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Anyone over 45 with a memory????

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  • Member since
    January 2005
  • From: Las Vegas
Anyone over 45 with a memory????
Posted by dood_dood on Wednesday, April 27, 2005 9:39 PM
I've been thinking of my first modeling experiences as a boy in the mid 60's. I remember buying these little sailing ship models, some for 50 cents, some for 99 cents at a small department store in rural Utah. The store carried a line of these and they were 4 or 5 inches long. My first model was the Constitution, and I also remember builing the Victory, Bonhomme Richard, Golden Hind and a Viking ship. Can any fellow geezeres out there remeber any kits like these and who made them? I'm looking for clues to see if I can find them anywhere.
  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Thursday, April 28, 2005 12:05 AM
Well...it's nice to think my senile, highly-selective memory may come in handy for somebody once in a while.

There were several lines of sailing ship kits back in the fifties that match dood_dood's description. Among the very first products issued under the Revell label were those in the "Shipyard Series." They were, in fact, originally issued by a firm called Gowland Creations, of Santa Barbara, California, in the fall of 1952. Gowland also was the originator of the famous "Highway Pioneers" series of antique car kits. (Here I'm not relying on memory, but on the splendid book Remembering Revell Model Kits, by Thomas Graham.) They came in two versions: with and without a plastic "bottle" (molded in two pieces). In 1954 Revell took over distribution of the kits and issued a few of them under its label. They also reappeared during the next twenty years under the "Mantle Models" and "Addar" labels. The subjects were the Santa Maria, Golden Hind, Mayflower, Bonhomme Richard, Constitution, Savannah, and the revenue cutter Joseph Lane. They were waterline models, each with a plastic "sea" base. The "sails" were thick, injection-molded plastic, and the "shrouds and ratlines," ingeniously, were printed on sheets of clear plastic.

Shortly thereafter Airfix released a series of similarly sized sailing ships. I don't have a published list of them in front of me, but I think I remember, H.M.S. Victory, H.M.S. Shannon, the Cutty Sark, the Great Western, the Santa Maria, and the Mayflower. (Whether the latter two were the same as the Gowland kits I have no idea.) These little kits shared many of the attributes of their American counterparts: "sea" bases, injection-molded "sails," and clear plastic "rigging." I have a vague recollection that a few of them, at least, appeared in full-hull form as well. Some of them, I believe, are still in the Airfix catalog and probably readily available in Britain, though I don't recall seeing them in the U.S. recently.

Then there was the range made by Pyro. These were a little bigger - seven or eight inches long - but to my recollection the price matches dood_dood's description: fifty cents. I think the Pyro kits came out over a fairly long period. The earliest ones - the Santa Maria and Mayflower, I think - were pretty crude, with wood dowels for masts and paper sails. Later ones included the Golden Hind, Fair American, Bonhomme Richard, a Roman merchant ship, and a couple of others whose identities escape me. As scale models they were pretty disastrous, with thick plastic "sails" and wildly distorted hull proportions. They were, however, as my mother described my grade-school efforts to build them, "cute." I haven't seen any of them for many years, except on e-bay.

Another, smaller line came from Ideal Toy Corporation, otherwise known as ITC. I have only a faint memory of them, but I think their Constitution has the distinction of being the smalles of the many kits that have represented that vessel over the decades. (It was also, to a ten-year-old, an insurmountable challenge. The fiends molded it in black plastic, with instructions to paint the sails white. Given the limits of Testor's glossy enamels and ten-cent brushes, the results were pretty depressing.) They also did a Viking ship and a Chinese junk, and probably one or two others that I've forgotten. These kits were quite tiny - about three inches long, if memory serves. In at least one incarnation they appeared in boxes of two each, for about a dollar. I believe Glencoe reissued at least one pair, the Viking ship and the Chinese junk, fairly recently; I think I saw it in a local hobby shop not long ago.

Those are the ones I remember. The Airfix and ITC/Glencoe kits probably would be relatively easy to get nowadays. For the others, I can only suggest swap meets, flea markets, and e-bay.

Hope this helps a little. Maybe some other forum members have better memories.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    December 2003
  • From: 37deg 40.13' N 95deg 29.10'W
Posted by scottrc on Thursday, April 28, 2005 7:38 AM
I cannot remember who had the original molds, if it was Ideal, Aroura, or Pyro, but I used to build a fleet of the small ships by Life-Like in the early 70's. There was the Victory, Bonhome Richard, Brig O War (Which was also the same kit as their Pirate Ship), Cutty Sark, Stag Hound, Revenge, Golden Hind, Santa Maria, Pinta, Nina, Mediterranian Pirate Ship, Mayflower, Constitution, and Constellation (BTW, were both the same kit hee hee).
All the kits were molded in white, had thick molded sails except the Constitution, and most, like the Victory, were missing detail in the stern.
These kits were always on a big clearance table at the Bonanza 88 Cents store for about $.50 each.

I see that ebay has them all the time and they run about $5 plus shipping.

Scott


  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Thursday, April 28, 2005 10:24 AM
I think the Life-Like kits scottrc is talking about are the old Pyro ones. Life-Like, so far as I know, didn't produce any original kits; its products were reissues of other firms' stuff. I can remember seeing quite a few of the old Pyro kits in Life-Like boxes.

Now that my memory has been jogged again, I can vaguely recall some small Pyro kits in addition to the ones I mentioned in my earlier post. They were issued for a while in a strange bronze-colored plastic with a marble-like texture. They were supposed to look like antiques, I think (though the logic of that escapes me). I remember a Cutty Sark, a Flying Cloud, a Constitution, and a Victory in that format.

Pyro actually produced quite a range of sailing ship kits in a wide variety of sizes, ranging from those tiny toy-like kits (the ones my mother thought were "cute") to some fairly serious ones that were about 18" long. Several of them were blatant copies of wood kits from Marine Models and Model Shipways. (The two guys who ran MS referred to Pyro as "Pirate Plastics.") None of them came close to modern standards in terms of detail, but they weren't bad kits for their time - and, I imagine, were instrumental in introducing lots of people to the hobby. They also provide olde phogeys like scottrc and me with the chance to indulge in nostalgia trips.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Monterey Bay, CA
Posted by schoonerbumm on Thursday, April 28, 2005 11:23 AM
It's amazing how things tumble out of the recesses of your mind. I remember my first plastic ship kit, one of those little HMS Victory models... It went for either a quarter or fifty cents, along with several tops from cereal boxes. I'd just seen a movie at school (~2nd grade I think) on Francis Scott Key and the Star Spangled Banner. I was awestruck by the ships. I went home and made my first model out of a Veleveeta box and pencils. Then my mom brought home a box of cereal with an offer for a REAL ship model.

As they say, "the rest is history..."

Alan

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy." Benjamin Franklin

  • Member since
    January 2005
  • From: Las Vegas
Posted by dood_dood on Thursday, April 28, 2005 5:17 PM
Very impressive! I remember the constiution was molded in stark white with no sails. The HMS Victory was molded in a shade of light brown as I recall. The rest were white and all but the Constitutuion I think came with sails. I distinctly remember the Mayflower sitting on the shelf with them, but I never bought it.
All these clues arevery helpful. I appreciate it very much, fellow modelers.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, August 1, 2005 3:06 PM
I built a few of the Airfix ones in the 50s neat little kits came in plastic bags Theres a hobby shop in Vancouver called (what else) Van Hobbies been here for ever They recently had a few of those Kits plus lots of old Frog
  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by DURR on Thursday, August 4, 2005 11:01 PM
i remember pyro also ships in a bottle and a a tug boat and a fire boat both the size of a computer mouse i had the tug i wish i did again it was a nice little kit
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 13, 2005 12:19 PM
Wow... that really opens a door to those fabulous pre-computer era days. There were many but your listing makes me think only of Pyro. In the 1970's I must have built every one of the Pyro kits, back than I built anything wilth a hull. The kits predate my bulding years but those are the issues I built. I prefer commercial ships but in the 70's there were no commercial ship kits available until the Queen Mary came out. I remember these small Pyro kits, Tthe box was the same size as the Pyro 1/32 scale car kits. (about 4x6 inches) Than there were a larger series of ship kits in boxes about 6x8 inches that were much more elaborate and completely different subjects and on up to the largest series of mainly powered vessels that were maybe 14 inches long when complete. It was hard to get my folks to spring for the larger kits, given I built so many models so I got a paper route and the world was at my finger tips! Pyro had a few other unusual size boxes such as the Mississippi River steamers to the President Wilson/Cleveland, the Olympia to the horribly inaccurate Maine. Most Pyro kits with a decent paint made a nice looking model. I think all were eventually released by Lifelike and some eventually Lindberg would release a small number of them. I had a blast back than... I was old enough to enjoy these but young enough not to be obsessed with details. My first kit though was when I was just a lad... maybe about 6 or 8 back in the early 60's when I picked up Revell's "United States" with the stunning box art of the ship passing the Statue of Liberty. To this day my feelings still are that this was absolutely the best box painting of any subject by any kit company from any era. Even back when I was a kid, I kept the box, kept it mint and still have it. I even kept my aweful built up just as a memento of my building roots, it is one of the few built ups I still have of the loads of kits I built during that fantastic period of my life.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, September 13, 2005 12:22 PM
Wow... that really opens a door to those fabulous pre-computer era days. There were many but your listing makes me think only of Pyro. In the 1970's I must have built every one of the Pyro kits, back than I built anything wilth a hull. The kits predate my bulding years but those are the issues I built. I prefer commercial ships but in the 70's there were no commercial ship kits available until the Queen Mary came out. I remember these small Pyro kits, Tthe box was the same size as the Pyro 1/32 scale car kits. (about 4x6 inches) Than there were a larger series of ship kits in boxes about 6x8 inches that were much more elaborate and completely different subjects and on up to the largest series of mainly powered vessels that were maybe 14 inches long when complete. It was hard to get my folks to spring for the larger kits, given I built so many models so I got a paper route and the world was at my finger tips! Pyro had a few other unusual size boxes such as the Mississippi River steamers to the President Wilson/Cleveland, the Olympia to the horribly inaccurate Maine. Most Pyro kits with a decent paint made a nice looking model. I think all were eventually released by Lifelike and some eventually Lindberg would release a small number of them. I had a blast back than... I was old enough to enjoy these but young enough not to be obsessed with details. My first kit though was when I was just a lad... maybe about 6 or 8 back in the early 60's when I picked up Revell's "United States" with the stunning box art of the ship passing the Statue of Liberty. To this day my feelings still are that this was absolutely the best box painting of any subject by any kit company from any era. Even back when I was a kid, I kept the box, kept it mint and still have it. I even kept my aweful built up just as a memento of my building roots, it is one of the few built ups I still have of the loads of kits I built during that fantastic period of my life.
  • Member since
    June 2004
  • From: 29° 58' N 95° 21' W
Posted by seasick on Tuesday, September 13, 2005 11:43 PM
I have seen these kits recently and bought one with a Chinese Junk and a Viking Longboat. I think these kits are owned by sombody that is making them right now. The packaging and the instructions are all "old school" but on modern materials with a copyright of 2002 I think.

Chasing the ultimate build.

  • Member since
    August 2005
  • From: vernon hills illinois
Posted by sumpter250 on Wednesday, September 14, 2005 4:56 PM
It was these kits, on Christmas morning, that kept me busy until the family was up and ready to "do Christmas", that got me started building scale models!
Thanks, it's nice to have some memories awakened once in a while.
Pete

Lead me not into temptation ..................I can find it myself

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Wednesday, September 14, 2005 8:39 PM
I think the kits seasick is talking about are from Glencoe, an enterprising, one-man operation that specializes in reissuing old kits from the Dark Ages. I'm pretty sure the Viking ship and Chinese junk are from old ITC molds. Glencoe has reissued quite a few old ITC kits.

It's easy nowadays to look down one's nose at those old kits from ITC - and they certainly don't come up to 21st-century standards in terms of detail or accuracy. But the company was remarkably progressive in its choice of subjects. Some of the ITC ship subjects have never been touched again by any manufacturer: WWI subchaser, Coast Guard surfboat, yacht Atlantic, etc.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    June 2004
  • From: 29° 58' N 95° 21' W
Posted by seasick on Wednesday, September 14, 2005 11:15 PM
These kits are a little outdated, but I'm game for scratchbuilding improvements. Painting can also hide lack of detail. Price is good and its nice to have a kit that can be built in about 1 bench hour. Smile [:)]

Chasing the ultimate build.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:10 PM
I remember them well. I built the same ships myself. (I'm 48) I think I saw those same kits on ebay a few months ago, but I don't remember the manufactuer. I'm still kicking myself for not biding on them.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 6:49 PM
i built the golden hind by life like and still have it. all so have theflying cloud still sealed.
life like made them in the 70 whitch were the ex-pyro shipslife like went out in 78.
i think i have the half moon too. can't be sure any more. and running to the garage attic every time i want to remember what i have. had all of it in a book but when i started to sell every thing my code worked for a wile but now i'm not sure. i all so use a collectors value guide for all plastic models put out by John W, Burns. i need to up date it mine is the sixth.
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