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Model Expo's Sultana Entry level wooden model

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  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Madison, Mississippi
Model Expo's Sultana Entry level wooden model
Posted by Donnie on Friday, January 6, 2006 10:58 PM
I thought aobut this one, and was wondering about the hull. I know that the hull comes preformed. However, I was wondering if you still have to plank the solid hull, or do you just paint it like it is. If you paint it like it is, then is the hull pre-scribed to give a planking look ?

I bought the Bluenose many year ago, and I got the hull done, but man oh man I got so tired of making the square openings for the scuppers. It just about, well it did, burn me out of all of that repetitous hole making. Then the wood just became brittle that ,,well,, long story. I want to finish this boat, but it is just too much for me at the time.

I like wood as well as plastic. I really enjoyed my Jolly Roger (le flore) and what tempeted me about the Sultana is that it is an entry level. But I have questions about the hull. I guess that I am shy now about the hull routine, becuase I do not want to get burned out with the hull again.

Mr. Tilley or anyone else, what do you all think ?  Question [?]

In Progress: OcCre's Santisima Trindad Finished Builds: Linbergs "Jolly Roger" aka La Flore Mantua's Cannone Da Costa Americano linberg's "Cptn Kidd" aka Wappen Von Hamburg Model Shipways 1767 Sultana Midwest Boothbay Lobsterboat (R/C)

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Friday, January 6, 2006 11:32 PM

The Model Shipways Sultana was the first wood ship model I ever built.  I have extremely pleasant memories of it - a nice kit representing a beautiful little ship.

I should note that I built mine a long time ago.  I know Model Shipways has updated the kit in many ways; I really don't know how different the latest version may be from the one I built back in the early seventies.

My understanding is that it comes with a machine-carved basswood hull.  That means the hull is one piece of wood, "carved" by a lathe of the type used to make furniture legs.  That process produces a basically correct shape, but has its limitations.  The typical machine-carved hull has good, accurate lines, but components that are relatively thin are either omitted or deliberately made oversized.  The modeler has to thin down the bulwarks, and add such parts as the keel, stem, sternpost, and rudder.  A few rough spots generally need to be smoothed out, and the entire hull needs careful sanding.  Such pieces as railings, wales, and moldings have to be made from the stripwood supplied, according to the plans.  The process of building one of theses kits is quite different from building a plastic sailing ship kit.  Not necessarily more difficult - but different.

To my knowledge, no machine-carved hull has pre-scribed planking detail.  The deck planking is applied separately, generally in the form of basswood sheet with grooves scribed in it.  Some modelers "plank" the exteriors of machine-carved hulls with thin strips of veneer.  Most just paint the hulls in the appropriate colors.  Plenty of experienced modelers argue that such a finish is preferable to out-of-scale planking grooves.  It's a matter of personal preference.

Some of the more elaborate fittings (gun barrels and carriages, for example) are provided in the form of either brass turnings or britannia metal castings.  (Britannia metal is an alloy of tin and brass.  It looks and works pretty much like lead, but is far more durable - an excellent modeling material.)  The masts and yards are provided in the form of dowels, usually with the basic taper turned in.  I believe Model Shipways is currently supplying wood blocks and deadeyes with all its kits.  (Bluejacket opts for britannia metal ones.)  The kit is rounded out by several spools of thread and a set of plans and instructions.  (Model Shipways is famous for the high quality of its plans.) 

With the caveat that I haven't seen the latest version of the Sultana, I can recommend it with enthusiasm.  This would be a great kit to break into wood ship modeling.  If you do decide to order it, I recommend that you also order (from the same source, Model Expo) a copy of The Neophyte Shipmodeler's Jackstay, by George M. Campbell.  This is an old classic book that Model Shipways published many years ago as an introduction to the building of wood kits based on solid hulls.  It's well illustrated, very reasonably priced, and full of valuable tips on modeling.  And anybody who memorized all the information in that book about sailing ships and their evolution would be well on the way to being knowledgeable about the subject.

Hope this helps a little.  Good luck.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Texas
Posted by Yankee Clipper on Tuesday, January 10, 2006 10:11 AM
If it might be of interest, I track ship model kits on e-bay. I have data on the Sultana for about the pass five months. Althought I do not distingush between the Yellow Box (old) kit and the new, the average price going for a Sultana kit is $47. That included postage. Current price of Sultana from Model Expo is about $80 plus postage. Hope this might be of assistance in your decission making.
  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Tuesday, January 10, 2006 10:46 AM

I don't know how much Model Shipways has changed the kit since I built mine (a long time ago).  I see by the photo on the Model Expo site that the current version has carriage guns on the deck; mine didn't.  (In terms of accuracy I can believe either.)  Mine had wood blocks and white metal deadeyes; I believe the current kit has wood blocks and deadeyes.  I have no idea how much the other fittings have been changed - if at all.

Model Shipways used to cast its fittings in what was euphemistically referred to as "white metal" (i.e., lead alloy).  It's a notoriously unstable substance; that's why ship model companies now use the much more expensive britannia metal instead.  Lead disintegrates over time - at an unpredictable rate.  In my workshop I have some Model Shipways lead fittings that I bought more than thirty years ago, and they're in fine shape.  I've also seen lead fittings start to "flower" after a couple of years.  An old kit for sale on E-bay may - especially if it's in one of the old traditional MS yellow boxes - have lead fittings.  And they may be as good as new, or they may have disintegrated into piles of white powder.

I do know that in its various incarnations the Sultana kit has had at least three different sets of plans.  The ones in the kit I built were by none other than Howard I. Chapelle, the dean of the history of American naval architecture.  They were nice, workable plans, but hardly Chapelle's best work; I think he may have done them as a favor for the owners of MS, who were personal friends.  The instructions in my kit consisted of a single, oversized sheet of sketches by George Campbell.  Adequate for the purpose, but that's all.  For a while the kit was being sold with plans by a gentleman named Harry Puls.  And the current edition has plans by Ben Lankford - one of the best in the business.  I believe it also has a much more detailed set of instructions, in the form of a book by Mr. Lankford.

All this is worth taking into consideration in deciding how to spend your money.  In any form, it's a nice kit representing a beautiful little ship.

 

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 8:48 AM

 Donnie wrote:

I bought the Bluenose many year ago, and I got the hull done, but man oh man I got so tired of making the square openings for the scuppers. It just about, well it did, burn me out of all of that repetitous hole making. Then the wood just became brittle that ,,well,, long story. I want to finish this boat, but it is just too much for me at the time. 

The MS Bluenose kit is one I really fancy building in future. Your experience is a bit off-putting and echoes other comments I've read about it. Perhaps I should wait until I have more experience before attempting this. It does seem odd that Model Shipways kits like this are often recommended to beginners though.

Blighty

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Madison, Mississippi
Posted by Donnie on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 11:06 AM
It is quite crazy to recommend anything like to someone starting out like this. I also found that Model Expos website has "click here" for beginning the hobby and they take you right to a plank-on-hull kit and practically ingnore the sultana. As a matter of fact, they should have listed ALL the kits that are starters only for those starting. It would be good if they grouped the kits by level on the web site. Oh well, they want to sell their stuff and they want people to succeed? Then the web site needs some work done to it.

Donnie

In Progress: OcCre's Santisima Trindad Finished Builds: Linbergs "Jolly Roger" aka La Flore Mantua's Cannone Da Costa Americano linberg's "Cptn Kidd" aka Wappen Von Hamburg Model Shipways 1767 Sultana Midwest Boothbay Lobsterboat (R/C)

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 11:38 AM

I've never been among Model Expo's biggest fans.  The company apparently makes most of its money selling those continental European plank-on-bulkhead kits, most of which, in my opinion, are overpriced garbage.  I'm convinced that those kits have been responsible for driving far more people out of the hobby than they've brought into it.

Model Shipways kits are on a different planet.  They're designed by people who understand ships, and understand what scale modeling is about.  (I sometimes wonder whether the people in charge of Mamoli, Corel, Constructo, Artesania Latina, etc. really know what a scale model is.)

In Model Expo's defense, it's just recently brought back a group of the old Model Shipways solid hull kits after a long hiatus.  I don't know the whole story, but as I understand it ME had trouble for a long time finding a firm to which it could farm out the making of the machine-carved hulls.  For quite a while all Model Shipways kits were either plank-on-frame or plank-on-bulkhead.  I notice that most of the solid-hull kits are marked "out of stock" on the website; I imagine that has to do with stocking and shipping problems.  My guess is that the rest of the website will get updated when the supply of solid-hull kits becomes more regular.

Both the plank-on-bulkhead and solid hull styles have things to recommend them.  The machine-carved hull obviously saves the modeler the task of shaping and mounting all those individual planks.  On the other hand, a machine-carved hull, right out of the box, can look like a rathe intimidating amorphous blob.  It doesn't have a centerline, or any other reference points on it.  The modeler has to figure all those point out before doing anything else.  Some people, quite understandably, find that a little intimidating.

I'm inclined to suggest solid hull kits for first-timers.  But there's room for argument about that.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

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