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Any thoughts on Silkspan replacement?

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  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Friday, December 20, 2013 9:34 AM

The reddish brown sails were certainly used on many Great Lakes sailing vessels.  I am modeling a Lakes Schooner that photos show with dark sails, and have another photo (recent) of a reconstructed schooner with reddish brown sails.  I hope the builder researched the color well, as I am using that photo to look for material at the craft store for my sails for the model.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Thursday, December 19, 2013 11:21 AM

On the basis of photos, paintings, and actual ships, it's pretty clear that sail colors varied a great deal from time to time and from place to place.  The fabric used had a lot to do with it; so did the age of the fabric.

That's why I like to paint the material I'm using for furled sails:  I can control the color.  I usually find I'm happiest with a slightly beige-ish grey - about like dear old PollyScale "aged concrete."  On the other hand, if I were working on a model of a modern ship I'd make the sails almost white - like the modern synthetics that are usually used for the purpose.

There are also plenty of examples of sails that were/are dyed - such as the brown sails of lots of European fishing and trading craft.  I think they used a substance called "tanbark" to dye them.  I'm honestly not sure why - other than tradition.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Thursday, December 19, 2013 8:34 AM

Hope I am not straying too far from the OP, but have been wondering lately about sail colors.  I once read that only American ships had white sails. In most other countries the sails were linen-colored, a more tan-like color. I have also seen a number of photos of mid to late 19th century where the sails look quite dark- darker than linen.  Anyone have an good references on sail materials and colors?  Fortunately, either model airplane covering tissue or thin material at sewing stores are available in lots of colors.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Wednesday, December 18, 2013 2:43 PM
This is going to be a tiny bit gross, but I think I may have found a silkspan replacement - completely by accident.

We're getting the house ready for several visits by the three youngest grand kids (who charge through like a herd of angry beavers) and the four granddogs. The latter need some special preparations, so I paid a visit to the local PetSmart. I bought, for about $10.00, a package of Nature's Miracle puppy training pads.

Each of these things is a 23"x24" sheet in thee layers. The bottom one is waterproof plastic; the middle one is some sort of absorbent, deodorizing stuff. And the top layer is a tough, almost transparent substance that looks remarkably like super-fine silkspan.

I haven't tried it yet, but it looks to me like this stuff, subjected to my old favorite "acrylic and Elmer's" trick, would make great furled sails.

One never knows....Thank you Pebbles, Samantha, Snoopy, and Booboo.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Tuesday, December 17, 2013 9:02 AM

I should have also mentioned actual model airplane covering fabric.  We used to call it silk- I am sure it is synthetic but is a very thin, lightweight material, and I have used it for model ship sails in the past.  It is as good as anything you can get in a fabric store, other than the limitation that most of it comes only in white. If you want other than white sails you are better at the fabric store.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    February 2015
Posted by Bick on Tuesday, December 17, 2013 7:46 AM

EasyBuilt Models stll list silkspan in their catalog - $8,99 for 10ft  by 17.5" roll. Check HERE

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Monday, December 16, 2013 8:41 PM

One more material that might suffice is slikscreen material, which is often sold in arts & crafts stores.  To be exact, this is the material that goes in the frame to support the printing template.

One of the things that material was excellent for printing flags

It's a bit cheese-cloth airy getting up above 1/72 scale or so.

I'll have to see if i have scraps of both materials and compare them.

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Monday, December 16, 2013 2:46 PM

We'll, I just had a phone call from Bluejacket. Seems I got the last three sheets of silkspan. The nice lady says she's also sending me a sheet of another kind of paper that BJ is going to use as a replacement. I'm anxious to see what it's like.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    December 2010
  • From: Salem, Oregon
Posted by 1943Mike on Monday, December 16, 2013 11:16 AM

Thanks to all three of you for the input/information.

I have used some of my old handkerchiefs in the past for the "canvas" covers on the lifeboats of my Cutty Sark. However, I figured that, with the size of the sails I'll be representing on either the Revell Yacht America (I also won a version of that ship as the "Civil War Blockader" on eBay the other day Smile), or the Pyro kit I mentioned above, I might need more square inches than just one or two old hankies would provide.

I just ordered 5 sheets of SilkSpan from Bluejacket so I think I'll be fine for whichever kit I want to show with furled sails. Thank you John for mentioning that they still had the stuff!

Mike

P.S. I just called BlueJacket and the nice lady who answered the phone told me they do have SilkSpan in stock.

Mike

"Le temps est un grand maître, mais malheureusement, il tue tous ses élèves."

Hector Berlioz

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Monday, December 16, 2013 10:49 AM

The disappearance of silkspan was news to me.  I did some digging on the web; apparently it's creating a crisis in the flying model airplane world.  K&S, which apparently supplied the stuff for most "stick and tissue" airplane kits, has quit selling it, and says it's "no longer being manufactured."

Bluejacket still lists it on its website.  I just sent an e-mail to BJ, asking if it has a good stock of it left.  If so, I want to stock up.  

I've never found a material that quite matches silkspan for furled sails - at least for the tricks I use (painting it with a mixture of acrylic paint and white glue, letting it dry, then touching it with a water-dampened brush to soften it for the actual furling process).  Ordinary tissue paper tends to disintegrate when wet under the rigors of furling.  And there just isn't a fabric that's thin enough for furled sails on anything but the larger scales.  (I did try some genuine silk, which is sold to RC airplane modelers, once, but I didn't like it much.)  

I can suggest three possible sources of stuff that certainly looks and acts like silkspan - though I have no idea how long they'll be available.

1.  Lens tissue, from a camera store.  This stuff is extremely thin, and works well.  (I used it for some of the sails on my model of the frigate Hancock.)  The drawback, obviously, is that it only comes in quite small sheets.  On the other hand, a package of lens tissue will last a long time - and doesn't cost much.

2.  A few months back I bought a nice little HO-scale Skipjack kit from a now-defunct company called Maritime Art.  The material supplied for the sails is, of all things, a coffee filter.  It seems to be mighty similar to silkspan, though maybe just a tad stiffer.  I haven't built the kit yet, but it looks to me like the coffee filter should work just fine.

3.  Arts and crafts stores (like Michael's and A.C. Moore's) sell a big variety of papers by the sheet.  One of them is "rice paper."  It has a weight and texture about like silkspan's, though the fiber structure of it is a lot more visible.  I haven't tried this one either, but it looks like it might work.

I suspect the airplane model firms will come up with a substitute.  Till then, I've got enough lens tissue on hand to last me for a while.  I also intend to order some Bluejacket, if the firm still has some.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Lyons Colorado, USA
Posted by Ray Marotta on Monday, December 16, 2013 10:00 AM

Take a look around a fabric store for fine cotton or linen.  Even good quality handkerchiefs can be used...

Ray

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  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Monday, December 16, 2013 8:23 AM

Silkspan was just one form of covering tissue.  There are others still available.  What we used to call "Jap tissue" is still widely available at many hobby shops. If no luck there, there is a cottage industry in stuff for free-flight flying models with good presence on web.  Do a google search on free-flight models.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    December 2010
  • From: Salem, Oregon
Any thoughts on Silkspan replacement?
Posted by 1943Mike on Sunday, December 15, 2013 8:53 PM

I'm thinking about adding furled sails to one or two of the schooners I have in my stash. I looked around for a while on the 'net and it seems that Silkspan is no longer available. Does anyone have any idea of what material would be good for let's say the Revell Yacht America, or the Pyro Gertrude L. Thebaud?

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

Mike

Mike

"Le temps est un grand maître, mais malheureusement, il tue tous ses élèves."

Hector Berlioz

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