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Use of wire cable for running rigging

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  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Use of wire cable for running rigging
Posted by Don Stauffer on Monday, April 09, 2018 10:16 AM

I am working on the HMS Lord Nelson, a pre-dreadnaught (even though it was actually launched after Dreadnought was).  I am wondering when the use of steel cable came into use in running rigging.  Would a ship in early 20th century have fiber rope for running rigging or was steel cable in use by then.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Monday, April 09, 2018 2:40 PM

According to a couple of sources the Preussen, launched in 1902 had steel wire running rigging.

Wire rope standing rigging dates back to the 1850's.

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Tuesday, April 10, 2018 8:42 AM

GMorrison

According to a couple of sources the Preussen, launched in 1902 had steel wire running rigging.

Wire rope standing rigging dates back to the 1850's.

 

Thanks!  I had not found that one.  I think I will go ahead and use a metallic gray on the rigging. I have already painted the line parts of some of the photo etch stuff steel color. I guess it would be hard for anyone to be too critical about it- sure is hard to find facts about it.  I had found the references to the standing rigging, but the next thing I found were references about widespread use of running rigging in WW2!

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    May, 2010
Posted by amphib on Wednesday, April 11, 2018 5:35 AM

Having been on a ship with lots of wire rope running rigging I would say the color you should be looking for is black. The wire was regularly greased to prevent corrosion. You should be aware that at least as far as the Navy is concerned. Wire is rope and fiber is line.

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Wednesday, April 11, 2018 9:02 AM

Thanks, Amphib.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    November, 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Thursday, April 12, 2018 9:59 PM

The choice is affected by the needed radii to pass the rigging.  Manilla line has a minimum radius of 3x diameter (so, you'd want a 3" sheave for 1" line).  Wire rope "wants" a larger diameter around 1:9, and 1:15 is better.

Which sounds a burden, bbut, wire rope is easily 3 times stronger than natural fiber, so a 3/8" steel cable is as strong as a 1" manilla line (really, really round numbers here).

On a P-liner, with spars more than 60cm around, needing a 150mm sheave for 10mm wire not a great issue., and does not add much windage, either.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, April 12, 2018 11:01 PM

The Jarvis winch was patented in 1890. 

There, every advantage of wire rope (yes Amphib I was taught to call it line as well) made for a system where 40 hands total on three watches could sail a fully rigged ship.

  • Member since
    November, 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Saturday, April 14, 2018 12:45 AM

GMorrison
There, every advantage of wire rope (yes Amphib I was taught to call it line as well)

LoL.

Technically, on the big wooden spool, it's wire rope until bent to a task, then, it's line.

"Cable" is a measurement of length, or a way to conduct electrical current (or a way to watch TV).

  • Member since
    May, 2010
Posted by amphib on Saturday, April 14, 2018 7:11 AM

Well folks reaching on the shelf and pulling down my trusty Blue Jackets' Manual I quote "To a seaman, fiber rope is called Line, and wire rope is called Rope." That's the way I learned it. Maybe in the British Navy or elsewhere things are called something else.

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Saturday, April 14, 2018 10:18 AM

Let's face it, folks.  In the English language, there is no official organization to control meanings, like there is for French or others. It is an open source language.  That, of course does not stop the Navy from trying to become that organization :-)

And I will continue to call Great Lakes bulk carriers boats, even the thousand footers :-)

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    September, 2010
Posted by retdfeuerwehr on Sunday, April 15, 2018 12:45 AM
I was a BM3 on an LST and I remember manila was "line", but I never heard wire rope called just "rope"...usually it was "wire", or its actual use: like cargo whip, preventer, stern anchor wire, etc.

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