Why don't you build wooden ship kits?

It really depends on the modeler...in my spare time I've taken up to a year to finish a project. Others times, I've had a client who needed a completed model of the Revell Cutty Sark in 1 month, he got it and I got the money!

Take the Heller Viking Boat I got off ebay a few months back, heck.... it took me about a month to review all the different varations to vikings long boats just to pick the paint colors/scheme WITH the help of JTilley.

The USS Constitution takes me about 45 days to build because I "think" I know all the colors, it realy depends on the model you're building. The Heller HMS Victory take s a bout a month to paint everything for pre-assemb.[:0]. I think most of our group are lucky to have afull time job. I work a full time job, run a small custom scale model building shop out of the home, and have 2 kids still at home with one in high school band and one on the HS flag team.

Time can get tight sometimes.... But it's a great hobby!

Jake

Welcome to the forum! It's great to see another ship enthusiast on board.

I'll try to answer your questions - but please remember that these are just one individual's reactions and opinions. I'm a fairly long-time (48 years) ship modeler who's worked in plastic and wood. I imagine your post will get some other responses, all of which deserve as much attention as mine does.

1. Different people find that different techniques work for them, but generally speaking airbrushing requires thinner paint than hand-brushing. I'm not familiar with the Revell airbrush paints you mentioned, but I suspect they don't need thinning for hand-brushing. I personally hand brush most of the time (though I do use an airbrush for some things). My personal preference is for acrylic paints; my favorite brand is PolyScale.

2. No primer is necessary to make enamel paint stick to plastic. Many modelers, however, like to apply a coat of grey (or some other neutral color) first, to make the final coat appear more even. If, for example, some of the parts are molded in black and others are molded in yellow, and the entire model is to be painted white, it will take several coats of white paint to conceal the underlying colors. An initial primer coat of grey would solve the problem.

3. The choice of a ship kit is entirely personal. Many modern modelers (including me) got their start in plastic kits (I built my first one in 1956 - I think), and find that medium more friendly than wood. Others prefer wood, which requires many different techniques. My personal opinion is that in the typical sailing ship model some parts can be made quite impressively of plastic, while wood has a clear advantage in others. Styrene plastic, for example, makes an excellent planking material because it's easy to bend. That same quality makes it a terrible material for small-diameter masts and yards - which are not supposed to bend.

4. The people who spend years on plastic models are replacing and adding to the kit contents. Some years back I spent several years on a model of H.M.S. Bounty, based on the Revell plastic kit. By the time I finished, it contained about a dozen of the original kit's plastic parts - and all of those had been heavily modified. When I finished it, I took a good hard look at what I'd done and decided to build my next model from scratch.

The most sophisticated plastic kits (e.g., Revell's U.S.S. Constitution and Heller's H.M.S. Victory) do take a long time to build - and they can be made into beautiful, historically accurate models. Plastic has the potential to be molded into finely-detailed shapes that no human hand, however skilled, can duplicate. (If you don't believe that, take a good look at an old-fashioned phonograph record.) The best plastic ship kits contain figureheads, stern carvings, and other ornamental castings that, to my knowledge, no wood kit on the market can match in terms of artistry and accuracy.

Unfortunately, there's also a tremendous variation in quality. Many of the plastic kits on the market are, in terms of historical accuracy, junk - and most of the wood kits on the market are worse. (We've taken up this topic several times in the forum. Regular participants undoubtedly are sick of reading what I think about it, so I won't repeat it here.)

The bottom line is that ship modeling, for most of us, is a hobby, to be pursued because we enjoy it. One great thing about it is variety - in terms of subject matter, materials, techniques, and personal approaches. My suggestion is to do it in whatever way you enjoy most - plastic or wood; two years per model or two weeks. If you're happy with the results, and you have fun, that's what's most important. If you learn something about maritime history and technology in the process, that's even better - but entirely optional.

Welcome aboard. It's a great hobby.

Originally posted by jtilley Welcome to the forum! It's great to see another ship enthusiast on board. == >I'll try to answer your questions - but please remember that these are just one >individual's reactions and opinions. I'm a fairly long-time (48 years) ship modeler >who's worked in plastic and wood. I imagine your post will get some other responses, >all of which deserve as much attention as mine does. == Hello: I am a 30 years old PhD student in physics. Building ships is better than consulting a psychologist: when building and tinkering I can really turn-off all my everday problems. == >The most sophisticated plastic kits (e.g., Revell's U.S.S. Constitution and Heller's >H.M.S. Victory) do take a long time to build - and they can be made into beautiful, >historically accurate models. Plastic has the potential to be molded into >finely-detailed shapes that no human hand, however skilled, can duplicate. (If you >don't believe that, take a good look at an old-fashioned phonograph record.) The >best plastic ship kits contain figureheads, stern carvings, and other ornamental >castings that, to my knowledge, no wood kit on the market can match in terms of >artistry and accuracy. == Do you have a link to such images somwehere? It is hard to find images of historic ships built upon plastic. One will find a lot of warship images, though. I started the thread because I have often read on mailing lists that people in the wooden ship business try to seduce everyone in the believing that building wooden ships is a big upgrade as opposed to plastic kits. However, your arguments of carvings and fine details in plastic are worth to consider. That makes me think again. Thanks. Very good insight. Regards, S. Gonzi Reply Edit jtilley Member since May 2003 From: Greenville, NC Posted by jtilley on Tuesday, December 14, 2004 8:47 AM Unfortunately I don't know of a site that posts any number of good pictures of sailing ship models built from plastic kits. There are several dealing with modern warships, but I'm not aware of any that specialize in "period" ship models. Maybe somebody else in the forum knows of such a site. If there is one, I'd love to post some of my own pictures on it. Ship modeling is a great therapeutic activity for graduate students. I speak from experience. I can remember many evenings in which, having spent the day wrestling with writing assigments, articles to read, and freshman exams to grade, I'd look happily at the model I was working on and say to myself: "No professor, or publisher, or anybody else except me cares how good it is. Nobody is holding a deadling over my head. In fact, nobody cares if I ever finish that model." That model just may have saved my sanity. (I suspect some of my current students would disagree.) Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery. Reply Lufbery Member since December 2002 From: Harrisburg, PA Posted by Lufbery on Tuesday, December 14, 2004 9:41 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by Katzennahrung Do you have a link to such images somwehere? It is hard to find images of historic ships built upon plastic. One will find a lot of warship images, though. There are a number of excellent plastic sailing ship kit build reviews at the Modeling Madness web site -- specifically the area dedicated to ship reviews: http://www.modelingmadness.com/kitindex/ships.htm Look especially for articles by Len Roberto (Constitution, Cutty Sark, HMS Prince), but also the review on Revell's Flying Cloud by Bill Michaels. Regards, -Drew Build what you like; like what you build. Reply scottrc Member since December 2003 From: 37deg 40.13' N 95deg 29.10'W Posted by scottrc on Tuesday, December 14, 2004 2:57 PM I have a feeling that some people try to pin specific criteria to ship modeling, however, since it has been around as long as "the oldest profession", it is hard to say that using certian techniques and materials are better, faster, or easier than others. This segment of the hobby is best described as "If it feels good, you like it, then just do it" segment. A few of my ships litter my old college. Since I couldn't afford TV and didn't like going out a lot, I broke away from my studies by working on a ship. I built a wooded Santa Maria, and the Heller Victory in my dorm room. Reply DanCooper Member since March 2004 From: Belgium Posted by DanCooper on Tuesday, December 14, 2004 6:35 PM Normally I'm an AC (aircraft) builder, however I sometimes work on a ship as well. When I'm building modern warships, I use a plastic kit, but when doing a "period" ship, there is still nothing that can compare to wood. I have recently bought the plans (the kit was waaaaaaaaaaaaay to expensive ( 1000€)) of "Le Soleil Royal" ; that will be my next long-term project for escaping stress, thinner-fumes and plastic. My wife, member of the forum under the handle "PatCooper" is a modeler to, plastic for cars, trucks and motorcycles, but she has begun work on her first wooden ship as well, it is the "H.M.S. Pandora" ; the ship that was responsable for capturing a few of the "Bounty"'s muteneers. On the bench : Revell's 1/125 RV Calypso Reply millard Member since December 2002 From: Greenville,Michigan Posted by millard on Tuesday, December 14, 2004 7:46 PM I've been building plastic sailing ships for about 17 years or so when I got back in the hobby after along haitus.I do have several wood kits in my stash and plan to build a couple after I retire in couple years.What bothers me about wood kits is .After you spent all those hours on just the hull they give you these junky parts to finish off the model.I'm talking about the metal and plastic parts. I have not found a wood kit yet that has decent windows with it. Also the instructions are so-so.Now I do admire wood ship builders and there craft. jtilley said there some junky plastic kits out there and there are. But there are some top notch kits and some other fair kits.But with a little work you can make these fair kits look good.jtilley said that the plastic kits offer some better detail than wood. I do agree on that.Some of the wood kit parts are what I call kind of bulky scale not a true scale at all.Now on my models I do change out parts for strength mostly. Like mast and yards.Now most of the wood models that you see are pretty pristine models.I understand that after all that time working on it you want to show your work. My plastic models I usally weather and I try to have them appear like what I think a real ship of that era would look like.Yes I can build about 5 plastic ships to 1 wood ship.But I do as much research on model as any wood modeler but do probably more detailing than most.That in a nut shell is why I model plastic sailing ships. I like several others on this site like jtilley.Big Jake,Scott and Dale enjoy the history of sailing ships.And really love the models whether they be plastic or wood. Rod Reply Anonymous Member since November 2005 Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, December 14, 2004 9:12 PM Welcome to the forum. I'm a 27 year old student and father of now 3. My dad & I bought my first model for me when I was about 10. The kit we bought was a F-16. We figured that it would be the easiest kit for me to "learn on". I learned all of the basics on that first kit. All of my firsts, PE, airbrushing, scratch building, and even different materials, were done on plastic aircarft models. They were cheep models that a kid cutting grass could aford to buy. If they did not turn out so well, they were only a small investment of time and money. Then one day, while at my favorite hoby shop, I passed the model ship section and found a kit that I could not pass up. The kit was a little more expensive that what I was used to spending, but what the heck it will take me longer to do. I was right, from begining to end it took about six months to build. That included the research and building of the kit. It was one of the best kits I had build to that pt in time. I gained a hole new presective on my building, ie less is more type of thing. The scratch building and temp clean up is much easier w/plastic than wood. My son (who is 18 months old) loves to come and "help" when I have things spread out on the dinning room table. While I would love to try a resin kit, it is just not in the budget at this time. Less mess and ease of use makes plastic the kits of choice. So basicaly find the one that works best for your self and have a blast. Mike Reply Edit Anonymous Member since November 2005 Why don't you build wooden ship kits? Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 4:08 AM QUOTE: Originally posted by speedy4 Then one day, while at my favorite hoby shop, I passed the model ship section and found a kit that I could not pass up. The kit was a little more expensive that what I was used to spending, but what the heck it will take me longer to do. I was right, from begining to end it took about six months to build. That included the research and building of the kit. It was one of the best kits I had build to that pt in time. I gained a hole new presective on my building, ie less is more type of thing. The scratch building and temp clean up is much easier w/plastic than wood. My son (who is 18 months old) loves to come and "help" when I have things spread out on the dinning room table. While I would love to try a resin kit, it is just not in the budget at this time. Less mess and ease of use makes plastic the kits of choice. So basicaly find the one that works best for your self and have a blast. Mike Hi: I bought me the "Pinta 1/75" from Heller today. I am wondering now whether I should use genuine wood and sails for my rigging and for the masts. I have some crap wood left over from older wooden kits. It is a goo idea to mix-up wood and plastic? By the way: does anybody know whether the book "Ship Modelling in Plastic" by Colin Peck has any value? Does it it make for a good reading? Another question: A predestined sin among historic wooden kit builders would be to use a glossy finish; they happen to prefer flat finishes. I have never understood why always a flat finish: isn't it that everything is in the eye of the beholder? Do plastic ship kit builders also prefer a mat or flat finish? I am in the process of ceasing my building process of my Russian u-boat. I red somewhere that I have to apply a coat of glossy finish prior to putting on the decals for means of a better adhesion. Some then prefer to apply a flat finish over that glossy finish - right? Regards, Katzennahrung Reply Edit DanCooper Member since March 2004 From: Belgium Posted by DanCooper on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 6:32 AM Hi, Katzen, yes it is always a good idea give a model a gloss coat prior to applying decals, otherwise, you're decals are almost for sure going to "silver" ; that is because a matt paint isn't flat, and the very tiny texture is more than enough to trap air between the decal and the model. On the bench : Revell's 1/125 RV Calypso Reply scottrc Member since December 2003 From: 37deg 40.13' N 95deg 29.10'W Posted by scottrc on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 10:00 AM QUOTE: [ Hi: I bought me the "Pinta 1/75" from Heller today. I am wondering now whether I should use genuine wood and sails for my rigging and for the masts. I have some crap wood left over from older wooden kits. It is a goo idea to mix-up wood and plastic? Regards, Katzennahrung Most plastic kits, I find, use too soft, or too brittle plastic for spars and masts. I have, especially on some Revell, Heller, and Linberg kits, replaced the bowsprit, topmasts and top spars with wood. I have also used fittings from plastic kits, such as doors, window frames, pumps, buckets, and cannons on wood ships because the wood kit fittings are so grossly out of scale. So, it more than ok to mix wood with plastic. For bonding, I use CA or diluted epoxy. Scott Reply jtilley Member since May 2003 From: Greenville, NC Posted by jtilley on Wednesday, December 15, 2004 10:11 AM I agree with scottrc. Plastic is ok for the heaviest of the spars, but if the spar is small enough to be flexible it's probably a good idea to replace it with wood. In addition to the adhesives he mentioned, tube-type plastic cement actually works pretty well for sticking the two materials together. It softens the plastic and soaks into the pores of the wood. There are no rules in ship modeling. (Caveat: if you're going to enter competitions, the sponsoring organizations sometimes have rules. That's one of the reasons I don't enter competitions.) I think most modelers would agree that flat finishes look more authentic, but if you disagree, so be it. It's worth noting that plenty of sailing ships were painted with glossy paint. My personal approach to that problem is to give such painted surfaces a semi-gloss finish. High gloss, to my eye, spoils the scale effect. If your aim is scale fidelity, you should be trying to make each part of the model, irrespective of material, look like the original. That Heller kit (a good choice for a starter, by the way) has some pretty good "wood grain" molded into the hull and deck components. Careful dry brushing and weathering can make it look very convincing. If you do it right, nobody will be able to tell where the plastic stops and the wood starts. Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery. Reply JOIN OUR COMMUNITY! Our community is FREE to join. 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