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Doing a gloss coat on ships

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  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Doing a gloss coat on ships
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Monday, July 13, 2020 11:51 AM

Not sure if this should be in painting or techniques , but as it pertains to ships....  anyhow.  This is my 1st I'm going to gloss but I don't think I'm going to do any detailing. I guess I'll still have to or should still gloss the whole thing for decals - just the ship no's. ??  If I should have to do the whole ship, is there a preferred method?  You can't do the whole thing at once ?  If I do , how to you set it up to dry as the bottom will be wet.  Should the bottom be done?

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Monday, July 13, 2020 12:30 PM

As far as doing the whole thing at one- how do you hold it- I always make a temporary base while building.  I never use the kit bases.  I make pedestals I will use on final base.  I make the building base from particle board, and match drill the holes for the pedestals.  I do not glue the pedestals to the building base, but work for a press fit.  That way when I am done I can just remove ship and pedestals from building base and glue the pedestals into the final base.

Now, as far as paint.  It is much harder to get a good gloss finish than a flat finish.  Why do you want a gloss base.  Is this a commercial passenger carrying ship or boat?  If not, naval ships are usually flat or eggshell- so are working boats.  You can start with flat paint and sand the last coat, then put on a gloss final coat.  If the ship has a lot of decals you can use a gloss coat before decaling, followed by a dullcoat, or just gloss the local area where decals go.  Let us know what ship or boat, and we can give more detailed help.

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Monday, July 13, 2020 1:10 PM

Tks don - its a navy ship so the final is going to be a flat coat.  I was thinking gloss coat for the decals - but i think its just bow numbers....  Ive heard some suggest to do the whole ship in gloss as theyve experienced trouble just doing a particular few spots in gloss for decals then flating it...  So i was curious if i have to do the whole ship in gloss, how does one set it down to dry if the hull is wet?  I was thiking if i do do some detailing, they would work getter on gloss rather than flat coat.  They i would flat coat over that.

 

Wm

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Monday, July 13, 2020 1:36 PM

I don't think doing the whole ship- i.e. one side/ rail to bottom is worth the trouble.

The hardest decals are the draft marks. The numbers are easy to mask an area for.

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

 

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Monday, July 13, 2020 8:28 PM

GMorrison
The hardest decals are the draft marks.

I believe this is in relation to his 1/700 Quincy. Pretty sure 1/700 daft marks woul want a microscope Smile

  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Monday, July 13, 2020 8:40 PM

Yep. I think of the one 1/700 I did and didn't give away. My 1st or second one. I look at the liitle decals on the plane and ship, and oh boy.....  Lots of silver. 

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Monday, July 13, 2020 9:25 PM

Oh. Well for that matter 24" numerals at 1/700 are 0.033 inches tall.

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Monday, July 13, 2020 10:13 PM

Mrchntmarine

Tks don - its a navy ship so the final is going to be a flat coat.  I was thinking gloss coat for the decals - but i think its just bow numbers....  Ive heard some suggest to do the whole ship in gloss as theyve experienced trouble just doing a particular few spots in gloss for decals then flating it...  So i was curious if i have to do the whole ship in gloss, how does one set it down to dry if the hull is wet?  I was thiking if i do do some detailing, they would work getter on gloss rather than flat coat.  They i would flat coat over that.

 

Wm

 

William,

My suggestion would be to use a gloss coat like Tamiya Gloss X-22 and thin with some Lacquer thinner ( Tamiya #87077). I use a 1 to 1 mix. Either airbrush or use a Red Sable brush and just hit the areas that you will decal, ship #’s aircraft insignia etc.  Since this is a 1/700 ship I’d probably use a brush. I would also pick up some Micro-Sol to get the decals to really adhear to the surface.

After they’re dry use some gloss on the area again and let dry. If there’s no silvering then go ahead and hit the whole ship with a dull/ flat coat to tie everything together.

I only Gloss the entire ship if I’m going to weather her.

Hope this helps,

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Monday, July 13, 2020 10:35 PM

Tks bill and Steve. Steve - ok to use the gloss and lacquer thinner over acrylics?  Also, here's the last time I tried the decals on a 1/700 ship: http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/tools_techniques_and_reference_materials/f/20/t/172759.aspx

but  I'd like to think my paining is a little better Smile now. 

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Monday, July 13, 2020 11:07 PM
No need to gloss coat the whole ship,just do where the decals are going to be placed.

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Monday, July 13, 2020 11:22 PM

Mrchntmarine

Tks bill and Steve. Steve - ok to use the gloss and lacquer thinner over acrylics?  Also, here's the last time I tried the decals on a 1/700 ship: http://cs.finescale.com/fsm/tools_techniques_and_reference_materials/f/20/t/172759.aspx

but  I'd like to think my paining is a little better Smile now. 

 

If you’re concerned about the lacquer thinner then just pick up Tamiya TS-13. It’s in a rattle can and you just spray it on the areas you need.

The rule of thumb is to use hot paints and thinners first and cool ones on top. So lacquer thinner  is hot whereas acrylics are cool. That being said, you would only being putting the Gloss on a small area and using not very much at that.

       

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2010
Posted by potchip on Monday, July 13, 2020 11:24 PM

Only need to brush the section you want decal gloss. 

Afterwards, a gloss coat may help smooth out the sheen of decal and other sections and when you apply the final coat of whatever sheen it is consistent.

Personally I wouldn't bother gloss the whole ship, a bit of an overkill just to smooth out the decal. Exception being if you are weathering then it's a natural step after decal so go for it, then seal with flat coat.

 

 

  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Wednesday, July 15, 2020 12:00 PM

GMorrison

Oh. Well for that matter 24" numerals at 1/700 are 0.033 inches tall.

 

Question - All ships should have draft marks, yes.  I think so...  But in looking at the pictures of this Quincy i dont see any anywhere.  Also, there are none in the kit???  

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Wednesday, July 15, 2020 12:58 PM

Yes they should but it gets a little fussy at small scale.

Modeling is an excuse to buy books

 

  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Wednesday, July 15, 2020 2:06 PM

thought so.  concur...  Oh, and just noticed the decals they provided for the scout planes are big enough to cover 1/2 a plane each.  I know they would need to be small, but too bad!  There's no way i can use them.  Oh, and the flags are way short - 3/32 by 6/32

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Wednesday, July 15, 2020 2:11 PM

docidle

William,

My suggestion would be to use a gloss coat like Tamiya Gloss X-22 and thin with some Lacquer thinner ( Tamiya #87077). I use a 1 to 1 mix. Either airbrush or use a Red Sable brush and just hit the areas that you will decal, ship #’s aircraft insignia etc.  Since this is a 1/700 ship I’d probably use a brush. I would also pick up some Micro-Sol to get the decals to really adhear to the surface.

After they’re dry use some gloss on the area again and let dry. If there’s no silvering then go ahead and hit the whole ship with a dull/ flat coat to tie everything together.

I only Gloss the entire ship if I’m going to weather her.

Hope this helps,

Steve

Hey Steve - question, out of curiousity, why would you thin the gloss and not put it on straight?  Tks Wm

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Thursday, July 16, 2020 8:42 AM

I recently tried Testors new lacquer spray can.  I have used to use Tamiya black lacquer as a quick undercoat for Alclad.  I find the Testors stuff almost identical to the Tamiya.  It has a lovely gloss and dries in 20 minutes.

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    September 2010
Posted by retdfeuerwehr on Saturday, July 18, 2020 1:56 PM
I know you're talking about glosscoating for decals, but I thought I'd add this: As a former fleet sailor I never saw a flat-finished Navy vessel...after even a few days at sea the ship gets covered in salt water, which when dry leaves shiny NaCl crystals everywhere. From time to time we even added varnish to the Haze/Deck gray to achieve a bit of a shine. Much easier to keep clean during freshwater washdowns. On my ships I usually apply a thin coat of Humbrol "Satin Cote" to the finished model.
  • Member since
    October 2016
  • From: Louisiana Gulf South
Posted by Mrchntmarine on Saturday, July 18, 2020 9:02 PM

Good point. Thinking about it I've always done flat on the few I've done so far. Might be a good experiment to do a satin on this one. 

 

Keep on building!

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Sunday, July 19, 2020 6:10 PM

Mrchntmarine
Question - All ships should have draft marks, yes. I think so... But in looking at the pictures of this Quincy i dont see any anywhere.

Wartime regs had them in Black (or a "suitable" contrasting color).  They are also only 6" tall IRL.  (About 8 thousandths tall at 1/700; 16 at 1/350.)  That makes them very hard to see in photos, for being smaller than the grain size of a lot of film stock.

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