Question on rigging 1/96 Revell USS Constitution

With all respect to others opinions, I don't see external reinforcement of spars giving good results. Even on my Viking ship, I found it easier to just make a new one out of wood. I'm from the school of making round tapered spars out of square pieces of wood because I find it much easier to monitor progress. Others prefer to start with a dowel.

And if the plastic parts are used, there's still that seam to deal with, which can get problematic in between mast bands, etc.

Another reason that I don't tackle plastic ship kits much, unless I plan to replace all of the spars.

No, John, I can't understand it either.

Mike

Am I the only one who can't make heads or tails out of the previous post? PSB, maybe you could try again?

alexander47

 

Mike

The operation of reinforcement does not have to be hidden but perfect and achieved before mounting the stays and rigging hangers lifts

(It is my opinion)

Each case is different for each of them has to use imagination

 

A. Alexandre

 

 

alexander47

 

Mike

The operation of reinforcement does not have to be hidden but perfect and achieved before mounting the stays and rigging hangers lifts

(It is my opinion)

Each case is different for each of them has to use imagination

 

A. Alexandre

 

 

During her last restoration, they used fifteen different sizes of standing rigging and nine sizes of running rigging on the real Constitution.  That would be pretty difficult to duplicate in any scale.

The Model Expo 1/76 wooden model supplies six different sizes of rigging with the kit, ranging from 0.005" to 0.051" dia., but the instructions say that the builder will need to get more at some point.

As Don suggested above, the best approach is to probably just  "eyeball" the size of the thread depending on the application.  Using different diameters of thread ( as much as practical) is definitely going to look more realistic. 

As a general rule of thumb, the standing rigging gets smaller the higher you go up the masts.  There should also be a significant difference in the diameters of the shrouds and ratlines.   

I would agree with Don's suggestion that hand-tying the ratlines (although requiring time & patience) produces the best results. 

Mark

Novice27

Hello, I recently acquired a 1/96 Constitution that was missing ALL rigging ( threads and ratlines) and am trying to research what I need before I even touch the rigging on her. Can anyone give me an idea of the 6 thread sizes I will need ( Black and Tan, small, med. and large) as well as how I can replicate the ratlines? MIke, your ship looks great! I hope i can get mine looking even HALF that good!

Not using a jig, but hand tying the ratlines, is a much better way to go on a model of that size.  You do not need to use  clove hitch knots, simple overhand knots do fine.  Just eyeball the thread size, it is not super-critical. You can use a little strip of stripwood to get the spacing between ratlines, but after you get one mast done, the spacing will become second nature and you can probably toss the stripwood for the other masts.

The ratlines are probably the most tedious, repetitious task on a sailing ship model.  Just do not try to do too many in one session.  I find I cannot work at such a tedious task for more than a half hour at a time.

Novice27,

Thanks for the compliment.  I wish I could help but I honestly don't know the thread "sizes". All I did was go to the local sewing shop (Jo-Ann Fabric and Craft Store) with the thread that came with the kit and look around for the closest approximate size and color I could find. I just couldn't use the stuff that came in the box. It was too difficult for me to work with for much of the rigging.

You might give a look to pp 66 - 69 on this thread: http://modelshipworld.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=13090&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&start=650

This guy is rebuilding the Revell 1/96 CS into a generic clipper. I think he's doing a fabulous job and the build log is fun (for me) to read. He does talk about some of the thread sizes so it may be of some help.

Best of luck with your build,

1943Mike

Hello, I recently acquired a 1/96 Constitution that was missing ALL rigging ( threads and ratlines) and am trying to research what I need before I even touch the rigging on her. Can anyone give me an idea of the 6 thread sizes I will need ( Black and Tan, small, med. and large) as well as how I can replicate the ratlines? MIke, your ship looks great! I hope i can get mine looking even HALF that good!

Mike

The operation of reinforcement does not have to be hidden but perfect and achieved before mounting the stays and rigging hangers lifts

(It is my opinion)

Each case is different for each of them has to use imagination

A. Alexandre

Alexandre,

Thanks for the tip. If I could hide a stiff, straight piece of wire inside the skinnier sections of top masts lengthwise, I'd give it a try. I just haven't figured out how to do that yet.

Mike S.

alexander47

Mike

Here is an advice not to break very long extremities mast

Reinforce the parties with iron wire ( 0.5 a 1.0mm «»0.002 "a 0.004")

 

Here are two examples: in the main mast and the bowsprit

A.Alexandre

 

Isn't that similar to what the Iron bands on the masts and the bowsprit were intended for on the real ships?

And are those craft beads in place of the block and tackle on the rigging of your ship?

Mike

Here is an advice not to break very long extremities mast

Reinforce the parties with iron wire ( 0.5 a 1.0mm «»0.002 "a 0.004")

Here are two examples: in the main mast and the bowsprit

A.Alexandre

Mr. Tilley, Mr. Stauffer, and CapnMac82,

Thanks for chiming in! Indeed all of you have answered my question regarding the leech and bunt lines. I'll have to take a few days to think about whether or not to include them.

It's very gratifying to have heard from so many of you whom I consider knowledgable on the subject of model ship rigging. My sincere thanks.

Of course, when I'm done with the "Connie" I have my newly acquired 1974 Revell 1/96 Cutty Sark to work on. This is becoming quite a journey!

Mike Stolting

Yeah, without sails, I'd skip bunt and leach lines.

Besides, you will have more than enough on your plate rigging the braces.

And, braces are an excellent candidate for rigging "backwards."  That is, starting from the belaying point and then to where they terminate.  That will let you snug up the lines out where there is a little bit more room to work.  Mostly.

Nice touch painting the lanyards on the deadeyes, too.

As A. Alexandre said, to be perfectly true to scale, much running rigging would not be rigged without sails.  But, there is an old tradition in ship modeling that naval ships are frequently displayed sans sails, but with topmasts and above erected, all yards in place, and much of the running rigging in place.  That tradition does not, to my knowledge, have any written documentation.  So what running rigging you use is more or less up to you.  Better to omit minor lines than rig them incorrectly, in my opinion.  Lifts, halyards, braces are almost always depicted- beyond that is sort of optional.

BTW, model looks really sharp!

It's certainly not a cardinal sin to omit the leechilnes and buntlines from a model without sails.  The leechlines and buntlines are used to furl the sail; the leechlines lead to the leaches (sides) of the sails, and the buntlines to the bunts (feet).  If the sails were removed for any length of time, the bunt- and leachlines are too.  Plenty of excellent models (without sails) don't include these ropes. 

This kit's instructions (like every other plastic sailing ship kit's instructions, so far as I know) tell the modeler to complete the assembly of all the masts and yards before starting the rigging.  Bad idea.  It makes far more sense to "rig as you go."  Step the lower masts, with the tops in place, and rig the lower standing rigging.  Add the topmasts and rig the standing rigging for them (if the lower rigging somehow interferes with the fitting of the topmasts, you've done something wrong), and so on.  When it comes to the yards, I find it easiest to rig them - as much as possible - secured temporarily to a dowel clamped in a vise on the workbench.  You can attach all the necessary blocks, rig the footropes, and, if you like, secure all the lines that need to be secured to the yard before you get it anywhere near the model.  You'll find that this method also breaks up the inevitable monotony of rigging a bit.

Your busted-loose pinrail is a standard hazard of that kit.  Next time, consider two options:  either glue a reinforcement piece of plastic strip or wood to the bulwark under the pinrail (the coils of rope on the pins will hide it), and/or reinforce the joint with metal pins (or pieces of piano wire). 

The bottom line is that, as others have pointed out, it's your model.  And the pictures show that it's a mighty impressive one.  There are plenty of ways to interpret various features of a ship model - especially if the subject is one like this, which has been the subject of so much research and argument over the decades.  It's clear that you have a model you can be proud of.

Good luck.  You're certainly into the home stretch.

BaBill212 and stcat, thanks for the kind words.

Mark and Greg, I appreciate your thoughts. I've been looking ahead at the last page of running rigging and maybe I will attempt the leech and bunt lines since they do not seem as daunting as I first imagined. I've taken a lot of time since I began this model (last December) so taking a few more months to complete her per instructions shouldn't be too much of a problem. That is assuming I don't break something unfixable down the road. Yesterday, as I was finishing the lifts and lower sheet and tack lines I broke off the top of the mizzen mast including the flagstaf stay and top backstays. It's a real challenge to hold pieces together steadily enough to let the CA glue set. I also pulled out the starboard fore pinrail trying to tighten a line on a pin . With both hands clutching tweezers I was able to reglue it without a problem. I only hope my luck holds out to the finish of this build.

Mike Stolting

Looks good
The rigging and running of a sailing boat
  only is complete when the sails are mounted

A.Alexandre

Like the man said, truly impressive.

My advice would be to think ahead. Do you think it's likely that, at some point, you'll wish you had done the rest of the rigging? If it will drive you crazy, then maybe take a week (or three) off and work on something else, then come back to it fresh.

On the other hand, if you like the way it looks, and you're worrying about the rest of it only because it's what you're "supposed" to do, don't give it a thought. You've got something to be exceptionally proud of, no matter what!

Greg

Certainly not a cardinal sin to omit them.  It's your model.

I've done some sailing in the past and occasionally get obsessive about including every bit of rigging on a model.  Besides driving me crazy and taking away some of the enjoyment, I found that it didn't always add to the appearance of the model.  One of the nice things about rigging is that it's fairly easy to go back and add stuff later.

FWIW, take a look at some of the recent pictures of the Constitution.  It's only partially rigged as it continues to go through it's current restoration.  If someone modeled it in it's current condition, some folks would probably consider it 'inaccurate'.

Nice work so far.

Mark

Do you still have your eyesight?

Man, that rigging is impressive.

Mike,     Can't help you with the rigging questions,,, but, I think the ship looks great!