WORKING SHIPS

I hear you.  Part of the issue is aesthetics.  There seem to be two disparate reasons for building a model.  One views it as a piece of art.  My local art museum only has one model- a model ship- but that is enough to illustrate the idea that a model is a sculpture- a work of art.  Some folks feel that consequently, it should be built and finished in as artistic a manner as possible.  To me the epitomy of this are those wooden sailing ship kits planked with rare and exotic woods.  Folks often varnish these with transparent varnish to show off the beauty of the woods, even for a sailing ship whose hull was completely painted or coppered.

The other extreme are those who are trying to depict in miniature, as accurately as possible the appearance of the prototype.  These folks will weather a model very much if appropriate. It is not just ships. I have seen many airplanes and race cars painted with a high gloss finish, because they look prettier that way.  

I don't think we can dictate the reason for a modeler building a model a certain way.  Personally, I am of the "replica" crowd.  I weather, use dull or semi-gloss paints where appropriate.  But I recognize that other builders have other objectives.  They build their models to represent what the owners of the prototypes may have "wished" that the vehicle looked like :-)

TB

I guess the type of ship, era, and ship's function have a lot to do with a model's appearence.

 The biggest problem with "weathering" a model has to do with a reference point or how the model is presented to the viewer. For example if weathering a GEARING class destroyer, does the builder have a photograph of a particular unit of the class to base his weathering on? Or did the builder serve on such a vessel, familiar with all the "rust points" of the ship? Most folks enjoy ship modeling but never served on a ship. This doesn't mean they can't can't weather the model properly, but some type of reference to that PARTICULAR ship is needed to represent an accurate portrayal. One can't use a picture of a tramp steamer as a reference to detail a ARLEIGH BURKE. Different eras, different metals, different functions. Oh I know, the corrosive composition  of the sea never changes but ship construction does.

Another point to consider is the viewers perception of a model, ship, tank, or auto, etc as presented. A Sherman tank(a popular model at shows) depicted  in fresh paint displayed on a wood base looks great(if well done). Weather the tank with mud, rust, wear and tear without a display base or diorama setting and it looks, well, lost. The same applies to a ship. I attended a show in which a nicely weathered battleship(full hull) was just mounted on the kits plastic display stands and to me, the model looked out of place.  By the same token a pristine ship model in an "underway" diorama looks somewhat unrealistic with shiny new paint. Even coming out of the yards a ship has some minor, and I mean minor, wear and tear, usually the overboard discharges ports in the hull have discoloring or minor rust. But this is up to the builder and most guys while competent builders are hesitent to "muck up" their flawless paint job they spent hours on.  Plus if they choose to weather the model will it be accurate?

I'll go out on a limb here but most builders don't know how to weather a particular ship, even with references to guide them. Too much rust, not enough fading, what is the builder trying to relate to a viewer?  No builder wants to ruin a $200.00 ship model experimenting with "rusting up" the finish. I'm no expert on paint finishes or weathering techniques but if my model is "underway" it gets a little weathering, my reference is ships I know first hand or served on. If the model is displayed in a static way (glass case), the paint is pristine and "ship shape", at least for me.

One other thing which is a pet peeve of mine. If you are viewing a completed model of a ship I served on, don't open your soup cooler and remark "that ship should be weathered more"....it only indicates to me that your judgement regarding a ship's appearence is limited to your "land lubbers" world view of real world ships.....contest judges take note.

Mike M.  

I agree with the other responders..weathering your ship must be combined with a similar setting.  Just a rusty,weathers destroyer in its display stand does look out of place.  My idea on the subject is find an era or time span you with to depict your vessel in and go for it.  It's your model..you really only have to please yourself..(unless you are in competition).  I Iike to build replicating certain situations,,,like short sail..when you might be in a heavy sea, or heaving the mail yard when taking on cargo, using it as a deric to load cargo into the hold, or tarping down all the boats and cargo hatches, or running the davits outboard with line away and a gang suspended for the boats.  Tons of *working* situations can be modeled.  I am fond of red, brown, yellow and black india ink/alcohol sprays as routine weathering techniques.  :)

Rob

I can only speak about my own experience in the 1961-1966 Navy and serving on the Enterprise when she was the sixth fleet flagship; we no sooner entered an anchorage when the chiefs assigned every one a section to chip and paint. Good only knows how many hours the deck crews spent hanging in bosun chairs getting the hull ship shape and I know that we, as a flight deck crew, stripped and repainted the entire flight deck just about every port call.

 Of course being on a flag ship when she was new was all the more reason to keep everything looking 'new'. No idea what the 'modern' Navy is like but the Coast Guard ships docked near my home always look new.

  I do understand the wear and tear on the civilian ships; most anchored off Astoria look like they are ready to fall apart but most had just completed a trip from China or Korea and show the effects.

Hey NV..the Enterprise will be entering Bremerton Navy Shipyard for her break up shortly..........just to let you know.  I was stationed in Bremerton when the Mighty Mo was being refitted and I got to go on board and remove the dental units for a museum.......cool days.  She was surely weathered then.

 I was just aboard the Missouri in Pearl in November and she looks real good; very little rust inside or out. They are in the process of replacing her deck timbers and she should look very good when they are done.

  I plan to drive up to Bremerton when the Enterprise arrives; hope to snag a piece of her from the scrappers. I'm not a plank owner but do have a medallion cast from the props of the WW II Big E; it's the same as the large medallion mounted on my Enterprise's island. I got it from a plank owner who had no sense of history lol

Yeah...I picked up lots of little items from the Missouri.back in 85~86 when I went aboard her...I plan on snagging some trinkets from the Enterprise as well.

Anyway..back on track...here is a pic of the CS I am building and weathering to appear as she did during her Australian wool/wood trade days.

I have noticed from pictures that naval vessels show weathering mainly when they are in action a lot- that is, with a hot war going on.  The explanation I have heard was that there were always enough hands in a fighting ship to keep her shipshape as long as she was not in action a lot.  Only part of the crew was necessary to keep her afloat and moving- the rest were to fight.  But when doing a lot of fighting, there was less time for maintenance.  This does seem to be born out by the photos.  The photos I have seen of weathered naval vessels are mostly during wartime, and times of a lot of action.

This explanation says that civil ships are crewed with as few sailers as possible, to save costs- only enough to keep her sailing.  So some get to looking pretty sad.

Indeed...and the material the ship is made of counts as well.  I routinely build sailing ship models and all of my research tells and shows me that rounding the horn tor a ship up...leaving it look as if it was beaten with rod irons.  A famous tea trade captain once said, *She was built for hard work, and I'll make sure she does her duty*..referencing clippers.  The larger SouthEasterners(squarriggers), were a mighty tough breed of sailing ship and they looked like they put in the time.

I try to model the working ship in light of its labors....to me a model with action..be it lowered boat, or davit, or loading sail, or weathered appearance..makes the model come alive.

Rob(for me anyway)

HI :

  You are so right .When I did my " FLYING CLOUD " I tried to duplicate the ship as if she had just finished a trip .Many laughed , but , many asked if they were really that rough looking after a voyage.

         They also stated they didn't imagine the ocean could do that to something like a large ship .

Remember , the ships of today are a lot bigger !  I like the work . keep it up .  Tanker-builder

Agreed..the last 1.96 Sea Witch I built..I weathered it lightly...However..many are not familiar with the CS.s own rough period. I believe in weathering my ship models.....to some degree.

HI:

Well , you certainly are on track .I like what you've done. It seems subtle , but , believable .  Don't forget , though , the copper plating wasn't pure copper. It was a blend of two metals that weathered out to a coppery silver . When you add that into the equation ,you will have a real winner there .     Tanker-builder

Indeed..I have been experimenting with a green monomer, that I have deluted with alcohol and will test spray it on some copper..before I mask and spray it on the hull.  I want some oxidization in the cracks and seams more then I do on all the surfaces of the copper plate.  It is less distracting, but still convincing.   Thanks for your fine comments and compliments.  I do have weathering on the copper....just not the green oxidizing one would expect.

Rob

tankerbuilder

HI:

Well , you certainly are on track .I like what you've done. It seems subtle , but , believable .  Don't forget , though , the copper plating wasn't pure copper. It was a blend of two metals that weathered out to a coppery silver . When you add that into the equation ,you will have a real winner there .     Tanker-builder

When it oxidizes it turns dark brown. There's no green at all.

Precisely why I am minimizing the green oxide to more of the brown I already have weathered it with.  My closeup images of the CS's hull does show some slight greening(Due to the 60% copper present)...but as you said, NOT like what one would expect from copper sheathing.   Thanks for pointing that little know fact out.....:) I for one appreciate it.

Rob

My impression is that both copper and bronze and various similar alloys weather differently in air than they do in water.  So one has to decide if ship model represents ship still in water, or in drydock :-)

True fact.    

what do you know about ships anyway!!  HE-HE-HE, talk at ya later, Sir.

This is true and once a metal has been introduced to sea water the oxidization has begun...if it has been a virgin to sea water and only introduced to air it will indeed oxidize differently...but hey..we can only do the best we can with what we got and what we want our models to look like.....irregardless to reality.  However the purist will rarely stray away from reality.

Further research does reveal your point and I will make the changes...note the slight green areas as well....over the brown shade.   good observation.

I think the choice to either weather the ship or leave it looking pristine should be left up to the builder.  Their model, their choice.

I have spent my whole life around working ships; draggers, trawlers as a teenager and then worked as a marine engineer on oil tankers after four years at the maritime academy.  I finished my marine engineering career inspecting ships for the US Navy.  Because of this I was very fortunate to spend a lot of time around many different types of vessels,each weathered to a different degree.

However, when I build ship models, I like to make them look like the "builders models" that I would see at the ship yards and company offices.  For me, I appreciate the form and details of beautiful ships and I don't want the weathering to take away from that.  Although I do have an appreciation to those modelers that can weather a vessel realistically.

Just my two cents.

Cheers,

Wayne

Good point and well executed......Here is a fully weathered CS in drydock.......is it not worthy of replication?

That would definitely be worth trying to duplicate.  I don't think I could do it justice.

My next project will be converting another CS model to be the Ferreira...and what weathering fun will I have then...talk about a working ship..here is a picture of the ship during those days.

WOW !

   Now that is weathered ! Many would think ,if it was not getting ready , or had just returned from a voyage , that it was derelict ! I haven't seen any  models weathered that much .

   That would NOT be appropriate for a ship on a beautiful brass stand .That's a diorama waiting to happen. Are you gonna do it ? I will await your futhure work . Tanker-builder

I have built many train dioramas and this one would be sweet...we never see one of the Cutty cut down.

Rob

Don't forget to include that picture with the display.  Otherwise, you'll be accused of overdoing it, I'm sure.

Gene Beaird,

Pearland, Texas

Indeed....if anyone is familiar with the Ferreira..they might have a clue that the Portuguese worked her hard and maintained her little...but your idea is a good one........Thanks.

Rob