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Lindberg USS Gato Fleet Sub

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  • Member since
    December, 2011
Lindberg USS Gato Fleet Sub
Posted by model make on Monday, March 20, 2017 9:35 PM

 

Orderd it today.

 I know a lot of these kit are old drug store kits but

they are just what the doctor ordered.

This one should go like kit building ought to go.

Does not have all the parts of destroyer or sailing ship.

Cover over box has it painted black but I'm going to paint it

gray like in all the movies.

Should be fun.

  • Member since
    June, 2014
  • From: New Braunfels , Texas
Posted by Tanker - Builder on Tuesday, March 21, 2017 12:13 PM

Well;

 It ain't bad but it does have some fit issues .Other than that , Have fun.  T.B.

  • Member since
    August, 2014
  • From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posted by goldhammer on Tuesday, March 21, 2017 12:21 PM

There WAS the one movie boat that got done in a mix of red and white lead paint...Tony Curtis and the nurses...........

  • Member since
    December, 2011
Posted by model make on Tuesday, March 21, 2017 12:36 PM

 

Thanks. Will be fun.

Nope. It's gonna be Model Master Gull Gray.

Good part too is that it can be painted with brush.

Problem with Lindberg Scharnhorst of mine is it needs an airbrush

and being confident with airbrush is a long ways off.

Need to get little comprssor.Too much hassle dragging in Craftsman

and letting it run down on air.

  • Member since
    June, 2014
  • From: New Braunfels , Texas
Posted by Tanker - Builder on Tuesday, March 28, 2017 9:16 AM

Ah ! Goldhammer ;

 You speak of " Operation Petticoat " . The premise was the Chief of the Boat couldn't get enough Grey primer . So he mixed what he had available which was Red , White and what little Grey he had left . Red primer is a stronger color ( RED ) so it dominated the overall boat rendering the mixed paint and subsequent submarine Pink . T.B.

  • Member since
    July, 2014
Posted by Nino on Tuesday, April 04, 2017 5:42 PM

model make,

     I have seen several Pic's of this kit . It actually can look real good. It would go great with  Revell's Buckly(Blessman, Bleigh) or Aaron Ward(Ward,Campbeltown, etc.)-about same 1/240 scale.  See references for a Balao class since the Conning tower seems to be Balao not Gato. Suggest you Drill out the Limber holes especially at the bow, put better Rails on the for'd and aft conning tower decks, put a Hawse hole at the bow- , and try to get the "wood" deck even with the Bow and Hull sides. (If you can fix the Anchor recess- great. Note that the anchor was only on port side in the pictures I've seen .)

  Good Luck.  Hope to see some pictures.

     Jim.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Tuesday, April 04, 2017 6:02 PM

Nino you must mean the Revell Growler/ Flasher/ Lionfish. That's a pretty good model. There are lots of aftermarket things available for it.

As for the Lindberg, if you can see a Balao in there, well you have better eyes.

It's one claim to fame is that it's maybe the first ever plastic ship kit.

Model Maker, if it tickles you, try the Lionfish next.

From David Johnston, posted on Navsource:

"The first three boats built at
EB, Portsmouth, and Mare Isla
nd all had two anchors when
completed. One of these anchors (usually the port
side, although this varied
a little) was removed
as part of the of “frivolous equipment” purge
of early 1942 and the hawse hole plated over. All
subsequent boats from all yards were built with only one anchor and ha
wsehole. The EB design
standardized on a starboard si
de anchor and the Government design on a port side one."
  • Member since
    July, 2014
Posted by Nino on Wednesday, April 05, 2017 8:01 PM

     To All,

     I know the post referenced the Lindberg Gato but the 1/240 scale Lindberg Gato sub does seem to be a Balao class even though Lindberg listed it as "Gato" and I responded with that in mind. ie: "See references for a Balao class since the Conning tower seems to be Balao not Gato ."                                        
    In the list of SHIP KIT REVIEWS  Tom Dougherty wrote "...a very rudimentary kit that is supposed to represent a Gato class submarine. Actually, the conning tower fairwater is much closer to a Balao class, with the Balao signature three-sided open cockpit design and free standing conical shears..."                                                                                   And also from Joes List at   http://www.modelerjoe.net/shipmodellist.html                        Re: Lindberg Gato:  " Credit given for great potential and plausible hull ... definitely a Balao-class, with sail-to-hull proportions matching Balao photos exactly. "      

     Gmorrison, Thanks for the Info! You are right about those Anchors.  I apologize for the confusion.  As I mentioned in my post "...the anchor was only on port side in the pictures I've seen." I did not see enough Pictures!
     In regards to the Kit Build I have an old one from Long Long Ago...

And here is a pic of Balao showing similar conning tower fairwater:http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0828524.jpg

A 1943 Gato Conning Tower fairwater:http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0821288.png

And here a 1944 Gato with conning tower fairwater reduced but not same as Balao   http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0821236.jpg

     However....Re: Gato class subs: "Flying Fish and Steelhead were unique among the Gatos. Both of these boats had complete rebuilds done... down to the main deck and the replacement of this structure(Fairwater) with one that closely matched that of the later Balao class."    So the Lindberg kit can be a Gato with a Balao Open Bridge.  I stand corrected.
     In regards to the Revell 1/178 Lionfish kit(s): That Revell Lionfish is a Gato class and a great kit to play with.  It's big and as stated there are still after market upgrades available including different Conning Tower Fairwater and Resin Guns plus Wood decks. It might be too big for smaller Bath Tubs however,  can't do a 180.

     Jim.

 

 

  • Member since
    December, 2011
Posted by model make on Thursday, April 06, 2017 12:26 AM

 

Yep. This is one of the first kits after WWII.

So's the Lindberg F80 but it might have been 'inherited' from another company.

Another project is going to hold up building this kit.

Building drive train from a 1/8 scale kit.

  • Member since
    June, 2014
  • From: New Braunfels , Texas
Posted by Tanker - Builder on Thursday, April 06, 2017 11:33 AM

Hi .

 If I remember correctly the Lindberg F-80 was a re-pop of Aurora's kit . Maybe I am wrong , but the parts are interchangeable , COMPLETELY !  T.B.

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Thursday, April 06, 2017 12:26 PM

In submarine lingo, there is no such this as a "conning tower".  It's technical name is "fairwater" but is most commonly called a "sail".

Bill Morrison

  • Member since
    July, 2014
Posted by Nino on Thursday, April 06, 2017 4:43 PM

Absolutely correct Bill.  I tried to keep it in TV lingo and what with the Political situations in the World, "Conning" sounded appropriate Wink .

Actually, I have been using the term "Sail" for the Nuke Subs.  I thought the Nautilus had a Sail whereas the Seawolf ssn575, Triton,and Guppy  conversions (improved streamlining of the bridge etc.), were more of a Bridge or Conning Tower Fairwater.        

Fairwater covers it. Thanks.  ( I edited my previous post a bit)

Model Make: I put a Bullnose on the Bow of my Sub.  (Lindberg kept the kit kinda simple.)

                 Ask questions of the forum. There are members here who are Superb model builders and Knowledgeable to the Extreme on Ships and the USN in particular. I just happen to have had the old kit and sort-of recall some of my research. Glad the members are keeping me straight. Never Stop Learning!
     ...And there is no requirement to "enhance" the kit. Have fun with it!

    Thanks.    

               Jim.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, April 06, 2017 4:52 PM

Let me ask you this, Bill. I'm working on adding an interior to my 1/144 Trumpeter Trigger.

There is a pressure chamber in the base of the fairwater, which has hatches down into the control room, up to the navigation bridge, and back to the open rear part of the fairwater where the main induction is, and from there a port to the deck.

It's described as a cylinder, lying on its side fore-aft, with concave ends. In there is a helm station, the periscope eyepiece, and it must be pretty cramped.

It's sometimes referred to as the conning tower in books. Just that chamber.

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Friday, April 07, 2017 5:57 AM

GM,

Which books?  I'd like to see exactly that which they are talking about.

Bill

  • Member since
    August, 2014
  • From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posted by goldhammer on Friday, April 07, 2017 8:21 AM

Bill-

Squadron Signal "Gato Class Submarines in Action" is the only one I have at hand. On page 20 is a cutaway of USS Balao, marked as Oct.'44.

They call that cylinder "conning tower", next page is a picture of Bullhead's Capt. at the  'scope in what they call the conning tower.

Unless there is a technically more correct term most people refer to that as such.  Fairwater is just the covering over the conning tower and main induction, and adds structure to support the scopes and other masts from damage when at speed submerged, as well as a higher position to observe when surfaced.

  • Member since
    July, 2014
Posted by Nino on Friday, April 07, 2017 4:51 PM

The link below goes to a 360 degree view of the Pampanito. It shows all the gear in the verrrry small "Conning Tower".  It might help with interior of "Trigger".

https://maritime.org/tour/ct-fwd.php    (Click on the picture and drag mouse around to see the whole interior.)

 

I should take another look at the old Run Silent, Run Deep movie. I recall the Conning Tower was depicted in it.

How many movies were there depicting a WWII vintage USN Sub?

  • Member since
    September, 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Saturday, April 08, 2017 8:09 AM

Thanks.  I'll check it out.  I spent over 20 years in the submarine navy, and have never heard of a "conning tower" used in that service.  So, I am curious.

Bill

  • Member since
    April, 2016
Posted by GlennH on Saturday, April 08, 2017 9:42 AM

Off topic a bit but you sub guys might enjoy reading a book I just took out at the library. "Blind man's bluff" True stories about American submarine espionage. It's a pretty darn interesting book.

A number RVN scans from hundreds yet to be done:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/southwestdreams/albums/72157621855914355

Have had the great fortune to be on every side of the howitzers.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Saturday, April 08, 2017 10:33 AM

I was just curious. No clue why it would be a Tower except that from the inside out, it's up a ladder.

RSRD does have interior shots. Hard to know set from sub, but there's a few that look pretty good like the forward torpedo room the control spaces.

RIP Don Rickles his first major movie.

That sub, SS 395 Redfish, that plays the Nerka was a real actor. She was also in 20K Leagues.

Look forward to your build. 

 

 

  • Member since
    November, 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Saturday, April 08, 2017 9:35 PM

Use of "conning tower" goes back to the fist submersibles, where there was a tawer atop th hull to give needful height for surface navigation.  The term held over in the period when the connin station was moved to its own pressurized cylinder atop the main hull.

Using a separate cylinder for the conning station simplified the design of the structure of the main pressure hull.  It also increased the periscope depth by the additional height above the keel.

The early boats were also all optimized for surface operations.

When the nuke boats started comining online, they were ever more optimized for underwater operation.  The technology to build pressure hulls to larger diameters also caught up, as well.  The periscope shears and a navigaation posiition could be much more neatly enclosed in a fibreglass fairwater which free flooded.  The lightweight nature  of those early fairwaters brought rise to the term "sail" as a reference to that lightness.

Later, for ice operations, the sail would get some metal plating, and to support the sail planes in 90º UP angle.

 

So, up to about '46 or '47, "conning tower" is correct; the Guppy boats used a fairwater, typically of FRP, they probably ought be called "fairwaters."  The nuke boats should all have "sails" ecepting boauts like Nautilus with an enclosed navigation bridge.

 

  • Member since
    July, 2014
Posted by Nino on Sunday, April 09, 2017 11:28 AM

Thanks CapnMac82.

     Very interesting history.  I was a bit unsure of the Guppy's.
Is that fiber-reinforced plastic the same Stuff on the bow to protect the Sonar arrays?
Bet it makes a mess in a collision.

     Thanks Again!             Jim.

  • Member since
    March, 2004
  • From: Kincheloe Michigan
Posted by Mikeym_us on Sunday, April 09, 2017 8:06 PM

goldhammer

There WAS the one movie boat that got done in a mix of red and white lead paint...Tony Curtis and the nurses...........

 

You mean the USS Growler from Operation petticoat?

On the workbench: Dragon 1/350 scale Ticonderoga class USS BunkerHill 1/720 scale Italeri USS Harry S. Truman 1/72 scale Encore Yak-6

The 71st Tactical Fighter Squadron the only Squadron to get an Air to Air kill and an Air to Ground kill in the same week with only a F-15   http://photobucket.com/albums/v332/Mikeym_us/

  • Member since
    August, 2014
  • From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Posted by goldhammer on Monday, April 10, 2017 8:28 AM

Mikeym_us
 
goldhammer

There WAS the one movie boat that got done in a mix of red and white lead paint...Tony Curtis and the nurses...........

 

 

 

You mean the USS Growler from Operation petticoat?

 

 

No, I do not!!  The movie was made in 1959.  USS Balao played the part of the Sea Tiger.

 

USS Growler - SS 215 is "On Eternal Patrol" since 8 November 1944. Growler has a proud history for the actions throughout the war, not to mention the sacrifice of her Captain, Cdr Howard Gilmore on an earlier patrol.

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