1/350 Shanghai/Dragon SSBN Florida

DBFSS385

Member since
September 2003
From: Connecticut

Posted by DBFSS385 on Tuesday, March 29, 2005 4:18 AM

My brother-in-Law has a 21 foot center console boat that he never uses. it just sits on it's trailer collecting mold and getting ugly. ( He prefers to go fishing with us because I own a 25' Cutty Cabin w/head). Anyway I have affectionately named his boat "The Fulton"
I think I've seen a 1/350 scale resin kit of the Fulton out there. Maybe The Iron Shipwright or one of the resin specialty shops would have a Tender Model. I have a good friend who ran the Printing shop on the Fulton for much of his career. His print shop handled much of the base and attached SUBRONs printing needs back then. He's a computer geek now. His hobbys are R/C aircraft. Don't want to go there.. another $$$ addiction I really don't need and photography. Anyway he has an extensive photo collection of the Fulton and other tenders like the LY Spear and Proteus and several Boats that She serviced while he was aboard her in the 70s and 80s. He is donating much of his collection to the USSVI Museum in Groton. The Fulton was really quite a Lady and her nickname "The Pier Queen" and "USS Neversail" in her later days was really harsh for a really great tender.

Be Well/DBF Walt

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dwblackwell

Member since
January 2003
From: Morris, Illinois

Posted by dwblackwell on Monday, March 28, 2005 9:12 PM

King's Bay went from being a God-forsaken swamp with no services or buildings when I first went there in '82 to being a really nice base nowadays (my last visit there was in '95). It has all the facilities one would expect and everything is fairly new and shiny. Bangor did all the same things probably ten years before KBay got the treatment. I would have cheerfully stayed in Bangor as long as they would let me stay- it was a nice place. Keyport is a small Navy station on the other side of the land mass from Bangor- they did torpedo research and development as I recall. Yes, I do remember the stores loads- got the scars and bad back to prove it. It was also really fun to find the cases of cashews and ensure they got put somewhere safe (like my rack!!). You can be sure that no canned beets or Brussels Sprouts ever went overboard (King's Bay has to get dredged regularly- I wonder why?).

Anyway, having been stationed on the Hunley for two years, I can talk to the tender loadout scenario as well. When the tenders were designed, they wanted to be able to do all manner of repair/reload/refurbishment to the boats from anywhere in the world that suited their fancy. This included refueling the reactors and other ambitous projects. Fortunately, reality set in and they soon figured out that some of these things were simply not possible. The weapons reloads were possible, but calm waters were needed to accomplish this task. I am just guessing that such conditions would have been near impossible to find after the big nuclear exchange (if they didn't get all the tenders to begin with!). That being said, the McKee (AS-41) did an upkeep of sorts on the Alaska many years ago in Alaska, and there was always talk on the Hunley that we would get underway and go somewhere else for refits as an exercise. We did take that tub out about once a quarter just to keep the seamanship current, but that was about it. Tending a sub in the open ocean would have been impossible due to the relative motion between the tender and the boats. Good thing we never had to test that capability for real. Hope this sheds some light. I don't know of any tender models, either- maybe someone will come up with one.

D. Blackwell MMC(SS), USN, Retired

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Monday, March 28, 2005 6:57 AM

Butchy, I didn't want to offend you. I was just thinking about an image of a Typhoon class SSBN getting a fresh load of Missiles from a Tender. Although I have read that Tenders are capable of re-stocking/replacing missiles. I don't know if they ever did that in the first place. I have never seen it happen, and all info I have on it is text from GlobalSecurity.org and a few photographs of an Ohio SSBN being loaded with missiles while in dock. This is by far the best and safest way of doing this.
Anyway, here's the image I was talking about. It was done by the US DoD sometime in the Coldwar. If it's true... Who knows.

Remko

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DBFSS385

Member since
September 2003
From: Connecticut

Posted by DBFSS385 on Monday, March 28, 2005 6:44 AM

Chief what I should have said is that I've never been part of a Missle rotation or loadout from a tender. 3 of my patrols started Stateside and loadouts were done from dockside ( Charleston and Norfolk & Bangor) Kings Bay is post my service by a few years anyway. I think we may have done rotations while moored to the Hunley but that was my 1st patrol and I was a NonQual Mess Crank and I could have missed the whole evolution. My memory does recall seeing other boats loading out from a tender in HolyLoch. It's funny how we selectively forget pre patrol load outs. You remember those Chief? 72 hour shifts of loading everything from O rings to tons of TDU or GDU weights in cardboard boxes and metal straps that cut our hands to pieces. I try to forget every one of them. Actually I did miss one loadout. ( The time I was Mess Crankin ) One time that mess Cooking was a better job than loading partys.. LOL I hear from shipmates at USSVI that Kings Bay is quite the place.. Did Kings bay replace the Cooper River weapons Station?
I remember Bangor WA. it was a pier out in the middle of nowhere. The weapons station was a Nature preserve I think. Lovely place. I think it's called Keyport now but we called it Bangor in 72. Some things are clearer in the memory banks than others..
Oh well ..

Be Well/DBF Walt

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dwblackwell

Member since
January 2003
From: Morris, Illinois

Posted by dwblackwell on Sunday, March 27, 2005 9:59 PM

Not to be contrary, Butchy, but we did offload and onload missiles from the tender over in Holy Loch. The missiles needed to be maintained and were changed out at regular intervals. We also did them from the tender back in the early '80's in King's Bay (before there was anything there besides a pier and mosquitoes!). The initial loadout usually took place at the boomer's home port (in the case of the T-hulls, either King's Bay for Trident II's or Bangor for Trident I's- the weapons stations were doing the older boomers). The cranes had to have special maintenance done on them to move missiles, which meant that we couldn't use them for our purposes when they were getting done. Anyway, there was a lot to be said for doing these lifting evolutions alongside a pier rather than a tender- much safer if only one of the platforms is moving.
To address the decals- The numbers on the missile hatches are OK, the colors should go on the pole at the stern in port, and the draft markings should be on the bow and on the rudder. If they include the markings for the forward escape trunk (the white stripes as shown in the box art), they were only applied during sea trials in the shipyard or if you are exercising with the DSRV. Operational boats did not typically carry those markings. The hull number is typically only displayed in port when you are "entertaining" visitors or the like. Some boats had weld beads to mark where to paint the hull numbers, but generally they are just made out of sheet metal with magnets on the back. Anyway- have fun with the build. Can't wait to see it.

D. Blackwell MMC(SS), USN, Retired

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DBFSS385

Member since
September 2003
From: Connecticut

Posted by DBFSS385 on Sunday, March 27, 2005 9:41 PM

Tankbuster,
Hi again. Operational Boats have no markings except draft markings and on some boats they retain their safey bouy/ escape hatch markings. our safety bouys were painted Int'l orange on the 601 and 616 Boomers. But..... they were strapped in for Patrols.. Go figure. It was the cold war anyway. I do add Hull Numbers to my completed models to honor and I.D. them for display. hey have fun nobody will know the difference between a yard and operational Boat. it's your choice.

Be Well/DBF Walt

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DBFSS385

Member since
September 2003
From: Connecticut

Posted by DBFSS385 on Sunday, March 27, 2005 9:31 PM

Remko<
FYI even though I did not serve on a Trident Boomer I did serve on a Polaris A3 and a Posiden Boat. We never loaded out birds ( missles) from a tender. This was always done dockside at the, or should I say A weapons station. i'll bet the Tridant Boats did the same. Tenders did not perform Missle load-out functions.
Tenders basicly did torpedo loadouts and maintanance assistance. Actually Many torpedo loadouts were done dockside also..... It's much easier dockside.

Be Well/DBF Walt

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, March 27, 2005 11:52 AM

The USS Dallas was a SSN, not a SSBN. It's very easy to distinguish them. SSN's are named after cities, SSBN's are named after States. Although the new Virginia class SSN contradicts this....
Perhaps USS Alabama (from Crimson Tide) would make a good subject!!
BTW, is there any possibility to show the Ohio class as a SSGN? With the Tomahawks I mean? I don't know if there are Tomahawks in 1/350th or 1/700th. It would be very difficult though, as each launch tube would house 7 Tomahawk missiles instead of just one Trident....

On a side note, are there any Submarine tenders available? This would make a great mini diorama, a SSBN being re-supplied by a Tender with a fresh load of Trident's. Of course, the story behind the scene would be a lot less great.....
I have a picture of a Typhoon class being restocked with a fresh load of missiles for a sustained Nuclear war. I'll see if I can scan it in, it's actually a very cool piece of artwork!!

Remko

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Anonymous

Member since
November 2005

1/350 Shanghai/Dragon SSBN Florida

Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, March 27, 2005 11:38 AM

Dear Shipmates...

Well just because the 'real' Florida' is in dry dock refitting for Tomahawks, it doesn't mean
we have to be all sad about it...Why not build one with a bunch of tridents on her back?

So here it is gentlemen...a look at inside the box of Shanghai/Dragon's 1/350 Ohio Class Trident.
I've included a picture of the parts trees, decals, and box top.

Observations:

The molding looks good with no flash however the sprues attach heavy along areas of fine parts so I'll
have to be careful removing and sanding the plastic to avoid damaging detail..

The build looks pretty straightforward, with a bunch of fine parts for the missle hatch doors...They throw
in two Mark 48 torpedoes and give you the option for modeling the trident I or II. Some boats carry one
or the other apparently.

You also have a couple of seahawk choppers...Maybe I'll fly them above the boat and reenact the scene
out of Red October when Jack Ryan is airlifted to a boomer at sea...Dallas was it? Anyway, I dry-fitted the hull
and it looks tight...but we'll have to see about the fit later..

The display stand looks decent so I think I'll keep it and use it, rather than deep sixing it?:)

Not sure where to put the two torpedoes...I'm sure some of you might have a suggestion for where they might
go...right...ok maybe I shouldn't ask...

The boxtop says 156 pieces although you wouldn't believe it just by looking...

Decals

You can hardly see what's on the decal sheet because there's hardly anything on there...However it's not like boomers
have a ton of decals...There are very small numbers for the missle hatch covers and the fathom markings on front
and back of the boat. There's a US flag decal which is shown flying from the stern pole...Must be in port right David?

We also have decals for the masts, periscope, antennas, etc...wonder how that will turn out...or should I paint the camo on?

The best part are the larger numbers for numbering your boat along the conning tower...Mine will be numbered 728 when its
all said and done...The sub guys know what's really the best thing to come out of Florida..right? and it's not walt disney world.
Although 20,000 leagues under the sea was a pretty cool ride when I was 4 and didn't realize the giant octopus was made of
rubber.

Anyway, thanks to David Blackwell and butchy for all your help planning and all of the guys that helped make our boomer
posts fun to read. Hope the finished product is just as great to see..

Will keep you posted,
Tank

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