I Could Use A Few Tips.......

I would add one thing to what others have said. Ships are large and painting is an on going project. Therefore some paint will be fresh and some will show some age. The one thing you should add is some areas of primer. In the 1960s the primer was red in color.

Tracy makes a good point about putting a man over the side to scrape and paint for an underway ship.  It is far too dangerous.  But, ships in port routinely do so.  HMS Iron Duke spent an overwhelming amount of time in port.  Her periods at sea can be measured in days or weeks not months or years.  Her crew would have had to be kept largely occupied scraping, painting and in "field day," or cleaning, even along the waterline from barges.

A good comparison would be with wartime photos of HMS King George V in WWII. She spent considerable time at sea in most oceans and the Mediterranean.  She frequently shows an extremely weathered look.  HMS Iron Duke, in contrast spent considerably little time at sea until at least early 1917.  Her weathering would be extremely minimal, certainly with no rust of note.

Bill Morrison

Thanks again for all the info fellas.I'll definately try not to make a mess of things.

True story about deck painting, at least in the Merchant Marine in WW II -

1) Place 5-gallon pail of paint in center of area to be painted. One lucky deck ape so designated upends pail all at once and as fast as possible.

2) Rest of deck force works furiously to spread paint around with the vague goal of at least covering up the really rusty or grungy areas of the deck. No extra points for neatness or straight edges.

3) It was considered almost a capital crime to let gray deck paint run out a scupper and down the side of the (usually black) hull; woe unto the man who wasn't quick enough with his brush. At the very least the mate would rip him a new you-know-what ... at the worst the captain would see it and over the side the offending seaman would go to fix the atrocity, usually regardless of the weather.

To recap / reiterate, the areas below the decks would show more weathering as it was harder and more dangerous to hang someone over the side that it was to stand on a deck. At the same time, hulls are smoother, with less features for rust to form on (Rust tends to form first on corners where it's easier for paint to crack ad let water in, and in areas that have impact/wear).

There were other things that affected paint, though, such as paint chalking, fading, and areas of newer paint amongst faded paint. That may be a larger discussion than you want to aim for at this point, but I've seen it done well in 1/700th scale.

John,

I agree with you about those corvettes!  Perhaps I should qualify my point . . . capital ships are usually better maintained.  Certainly the battleships of the Grand Fleet would show little in the way of weathering because they did spend most of their time in port and could be well-maintained.  However, that varied ship-to-ship . . . see my previous post.

Bill 

Good picture!  Now, if we were to scale it down to 1/600, I believe that the effects would be more subtle.  Also, at what time period was the picture taken, during Iron Duke's days as Grand Fleet flagship, during her Mediterranean service when Beatty took over the Grand Fleet in HMS Queen Elizabeth, or during her days fighting the Soviet Bolsheviks?  It can make a real difference in how a ship was maintained.  For example, HMS Erin was always known as a dirty ship because of how poorly maintained her crew kept her.  HMS Tiger was usually emaculate.

The advice to apply heavier weathering on the hull near points of heavy wearing is sound.  I also like the use of pastel chalks. Practise is the key.  Good luck!

Bill

warshipguy

I emphatically agree that less is more.  HMS Iron Duke was Admiral Jellicoe's Grand Fleet flagship throughout most of the war, and was considered as a "showboat" throughout most of her subsequent career. As such, she was very well maintained; I suspect there was little to no apparent rust.

Many modelers tend to over-do weathering on warships, making them appear as little more than unkempt skows. Washes can be too heavy, rust can be over-emphasized, and salt staining renders the ship a gigantic salt lick.  Less is definately more!

Bill Morrison

Have you seen pictures of real flower class corvettes? they had lots of rust on them as the crews rarely had time to do anything about it. I saw one picture where there was a huge rust patch, where the paint has just peeled off, on the hull. That is one warship that cannot be overdone. However I do agree less is usually better. The other thing I notice is that many people uniformly weaher their ships. In real life some parts will be less weathered than others as they are easier to reach for maintenence. The hull will show the most weathering and the superstructer the least weathering. That is my two cents worth.

Here is a crop of a photo of Iron Duke, there is some light weathering amidship, so even the flagship could look a bit dirty sometimes.

 http://s229.photobucket.com/albums/ee274/cerberusjf/?action=view&current=Iron_Duke_crop.jpg

?action=view¤t=IronDukecrop.jpg

warship guy makes a valid point - warships, as a "general" rule of thumb, don't get all that scruffy looking, Sure, I can find pictures of WW II escorts in the North Atlantic looking pretty bad - for the fact that they were continually at sea for months at a time and seldom got the opportunity for drydock or even pier time. That was an exception. Merchant ships, on the other hand, could get really nasty, really quickly, and might see drydock once a year (if that), which is one reason I build them, less reason to worry about a "nice" finish.

And Manstein's Revenge's blanket statement that you can't weather a ship in that scale is also incorrect - if you follow Ed's excellent advice of "less is more" and, above all, take your time with whatever you do. Rust doesn't form in a few seconds. Practice a little first, and with different materials. I've also used powedered pastel chalks in 1/700 to good effect.  

Hi,

I think a good book for you would be "Ship models from kits" by David Griffith.  It gives you a lot of useful weathering techniques like washes, filters and pin washes.  His work is outstanding, imho of course.  He applies very little in the way of rust, as others have advised.   You can see a review here

http://www.steelnavy.com/ShipModelsFromKits.htm

I think weathering should be heavier on the hull than the superstructure and rust  I think should be limited to areas where the paint would get worn off e.g. the lower hawse lips, fairleads and bollards and if you like, maybe rust streaks  from them running down the hull side.  Just my 2c worth :)

My own approach is that there are two kinds of ship models. Diorama subjects and display models. This is kind of unique. I prefer to model display models, in which case I like everything new and shiny.

I emphatically agree that less is more.  HMS Iron Duke was Admiral Jellicoe's Grand Fleet flagship throughout most of the war, and was considered as a "showboat" throughout most of her subsequent career. As such, she was very well maintained; I suspect there was little to no apparent rust.

Many modelers tend to over-do weathering on warships, making them appear as little more than unkempt skows. Washes can be too heavy, rust can be over-emphasized, and salt staining renders the ship a gigantic salt lick.  Less is definately more!

Bill Morrison

Thanks guys.We are definately on the same page here.A little bit of drybrushing and a teeny bit of rust by the anchors should be enough.

I've seen it done; it just takes practice. As Ed says, less is more; most people tend to overdo it.

IMO, rust cannot be replicated to a realistic degree in that scale...primarily because an active duty warship wouldn't have much to speak of and any it did would be so small in 700th scale as to look overdone if attempted...

The best armor modeler woke me early one Saturday morning.    He was working on a destroyer model for a group build I was running.

"Weathering a ship is just like weathering a tank, except you leave off the mud!"

Apply washes of burnt umber or Payne's gray.    I've also had success using royal purple on WWII USN ships painted in the purple/blue schemes of the period.   Then go back and drybrush over with the base color or the base color lightened a shade or two.   Use a very dry brush and work slowly.    Its easy to add more but harder to remove too much,

Use a rust-colored Prismacolor pencil to pick rust spots at the hawse holes or where the scuppers run off the deck.    Again go slow.   Less can be more.