Trumpeter 1/350 HMS Dreadnought - 1915 fit - questions

Thanks Marcus,

Mike

Sometimes the glue at the edges will not hold the deck in place and some additional glue applied by you made be needed.  

I have read many remarks on-line about these decks peeling back after a while.

GMorrison,

I'm not quite sure what you mean when you say "do not attempt to make the glue hold it down". The Artwox wood deck is a peel-off self-glued set. Do you mean that one should add his/her own glue to the glue that's already applied to the deck after stripping off the backing?

Mike

MMcB is correct. Those things never fit right and they can't be fixed if they buckle.

Trimming will be required do not attempt to make the glue hold it down.

IF you paint it keep the paint as dry as possible so it doesn't warp.

Make sure to dry fit before attaching  it to the model.  You won't be able to peel it off and start again.

Man, my old brain is losing its memory banks rather quickly. On the first page of this thread I wrote: " I'll not be doing a wood deck on this one (I do have wood decks for the Varyag, Mikasa, and Emden - for down the road)".

Well, guess what, I opened a drawer to one of my plastic storage cabinets in my hobby room/office just a few minutes ago and discovered that I HAD ordered and received an Artwox wood deck for my 1915 version of the Dreadnought! My how forgetfull I've become in the last few years .

So, I guess I'll attempt to use it along with the WEM PE I bought for it.

I'm still waiting on the paints I bought last Saturday from Hobbylinc before I start anything.

I won't be posting a WIP since I don't feel comfortable enough yet in this hobby to do so. I will, from time-to-time, post images relating to where I am in this build - probably long after I've made whatever corrections/fixed any mistakes that I've caught and of which I feel confident enough to share.

Now that I'm going to use the wood deck, are there any suggestions regarding its attachment? GMorrison had reminded me to drill holes in the deck for any lines that need be attached to it such as the stays for the smoke stacks/funnels. On pp. 158, 195 197, and 205 in the Roberts book there are several drawings showing approximately where the stays for the funnels go. I say approximately since none of those drawing covers all the lines of both stacks but I guess it's close enough. I'll look at them again more closely when I am ready to drill the holes in the deck and I should be able to figure out fairly closely where each stay attaches. Are there more lines of the superstructure rigging about which I need be concerned? It would be great if there were a plan view of all the rigging lines and where they attach.

Mike 

GMorrison,

Thanks for your "major plastic hacking" technique! I'll definitely use that should I opt for a waterline model that requires it.

Between my short (2 to 5 mile) walks in the large park here in Salem, OR and plastic kit modeling I should be back to hiking in a few months (provided the lymphedema in my right leg doesn't balloon out of control)  

I have decided to go ahead with the Dreadnought and not, at this time, build another aircraft. I think I'll probably alternate between those two build subjects. I'll be building my favorites first given that we all are here but for a limited time and I want my time to be as enjoyable as possible - that is the next 18 years or so .

Mike

BTW my oncologist back when told me that plastic model building is good for your immune system!

Happy modeling!

I don't like using dremel on plastic. At the least you need slow speed control.

Whenever I do major plastic hacking. I mask off the area to be removed and then paint the exposed part a contrasting color to the plastic, like black.

Remove the tape and make a cut with a good 1/16" of unpainted plastic left.

Tape down some 100 grit on a smooth table top and sand sand sand until the unpainted plastic is gone.

Also drill holes in the deck for lines that attach to it, like stack stays.

Steve and John,

Thanks for your concern. I'll be fine.

As John mentions the advances in the medical field are now accelerating at an exciting clip. The articles I've perused in the Times (NYTimes) have mentioned experimental trials boosting a patient's own immune system to deliver a knock out punch to the specific cancer targeted. The trials seem to going well. Another generation and, I believe, many types of cancer will be curable. See:http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/09/health/doctors-use-patients-immune-cells-to-shrink-cancer-tumors.html?module=Search&mabReward=relbias%3Ar%2C%5B%22RI%3A6%22%2C%22RI%3A15%22%5D

Steve, that idea of using the full hull but buried in some thicker substrate of the base is one that I'll consider using. Thanks for that idea.

Mike

Mike, I wish you the best of health and a quick, effective end to the chemo and radiation treatments.  Such things have made huge leaps forward in the past ten or twenty years.  My dad had to go through radiation and it did nothing for him accept make him miserable.  (He had advanced lung cancer, and they caught it too late.  He passed away in 1990.)  On the other hand, the wife of a good friend of mine has been going through chemo in big chunks for what seems like at least ten years now.  At her last several checkups she's been pronounced clean.  Trust the medics, and be grateful you weren't born fifty years earlier.

Again, best wishes for a smooth, quick recovery.

Mike,

I'm sorry to hear about your rad and chemo therapy, I know how much it can kick you in the tush. Hope everything turns out okay.

On the waterline method, I know I have come across a WIP somewhere and if I can find it I"ll get you the link.  Another option that does not require cutting into the hull, is putting the hull in say a styrofoam base and then creating your water around the ship.  I have seen some nice examples, especially Kostas' builds.  Just an idea.  Please post your pics when you start the build, I look forward to it.

Steve

Thanks for the reminder about the drilling of any needed holes in the hull for display. I'm actually toying with the idea of building another waterline model ("toying" is the operating word - I'm not that confident in my Dremelling of the waterline - to be resolved in the next few weeks) since when I built the Dragon 1/350 USS Buchanan as the Duncan on her way to the Battle of Cape Esperance, I had an easy time deciding about the waterline - the kit gives you both options. This kit OTOH, does not. Since I don't want to screw it up I'll have to think about it for a while.

My strength and stamina is kind of sapped these days for the next 4 weeks since I'm undergoing both ratiation and chemotherapy for a chunk of cancer that was removed from my thigh back in March. All this energy sapping stuff should be over by the end of the second week in July so I'll have made any building decisions by that time. (My surgeon thinks that he got everything, a recent PET scan has come up negative, so I should be back in stride within a month or so).

Anyone have tips on how to go about cutting off the hull at the waterline? I suppose just carefully marking the waterline where the pictures show it and using one of my Dremel cutting wheels is the SOP? My only other concern is to be able to figure out where the waterline is. There's a raised line that goes completely from bow to stern well below the double raised lines that are below the aft portholes but I think it's too low to be the waterline. At least based on the pictures of the paint scheme provided in color in the kit it seems to be too low. Oh well, some more studying of the pictures in the book may help.  

Mike

Mike

Before you glue down the deck don't' forget to drill any  holes you may need for  display supports or glue in nuts/whatever.

Steve,

Thanks for clearing that up.

You'll note that on page 89 of the Roberts book the shields are shown with dotted lines, presumably because they were removable. On page 91, the 1915 fit, there are no 12 lb. guns on #1 turret at all. That's the way my kit is made. The box art, however, must be generic for both kits since they're shown on it. Other differences between 1907 and June of 1915 seem to have been taken into account in my kit (I'm not positive on that - I haven't yet done a complete inspection of all the kit's instructions/drawings) such as the two (rather than one) 6 and/or 12 lb. guns abaft the rear turret of the 1915 fit and the differences in the rigging/masts.

Mike

Mike,

I made a mistake, it was actually the number 1 (A) turret and on the quarterdeck (pg.88). The shields are somewhat along the side and in back of the 12pounders.  They were removable and you can see them in the picture on pg. 62 and also on the bottom photos on pg. 60 and 61.  If you look at the box art it does show them on the number 1 (A) turret.  Sorry for the confusion and hopefully this clears it up.  It looks like the screens were installed in about 1907 (pg. 51 & pg. 88) and removed in June 1915 (pg.90)

Steve

Steve,

I've looked in the John Roberts book pp. 229 - 235 inclusive and can't find any blast shields drawn on the 12lb. guns. I also looked at the photos in that book and really can't find any there either. Of course some of the photos are not of the 1915 refit nor do all the photos show the 12 lb guns on the turret to which you've referred. Is there a source for your information other than the box art? The box art on my kit does not show the 12 lb. guns clearly enough for me to tell whether or not they in fact do have blast shields - perhaps because of my lack of weapons' knowledge, I just can't tell.

Mike

Yes, that is correct.  

Marcus,

Your Dreadnought is looking great! What color are you using for the hull, Vallejo Dark Gray 994?

Steve

Marcus,

Thanks for the pictures! It really helps me to see how you're doing what you described above.

BTW, I am having second thoughts about buying replacement 12" and 12lb. guns. Yours look really nice!

Mike

Mike,

Here is a some of what I have done. 

I still to make some touch ups around the propeller shafts and then coat the hull with Future.

Turrets are ready for priming and painting.

I used the Artwox deck for this piece because the planking is so narrow it would have been really hare or impossible to add detail to a painted deck.

This is a coat of Sandy Brown over Buff and the first set of masking tape over the random planks.  All paint used on the deck are either Vallejo Model Color or Vallejo Air Color.

This with masking tape removed after a coat of Buff, White and Black.

A dusting of white as the final coat before covering the deck with Future in preparation of the aging wash which should (hoping) bring out alot of detail.

Primer on the stacks.  Those grates at the top were really hard, the PE is very thin and will break just staring at it to hard

Some of the PE for the main mast.  Found it easier to assemble while hanging upside down.

I have much more done on the little stuff that goes on the deck and will be primed tonight.  Will be taking a 10 day break starting Friday, heading to the College World Series in Omaha. Will add the wash to the decks then.

Marcus

GMorrison,

Thanks for sharing your deck painting technique. It sounds really interesting and I'll have to try it on some scrap styrene and see what kind of results I get. I'm sure there are other interesting techniques for painting 1/350 scale decks but yours is one, along with Marcus', that you've shared for which I'm grateful.

Mike

I don't like wooden decks either.

I have had success painting with a toothpick.

I paint the lightest base color with a spray, and then put out four or five blotches of darker tan on a smooth palette like a piece of glass.

In my left hand I hold a little chunk of something square and heavy like the 1" x 2" anvil from my punch set . I dip the point of the toothpick in my right hand into a color and draw a line about 30' scale feet long on the deck using the metal block as a rest. Practice a little and you'll avoid any blobs etc. Do a bunch in one color, toss the 'pick and do a bunch more in another color.

At the end I lightly overspray a diluted warm grey like light gull gray to soften it. looks really good to me.

Marcus,

Do you have any pictures yet of your WIP?

Mike

I am building the Trumpeter 1907 version now, also using the Eduard PE sets.  I didn't like the Artwok wooden deck at all, found it to thick so I am painting the deck.  I am using a technique I saw on you-tube using .75mm masking tape and five layers of different colors.  I just put on a coat of future in preparation of adding a aging wash.

I did replace the barrels of the 12 pounders and they came out very nice.  Also replaced the main guns but had to build a mount inside the turrets.  The turrets look great with the PE kit installed, the ladders between the barrels was a little tricky.

I am in the process of assembly and pre-painting as much as possible.

I will be building the SMS Konig for the WWI group build.  

Steve,

Thank you! That helps quite a bit .

I plan to build this kit OOB with the exception of adding some of the PE I bought. I'll not be doing a wood deck on this one (I do have wood decks for the Varyag, Mikasa, and Emden - for down the road) but I'm grateful for the tips on the order of attaching the decks and the problem with the hawse holes.

Thanks again,

Mike 

Mike,

I have the Trumpeter 1/350 scale 1907 version that I plan on starting at the end of July for the WWI group build.  I have the Roberts' book as well as the Kagero 3D book for reference.  I know that the navigation bridge is a bit smaller on the 1915 version as well as the main(rear) mast has been cut down to the spotting platform.  Also, there should be blast shields behind the 12 pounders on number 2 turret which are shown in the box top but I haven't seen it in the directions.  Something to scratch build I guess.

Some of the other issues I am aware of is the hawse holes do not connect to the deck holes.  I have seen builds where the builder used putty and then drilled it out to fit the chains through. I figure I will do the same.  Make sure you do not follow the directions and build everything above deck and then attach that to the hull as one of the final steps.  Glue the decks on right after you glue the hull halves together.

If you use the blast-bags you will not be able to elevate the main guns.

I purchased the Eduard PE detail set and railing set.  The Artwok wooden decks, and Master Model metal barrels for both the main and secondary guns.  I also found that North Star Models makes resin and PE replacement 12 pounders which are absolutely gorgeous.  I plan on using them with the metal barrels.  Metal replacement chains for the anchors which are 21 links per inch that I picked up from EvilBay.

I have been researching the colors for the beginning of the war and will paint accordingly.

Don't know if any of this helps but I look forward to seeing the build.

Steve