More Dreadnought rigging questions

Don,

Referring to John Roberts AOTS Dreadnought there were six coaling derricks fitted to the ship.

Three on each side of the ship two each next to the bridge, the aft funnel and the aft mast and they all stood upright when not in use. Page 45 and 46 show photos of the two forward pair of derricks with page 64 and 65 showing the aft most pair of derricks. Page 65 shows the tackle used to keep the derricks in place when stowed.

Page 206 figure F1 shows the coaling rig in place. The three coaling derricks and the main derrick were used to support a wire (coaling jackstay) that supported numerous coaling whips (taken to coaling winches) and downhauls that raised coal from colliers or lighters to the weather deck.

Coaling the ship seams to be a very detailed process.

To keep the coaling derricks in the stowed position seems to require short wire tackle arrangements that could be represented by short lengths of line or wire on the model.

Page 212 gives plan and profile drawings of the the details of the coaling derricks in figures F8/13 and F8/14.

Scott Harris

Thanks, Scott.  Maybe I can find that book from an online used book dealer.

Don,

You might try the library. I found the Yamato volume of the AOTS series in the Georgia library system and kept it for a month and photocopied parts of the book. The library also had a reference book on the Arizona and did the same with it.

Scott

From everything I've read coaling was a labor intensive all hands event and very dirty. I would go for stowing the booms in the unused position.

But here's a question for you. When did the British Navy change over from coal to oil? If you are modeling the ship in the WWI era would coal still be used?

The first oil-fired battleship was Queen Elizabeth , launched 1913 and commissioned in 1915.

There were plenty of coal-fires battleships and warships of all kinds in WWI, for example the battleship Iron Duke and battlecruiser Invincible and lots more.

Yes, that agrees with what I have read.  I don't think they converted that many ships, just built new ones for oil.  There is quite a discussion in the book, The Prize, the Quest for Oil, Money and Power.  That is a fantastic book and has a chapter on the British decision to go oil-fired on major warships.

Seems to me this was an early "stealth" technology as well as having other benefits.  Sure made a LOT less smoke, and smoke was a sort of "over-the-horizon" radar (visual radar :-)  ) target.

Don

I don't know the answer to your question but just ordered the Zvezda kit because I need a break from the Soleil Royal (I hate rigging). What's your opinion of the model iktself?

jeffpez

Don

I don't know the answer to your question but just ordered the Zvezda kit because I need a break from the Soleil Royal (I hate rigging). What's your opinion of the model iktself?

I think it may be the nicest ship kit I have ever built!  The molding is exquisite.  There are spars and supports 30 to 40 mils in diameter with no flash or parting seams!  The sprue attachment points are so small a slight nick with the end of a #11 knife is enough to fix those.

I bought the fantastically extensive Pontos detailing set and find I am not going to use a number of the turned brass parts- the kit parts are so good and so much easier to use that I see no reason to use the brass.  It is as nice as Trumpeter kits I have bought for quite a bit more money.

I thought the Soleil Royale kit was the top kit until I started building the Dreadnought. The SR is still unfinished.  Rigging tires me out so I only work for awhile on that kit and put it away while I work on other things. Am working on the spritsail mast- going from front to rear so I still have a lot of rigging yet to do!

I love the SR for many reasons but particularly the colors. I used a royal blue and the gold next to it is wonderful. I actually find myself staring at it sometimes. Thinking of colors, I picked up the Dreadnought from my local dealer today (gotta keep him in business) and in looking at the instructions noticed a color call out for number 54 but it doesn't appear on the paint list. I assume you've figured out what the actual color is so could you tell me? I found your comments on the PE set interesting. Considering your experience with the Pontos set would you suggest using the White Ensign product instead? It also isn't cheap but is less than the Pontos. Thanks for your input.

jeffpez

I love the SR for many reasons but particularly the colors. I used a royal blue and the gold next to it is wonderful. I actually find myself staring at it sometimes. Thinking of colors, I picked up the Dreadnought from my local dealer today (gotta keep him in business) and in looking at the instructions noticed a color call out for number 54 but it doesn't appear on the paint list. I assume you've figured out what the actual color is so could you tell me? I found your comments on the PE set interesting. Considering your experience with the Pontos set would you suggest using the White Ensign product instead? It also isn't cheap but is less than the Pontos. Thanks for your input.

I had asked the same question- someone else pointed out that the color is mentioned on box art.  He also converted to Testors color for me- the Light Ghost Gray.  Turns out it matches the molded styrene color EXACTLY!.

The Pontos set is not that much more than the WEM.  Does the WEM include the wood deck?  That is the neatest part of the set to me.

One thing missing on the PE is boat tackle.  I know that there are generic railings and ladders in 1:350 scale.  A fret of generic boat davit rigging would be another nice generic set that I personally would be happy to buy.  Other than that, the PE details of the Pontos set are overwhelming.  Biggest criticism is that the instructions are not good at all.  Only photos, and close to half of the PE is not shown at all.  The photos are color pics with anotation. The photos look great, but are not that  helpful  The anotation is hard to read because of poor color choice.  The photos do not show how to bend more complex parts, nor which piece is which on some photos.  Still, I figure I got my money's worth compared to other PE sets I bought.  The torpedo nets are really nice!

Thanks for the paint color. WEM does not have the wooden deck so I guess that settles that. As for boat tackle my hand is no longer steady enough and my eyes no longer clear enough to handle such a task. More power to you if you can.

jeffpez

 As for boat tackle my hand is no longer steady enough and my eyes no longer clear enough to handle such a task. More power to you if you can.

That is why I would like a PE set of boat tackles.  With one piece of PE per end of boat it would be no more work than the styrene rods the kit uses. I intend to make a little jig to make simple oval bend of wire with two ends, out of very fine wire (0.012).  Don't know if it will work, but I intend to give it a try.  Only a few boats are mounted with tackle- rest are stowed.  Lot of boats on that thing!

If the jig works please post a picture because I'd love to find a way to do it. I seem to recall a PE set that had something like you're looking for but I'm not sure. Something tells me it was for the Titanic but I'm less than certain. I bought everything I need to build the ship but then never did. Some day I'll pull out the box and check.