Overwhelmed! What is the best wood kit for a new ship modeler.

Astro-

Good luck with whatever you choose to build!  And please consider starting a Work In Progress build thread of your project...it's great fun to share in your adventure!  I think you'll find posting pics and discussing the steps as you proceed to be very helpful if you want advice....plus, you might inspire me to break out one of my wooden kits!

Well there's good advice here, but mine is to start by scratchbuilding one. Pick something that looks fun and cute and you can find some pictures of. Carve and sand the hull out of a block of wood, some dowels and away you go. Seriously. It'll save you a ton of money and you'll avoid that trap of feeling like a bum because you "didn't do justice" to the $ 100 or so you spent. Keep it simple, experiment with planking the deck.

Most wooden kits take so much work that at times you hit that "this would have been easier to make" point eventually.

Well, I am feeling less overwhelmed.  I really like the Model Shipways Phantom Pilot.  While it is more expensive off the start than say...a canoe, it ultimately is free if you buy your next model from them.  Plus it comes with tools :)  plus a guarantee :) plus finishing supplies :)  

The Phantom also "Includes light, medium & heavy duty knives with 15 blades, four gouges, pin vise with six number drills, two needle files, aluminum miter box with razor saw, tweezers, awl, flush cutter, plus wooden sanding block and wedge." I am guessing that is enough to start? I know you all have jigs and gadgets and hootinanies and other gizmos for helping you build your models. But I am not ready for anything but the basics to finish a well crafted kit.

Yes Bill, I will email you.  My research and book library includes one back issue of FSM. Thats it. No more. So I have a library to build as well.

Real people are so much more helpfull than simply Googleing. Thanks again fellas.

Also, there is an interesting article in the Bluejacket newsletter about the European plank-on-bulkhead kits and some of their pitfalls.  If you want a copy, send me your email address.

Bill

model shipways used to have a full page ad  in magazines. buy the solid hill phantom pilot boat and you get basic tools plud, if finished in 6 months send in a picture and get complete credit towrd next kit. i believe it's solid hull. also the big picket boat is nice. plank on frame but  big pieces. 2 guys in my club have built it and i have one in the stash.

Take a look at the BlueJacket Shipcrafters online catalog  http://www.bluejacketinc.com   They offer a wide range of traditional wooden kits in a variety of skill levels.  Their range includes powered vessels as well as sail.  The "Skill Builder" series of kits come with paint, tools, etc., and are geared for the beginning wooden ship modeler.  This series includes the Optimist Dinghy, Yankee Hero (a single masted fishing sloop from the late 1800s), and Red Baron (a Holland 32 lobster boat).

Al Ross  

decision. :)

Thanks guys!  I wll try to comment to everybody.

1. Tim. I expected differing ideas but I am glad to get ideas from men who have gone through the learning curve. You also said not to buy a kit that would overwhelm.  Yes yes... My tendency would be to by the largest most complicated kit I could find.  I think the results would of that would not be a pretty sight. So I must keep it simple. Thank you.

2. Don, I would be happy building a canoe to start with. Simplicity in construction is important.

3. Dave, as much as I am certain there are great plastic kits, I am convinced I want to do wood. You also made an observation that is important to me.  Customer service. Since I am convinced many mistakes are forthcomming,  I am looking for a kit builder who understands that.

4. CapnMac, controlling "fiddly bits" is critical. I like fiddly bits but not the first couple of models.

5. Bill, et. al. Model Shipways came up many times in my search and seemed a good choice.  I am glad you are validating them.

6. The time to complete the model is not so critical.  I think the process of building seems the most enjoyable, not so much having the completed item.  I would be the guy on the news who spent 20 years building and giant rabbit out of only matchsticks or something.

7. Finaly, my wife is kind enough to support this so I want to be good shepherd of her faith in me and the money I would spend on this hobby. So I am grateful for your help. I will let you know my

I have to agree with the recommendations made above to either start with a Midwest kit or one of the beginner's kits from Model Shipways.  For example, the Midwest models are of very simple wood boats while the MS kits are of simple, solid-hull schooners. The Phantom was recommended above; I would also recommend the Sultana, which is a very beautiful model. Either way, good luck and I hope you enjoy the build!

Bill

I fear that we've done exactly what Astrogopher1 didn't want us to do: given him a ton of choices! Ha! Well, if nothing else, we modelers are full of opinions.

Don, that's another excellent suggestion. Again, starting simple and getting used to the medium.

Astro, I hope we've helped you chart a course.

I would strongly suggest starting with a kit from Midwest (same folks who provide balsa and basswood to hobby shops).  While their kits are not the sexiest (no ship of line, big frigates or clippers) the kits are superb for novice wooden ship modelers.  For instance, with most European (and even MS) kits you need to cut the planks to shape yourself.  Midwest planks are die-cut.  Instruction booklet has photos and lots of pages for real step-by-step.

Some of their kits are little rowboats and such, but they do have schooners and sloops.  Oh, and they also provide jigs for hull construction.

If the kit makers really cared about "us," the buying public, they ought to have a generic Hoy, or a cutter.  A nice, elegant single mast.  Preferably in a largish scale--3/16 or 1/4" = a foot (1:64 or 1:48 scale).

Both a cutter and a hoy have every detail a lager, multi-masted ship would have (well, except stern galleries and the like).  Hoys were cargo vessels that when from dockside to shipside.  Water hoys carried barrels,, kegs, ponies, tunns and the like out to the ships to be loaded as stores.  Others carried ballast.  Could quite legitimately pile a selection of naval guns aboard one, too.  

Some cool rigging, too.  Almost all spars were set 'flying' so they could be struck next to a larger vessel.  Often the mast was heavily rigged for shrouds, the mast being used as a king post for a derrick spar..  The anchor hoy had a custom derrick in the bow to take huge bower anchors out to large combatants.  They would have the hawsers flaked out aft to balance the load (or some tunns of water, or perhaps a 32 pounder or the like.

Would be excellent kits, in either wood or plastic.  Even the "fiddly bits" would be controlable--you'd scarcely need more than a dozen  belaying pins; two dozen deadeyes (or half stropped; half plain).  probably a dozen blocks in 3 or 4 sizes would suffice, too.  And, it would be an excellent use for those big treble blocks, too.

The main thing is not to buy a kit that will overwhelm you. Yeah, you may be an adult, but if you haven't been building wooden ships for years, going in and building the Rattlesnake is setting your expectations too high.

I suggest starting with something small and easy that you can learn the basics on. Such as the 1/25 scale Corel sloop or Skipjack sloop. Then I would suggest moving up to maybe one of Model Expo's all-inclusive packages, such as The Phantom. Model Expo often changes this deal, so it may be a different model later on. 

When modeling, I'm usually very philosophical about the time it takes for a project to get done. It takes the time it takes, and it can't take any less time than it does. However, if you're putting in regular hours, I think you'll find that you could probably do all three of these kits in the next year to 18 months. Start small  though. Get comfortable with medium, and then move up. 

Also, I can't recommend enough Biddlecombe's "The Art of Rigging," Mansir's "How to Build Ship Models: A Beginners Guide," and Peterson's "Rigging Period Ship Models." Also, Mastini's "Ship Modeling Simplified" is a useful resource too. I think those three books will are a good start to your ship-modeling library (you may have to search around a little to find them; not sure if they're all in print still). Once you've been modeling ships and are ready to take on ships-of-the-line, then start looking into Goodwin and Marquardt.

Tim

Welcome to ship-modeling, Mark!

I'm sure you will hear from more experienced folks than me on this subject, but I have gleaned a few important notes during my time so far:

Firstly, I haven't yet built a wooden ship kit, though I have a couple of them in the stash now.  You may want to consider the possible merits of a plastic kit?  There are some very,very good plastic kits available, and with the right finishing techniques, they can look very *wood-like*, without the hassle of having to scratchbuild every tiny minute detail!   :)  You mentioned a *complete* kit...unfortunately, the wooden ship kits I know of are little more than a box of lumber, line, fittings, and plans...you will be doing a LOT of scratchbuilding!

However, if you are determined to get into wood-building right off the bat, I would strongly recommend going after a kit made by Model Shipways.  They are known as one of the best domestic kit manufacturers, in terms of parts quality, clear instructions (very important!), and also customer service.  go to the website www.modelexpo-online.com

you will find a vast selection of kits for beginners. And pay no mind to their retail prices listed.  They ALWAYS have an "offer code" in effect that slashes their prices.  Right now the code is SWEET13, but it changes every few weeks.  You can find the current code pretty easily (especially if you join their email list!)...

They even have *build for free* kits (I think the Phantom is part of that promotion?)....in which case you buy the kit, build it within 6 months, and send them pictures of your finished effort.  They will then credit you for the cost of the kit toward you next purchase!  They're really nice people, too...you can call them with questions about builds, free replacement parts, tools, whatever....

Anyway, you can probably find a decent kit for beginners for less than 100 bucks, but you will find that you'll need a handful of tools to get it done properly.

I can think of two pieces of advice right now:  Get a couple of books on wooden ship modeling (there are plenty of good ones), and try to avoid the uber-expensive, albeit sweet-looking, kits from the overseas manufacturers...at least until you have gotten a few wooden kits under your belt...I have a Corel Berlin 1;40 wooden ship kit, and the instructions are terribly translated from Italian, to the point where it reads like so much jibberish!  On the other hand, I have a Katy of Norfolk from Model Expo, and the plans and 24-page instruction guide are clear and concise!

Also, you probably want to go for a solid hull kit for your first foray....Planking a model for your first time might be a lot to try and conquer....Lots of people start shipmodeling by jumping into a kit that's beyond what they expect it to be, an abandon it after being overwhelmed, or after making a disastrous mistake in the process...When I decided to approach ship modeling, I thought that building with wood was where I wanted to go, but I have found a lot of satisfaction in good quality plastic kits...but there are also tons of crappy plastic kits!  Learn a lot before you decide what you want...

Seems like I have a lot of advice for a guy who hasn't even built a wooden kit yet, eh?  There's a reason I'm waiting to move on to wood.  But believe me, I have several books on the subject, and I am learning a lot all the time....but meanwhile, I also have a decent number of plastic kits that I'm very excited about building in the meantime, so I guess I'm in no real hurry to move on just yet...

Lastly, you'll find a lot of friendly and helpful people on this forum, who are very generous with their knowledge...if not for them, I surely wouldn't have pursued ship modeling this far!

There I go, rambling again!  Sorry!  And good luck!  It's a blast!

Dave