippers in particular carried much more sail than even other ships in nineteenth century.  One of the big criticisms of the clippers is that they carried too much canvas for their hull size (and shape).  Some captains carried too much canvas in conditions they should not have, in hopes of a faster passage.  Sailing as crew under such captains was not conducive to a long life.

One of the traditions of display of model ships that is not completely accurate, but- as I say- is traditional, particularly on warships, is to display them without sails but put up all the yards and all the running rigging associated with those yards and sails.   Looks neat but, for instance, when in port, much of that tophamper stuff was taken down.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Saturday, March 12, 2011 6:25 AM

cerberusjf,

I agree. Both are correct.

Bill Morrison

  • Member since
    December 2006
  • From: Jerome, Idaho, U.S.A.
Posted by crackers on Saturday, March 12, 2011 12:11 AM

   Perhaps, this picture might help you.

     Montani semper liberi !  Happy modeling to all and every one of you.

                         Crackers                   Geeked

Anthony V. Santos

  • Member since
    February 2011
Posted by cerberusjf on Friday, March 11, 2011 3:33 PM

BigOleBob

My 1/250 lindberg kid needs modification. 

I found http://www.thesovereignoftheseas.com/ a site which includes 1933 wood building instructions for the same ship. The number of spars (horizontal beams) that the sails attach to seem to indicate only 3 sails for the forward and main masts. Yet the model kit has 4. Ive seen some models online with 4 and some with 3.

 

Hi Bob,

the answer is both are correct.  The 4th sail up is called a "royal" , the 3rd up is the topgallant, 2nd up is the topsail.  If memory serves me correctly, the yard (or spar) for the royal was often hoisted before setting the sail, so the yard was not always attached to the mast.

 

I'm not sure I understand your second question though.

Cheers

J

  • Member since
    March 2011
How many sails on the 'Soverign of the Seas'
Posted by BigOleBob on Friday, March 11, 2011 3:22 PM

My 1/250 lindberg kid needs modification. 

I found http://www.thesovereignoftheseas.com/ a site which includes 1933 wood building instructions for the same ship. The number of spars (horizontal beams) that the sails attach to seem to indicate only 3 sails for the forward and main masts. Yet the model kit has 4. Ive seen some models online with 4 and some with 3.

The only other question I have is in reguards to spars. In both the forward and main mast there appears to be a seperate spar that the second-up-sail attaches to on the bottom of the sail. Yet in many old illustrations it seems to share the top-spar of the Lower sail. Which should I aim for?

This model has hard plastic molded sails on translucent white plastic. Not bad but the arangement of the spars and sails is what has me a little confused. To me this is what makes or breaks me from going for more detail vs 'basic' with cheezy plastic ratlines. I've considered cutting off the 4'th sails on the hard plastic and just utilizeing those 1933 sail rigging instructions. Since this is such a small model I've contemplated  using glass 'seed beads' as simple blocks. since this is a 1/250 model which loads of innacuracies (missing fife rails simplified detail and a bowsprit grate wich looks more like a plank than grate), what do you suggest?

Bob

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