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Bluenose by Scientific

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  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Bluenose by Scientific
Posted by fright on Friday, January 13, 2017 12:39 PM

I picked up this kit at a garage sale and this would be my 1st attempt at a wooden model. A few of the wood strips were missing. After looking at plans, I picked up some 1/16" basswood sheets and cut out my bulwarks. I soaked them in hot water and bent them into shape. Now I'm totally lost on how I go about attaching them with wood glue to the deck of ship. I cannot figure out how to clamp them in place while glue sets up. ANY SUGGESTIONS on how to go about this would be greatly appreciated! Confused Here's a pic of what I'm looking at:

Robert O

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Friday, January 13, 2017 1:00 PM

One method I used to use on those kits was to use straight pins inserted into the deck as braces for the single piece bulwark, then tape the bulwark down until the glue dried.  You could also use white "Tacky Glue" instead of plain white glue.  Good luck!

Bill

  • Member since
    May, 2009
  • From: Poland
Posted by Pawel on Friday, January 13, 2017 1:21 PM

Hello!

First thing would be to bend the bulwarks to shape as close as it gets. Apart of water you can use some heat while bending. As for clamps/pins - drops of CA glue can take over this work. White glue works quite well with CA as combo - where you put white glue on the whole surface to be glued and small drops of CA work as nails to hold the part in place until the white glue dries. Hope it helps, good luck with your builds

PaweĊ‚

All comments and critique welcomed. Thanks for your honest opinions!

www.vietnam.net.pl

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Friday, January 13, 2017 1:26 PM

Bill - thanks for the fast reply. I've got lots of clamps/clothspins but nothing to anchor them to. I guess I'm on my way to a craft store to pick up straight pins! Once I can get the bulwarks glued in place, I plan on adding upright stays along them - either with wood or styrene strips. I imagine I would then drill in scupper holes. I'm a bit lost at reading the diagram provided with this kit. They also seem to skip over many of the part list descriptions. Thanks again for pointing me in the right direction! Hmm

Robert O

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Friday, January 13, 2017 1:30 PM
Thanks Pawel for your advice! The bending of my bulwarks are almost spot-on in shape of hull, but still require a little something to anchor them while drying. I'll try a glue & ca mix. Thanks for replying!

Robert O

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Friday, January 13, 2017 2:05 PM

This is what I've done so far with this kit. The deck was already glued on by previous owner and cut uneven. I will use a small wood strip to cover this up. I cut out and installed the two pieces of keel and glued them to the bottom of one piece hull. I used Elmer's Balsa wood color putty to fill in seams and cracks on hull. Sanded and used white primer; sanded againn. Stained deck with Cabot's water-based Autumn Glow finish. (I know this is not an accurate color but I had this laying around). Cut out the rudder and it fits snuggly to hull (taped in place). I plan to use strips of copper for hinges on rudder/hull instead of pieces of tape as suggested. 

 

Robert O

  • Member since
    June, 2014
  • From: New Braunfels , Texas
Posted by Tanker - Builder on Friday, January 13, 2017 2:10 PM

Hi ;

   What I do with Bulwarks like that , Either plastic or wood , is install all the framing and the top rail .Then use epoxy at the frame supports  Make sure to cut the freeing ports and scuppers first .

 Then using pins placed as guides put a dot of epoxy , on the bottom of each frame and set in place . Another way but more laborious is this .

Make a notch in the hull where each frame is supposed to be. Epoxy vertical pieces in the notches , sand smooth and then mount the Bulwark . Remember to set the frames the right thickness . T.B.

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Friday, January 13, 2017 2:19 PM

Yes Thank you Tanker for these tips. Totally different method of reading instructions & building techniques with a wooden kit compared to a plastic kit. I think I will add the vertical stays, drill the scupper holes and paint before glueing onto deck.

 

Robert O

  • Member since
    December, 2006
  • From: Jerome, Idaho, U.S.A.
Posted by crackers on Friday, January 13, 2017 11:51 PM

After a long hiatus, I have decided to resume construction of my scratch built HMS PELICAN. Even though my model is much smaller than the BLUE NOSE, the method to bend the bulwarks should be similar. In this case, it is for bending the cap rail on the starboard side of my model. First, a profile of the model deck is made on a scrap piece of wood  from a cardboard template. A pencil line is drawn on the outer outboard of the template. The the width of the cap rail is pencil drawn next to the first line. Holes for nails are drilled along the outside of the inner line and nails are inserted into these holes. Meanwhile, a streight piece of wood similar in length and with to the cap rail is soaked over night in a mild solution of bleach and hot water.

By the following day, the soaked cap rail is CAREFULLY bent along the aligned nails to fit the profile of the deck profile. Nails are inserted along the outer edge to prevent the soaked cap rail from springing back to its original streight shape.

Once the cap rail is completely dried, it is painted and glued into place as had been done on the port side of the model and will be done for the starboard side as well.

Hope this helps. Happy modeling.    Crackers   Cool

Anthony V. Santos

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Saturday, January 14, 2017 10:19 AM

Crackers - thanks for your info and pictures! I'm going to try making a Styrofoam deck template that will allow me to clamp and hold the bulwarks in place while glue sets up. I want  to thank everyone who responded for all of you help and tips! I'll try and get results up as soon as possible.

Robert O

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Saturday, January 14, 2017 11:44 AM

There's an easier way to make cap rails and waterway planks.

make your pattern for the outboard profile. Trace it onto a sheet of basswood, or mahogany. Mark the inner profile using dividers. Cut out.

  • Member since
    June, 2014
  • From: New Braunfels , Texas
Posted by Tanker - Builder on Sunday, January 15, 2017 10:41 AM

Hi " G "

 I applaud you .This is a good method .I do believe that using Basswood well soaked in Vinegar water   ( Warm )  Would work too .

  To Bend real boat planks I used my 40' steamer with a quart of vinegar in the method .Vinegar seems to help the wood soften .   T.B.

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Sunday, January 15, 2017 10:50 AM

What I frequently do for things like bulwarks is to clamp or pin blocks down to the deck, alternating block then space then another block, so about half the space along the strip is supported by blocks and half the space reveals the joint.  Then I glue the deck-bulwark joints that are exposed.  This usually supports the bulwark so that the blocks can be removed and you can glue the remaining areas without problems.

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Sunday, January 15, 2017 10:54 AM

Forgot to add, the first model ship I built was by Guillows, but then I built a number of the Scientific kits.   They were great bargains!  I could not afford Model Shipways in those days.  The European kits had apparently not yet arrived on these shores, but I wouldn't have been able to afford them either. I often replaced a lot of the fittings by ordering them from AJ Fisher, since the fittings of the Scientific kits often left a little to be desired.

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Sunday, January 15, 2017 6:54 PM

Don Stauffer - thanks for this idea. I picked up a pack of straight pins - I'll try cutting small blocks of balsa wood and pin them to the deck. Then try rubberbanding bulwarks against them while they dry. I want to thank everyone for your help and ideas!!!  As for me, 'the light was on but no one was home!" 

 

Robert O

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Sunday, January 15, 2017 7:17 PM

Fright,

All of these comments goe to show that there are many ways to solve problems in modeling.  We have each developed techniques largely unique to ourselves, but we have also influenced each other by sharing ideas. I have grown to appreciate each of the contributors here.

Bill

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Monday, January 23, 2017 2:50 PM

1st off- thanks goes out to Don, Bill, GM and Tanker for your help on the bulwarks. I used a little of everything - straight pins, a styrofoam cut mold of deck, CA and white glue and vinegar & water.  Once again, the head dummy (yours truly), left one of my cut bulwarks out and our cat, Monster, helped out by chewing the end off. Had to cut and bend another piece, then (yours truly) went and cut the scuppers on the top of bulwark instead of bottom part. Three's a charm!!! %#@! Here's a pic of where I am at. No scuppers yet on rear bulwarks - and not glued down and I

know my scuppers are not accurate, but they'll have to do. The plans do not even mention them.

OK - Jan. 24th, 2017. Scuppers cut out and my bulwarks have been glued down. Just need to putty the seams and sand smooth.

 

Robert O

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Wednesday, February 01, 2017 8:22 PM

Worked on getting the railing on, along with the fantail railing and bow stem brace. I added a 2nd stem brace which I feathered down to blend in with side rails. Used putty to cover seams. Once dry, I'll sand and I believe she'll be ready to have her hull painted. Yes, I have to add the rudder. Rudder is shaped but directions called for cutting strips of paper to use as pintles & gudgeons. I picked up a brass sheet at HobbyLobby and will cut strips from that. 

 

Robert O

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, February 02, 2017 10:30 AM

Nice work.

Are you interested in planking the deck? It's fun to do.

 

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Thursday, February 02, 2017 7:06 PM

Hey GM - can it still be done at this stage. I have the bulwarks and stancions in place. I've never attemped it, but I could possibly give it a go. Is there a tutorial or posts on this? I want to say thanks for everyone's info on helping me get the bulwarks going:)

That little piece of unstained wood in the picture above was added to cover up the terrible cut the previous owner did when attaching the two deck halves to the solid hull. I was going to lightly sand and give another coat of stain before your post. Here's a pic of the hull from the previous owner.

 

 

Robert O

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, February 02, 2017 11:58 PM

Take a look at this thread:

 http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/modeling_subjects/f/7/t/156456.aspx?page=1

That piece you added between the decks is called a grub beam.

I am not sure just why it was a part of racing yachts, but it's there and you were right to add it.

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Saturday, February 04, 2017 7:49 AM

I am impressed so far with your efforts.  I also agree with GM; planking the deck can be fun, and it would look great!

Bill

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Saturday, February 04, 2017 10:37 AM

I took a look at the video of your planking. It does look great! What size wood strips were used?

Robert O

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Saturday, February 04, 2017 2:55 PM

I appreciate folks who take pictures of their models on cutting matts with scale grids.

Wiki lists her waterline length at 111'-11", and that looks to be 13"-14" about on your model. I get 1/8" = 1'-0" or 1/96 from that. Or maybe a little bigger, say 1/80 or so.

Then I looked at photos of the original ship. First, there are numerous patterns for planking big schooners. Bluenose looks to be the type where all of the planks are parallel to the fore-aft centerline. And using the trusty measuring tool of a sailors shoe, eight inches or so wide.

That sets your plank at around 3/32". 

So now draw your centerline stem to stern. Some schooners like ones I've seen from the Grand Banks have quarterdeck planking at an angle that sort of follows the outboard profile and meets in the middle with long angles. It doesn't seem to be the case here.

Those bulwark supports or stanchions are really extensions of the ships frames. They also are at the ends of the deck beams. The deck beams of course are where the deck plank ends are located.

Youve installed what looks to be every third or fourth stanchion. The original had a LOT of them. It also looks as though they were evenly spaced. There are plenty of drawings of Bluenose from which you could get an accurate spacing, but why complicate life with this nice little kit.

You want to draw a series of lines perpendicular to the centerline, spaced evenly and at each frame/ deck beam.

Now pick a plank length that's a multiple of beams. These things could be pretty long, say 16 feet or so. More important though is to pick a length that matches a multiple of your deck beam spacing. A "Chopper" is helpful here.

The boatbuilder would have a rule like"8 by 4", for example. Every plank is eight beams long,   every fourth plank has matching ends. They wouldn't be the obvious step sequence, but it might go with the second  one beam up, the third two beams back the other way or some other regular pattern. Break the pattern where planks are between fore and aft deck houses and the space is less than a normal length; use a single plank.

Some stain their planks before installing them, I've never done that but I've only done a couple. There are a LOT of planks. 

Then starting at the centerline glue down one plank with it's ends on your beam lines. If you can, add a few more in either direction until you come uo on your deckhouses, masts, or such. Now, start the next row by putting the next plank one beam offset from the first. Finish the row. Start the third row three beams back in the other direction from the first. What you want to do is be consistent with your steps to get a regular pattern, and not have one plank start at the midpoint of the one next to it.

Thats it. You're a little behind the eightball around the edges as there isn't an edge or waterway plank there, but slice them off with a razor blade to fit the curve of the hull and it'll look fine,

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Sunday, February 05, 2017 8:25 PM

  The Scientific plans make no mention of monkey boards or railings. I thought I'd make my own. Looked at a few pictures on internet to try and get an idea of what they looked like. I cut a 1/16" strip from a sheet of basswood. I cut 1/4" width strip for the rails. Glued them down and used putty to fill in cracks/seams.

  I drilled the hawse holes and glued in the metal rivets for the anchor chain. I add a fine rail up near the bow - again 1/16" square strip. Sanded and added some putty.

  The plans called for using cut paper strips for pntles/gudgeons on rudder. I pickup a small sheet of brass from HobbyLobby and cut out some small strips. I bent them into an U-shape and then glued them to keel and rudder. I cut a small piece of wood from a toothpick and drilled holes into top of rudder and into hull to add stability to the rudder.

 

 p.s. If you get a chance, check out GMorrison's wonderful build in here on his America yacht! Bow Down

Robert O

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Wednesday, February 08, 2017 3:09 PM

I have finished my putty work, sanding and have primed the boat flat white. All rails are complete and rudder with brass pintles/gudgeons are in place. Will begin taping off for final piant on hull.

Robert O

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Friday, February 10, 2017 5:05 PM

Someone was kind to mention that I needed to trim more off the stern to give her a sleek look. Shaved, sanded and puttied. Painted the lower hull with two coats of Testors Dark Red spray paint - I have 3-4 spots to touch up where paint 'bled' under my tape but that's an easy fix. Once everything is dry, I'll paint upper hull with Gloss Black, leaving a thin white line between my two colors. I'll then buff to a glossy shine with 4000-12000 sanding pads.

Robert O

fox
  • Member since
    January, 2007
  • From: Coatesville, Pa.
Posted by fox on Friday, February 10, 2017 5:22 PM

Very nice work Robert! Yes

Jim  Captain

Photobucket Main WIP: Rebuild of Monogram 1/8 "Big Deuce" with 1/8 Pocher V-12 in rear - 10%

   On the Bench:   Revell 1/48 Ju 52/3m - 50%;  Revell 1/96 USS Kearsarge - 20% 

I keep hitting "escape", but I'm still here.

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Friday, February 10, 2017 8:33 PM

Jim - thanks for taking a look! I'm hoping to make some improvements on this basic wood kit as well as improvements in my wood working skills.

Robert O

  • Member since
    January, 2012
  • From: Douglasville Georgia
Posted by fright on Saturday, February 11, 2017 7:20 PM

Got a chance to do some work on the hull this morning. Taped off and painted upper hull a Gloss Black. Put on a 2nd coat by midday. Removed the tape this evening and my white strip and black came out really clean. While she is drying this weekend, I started to work on the deck furnishings. I've started with the main cabin.

Robert O

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