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Photoetch for USCG Eagle

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  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Photoetch for USCG Eagle
Posted by Powder Monkey on Friday, March 10, 2006 10:32 PM
I have finally finished the photoetch fret for the 1/350 USCG Eagle.

Here is a picture of the fret. I made railings, ratlines, a propeller, the cage around the radar, the gratings on either side of the wheel, and ladders. The ratlines took a while to draw because I added the sag to each line. I also made some eyebolts for future projects. The frets are etched from 0.005" brass. I also made some eyebolts from 0.010" material in case the thinner ones weren't strong enough. The eyebolts have an outer diameter of 0.040" and an inner diameter of 0.020".







I don't know how well the detail shows up in these photos. It is hard to get close enough without losing focus. I have installed the railings, ratlines and the radar cage. The gratings are barely visible. They are so small that they are hard to see even in person!

The big gap at the waterline is because the parts are not glued yet. I just wanted to see how it would look. All comments are welcome.

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Upper left side of the lower Penninsula of Mich
Posted by dkmacin on Saturday, March 11, 2006 6:42 AM
Beautiful kit!
Too bad it has to be ruined with that darn racing stripe on the bow.
I'll bet the photoetch was a bear to do.

Don

I know it's only rock and roll, but I like it.
  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Saturday, March 11, 2006 9:58 AM
The decals are very misaligned. I am thinking of leaving them off! It actually looks good without them.

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Greenville,Michigan
Posted by millard on Saturday, March 11, 2006 7:27 PM

If your building the Eagle prior to 1976  you can leave off the decals.Great Photo Etch are you going to reproduce more for resale.If you do I'd be interested.

Rod

  • Member since
    February 2006
Posted by PBoilermaker on Saturday, March 11, 2006 8:46 PM
 millard wrote:

If your building the Eagle prior to 1976  you can leave off the decals.Great Photo Etch are you going to reproduce more for resale.If you do I'd be interested.

Rod

I'd be interested in a set, too.

-Mike

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Saturday, March 11, 2006 10:08 PM
Me too.  Looks great!

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Derry, New Hampshire, USA
Posted by rcboater on Saturday, March 11, 2006 11:27 PM
I'd be very intereseted in a set as well!


Webmaster, Marine Modelers Club of New England

www.marinemodelers.org

 

  • Member since
    March 2005
  • From: West Virginia, USA
Posted by mfsob on Sunday, March 12, 2006 9:50 AM
*chuckles at the racing stripe reference* I remember when I was a reporter, I once commented on that blaze orange stripe to a Coast Guard station commander. He replied that it was a public service on the USCG's part to all the drug runners, smugglers and illegal aliens, so they could spot the ships even sooner and get rid of all the evidence of illegal activity, thus sparing the US the tedium and expense of arrests, trials and incarceration. Blindfold [X-)]
  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Monday, March 13, 2006 7:28 PM
Wow! Thanks for all the interest. I could certainly make more. If you are interested in a set, or the eyebolts, send me an e-mail at pengel(at)bluefrog.com. You know the drill, change the (at) to an @.

  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Wednesday, March 15, 2006 7:55 PM
Disaster has struck! I was trying to glue on the bottom of the hull. It did not fit well and required a bit of muscle. Well, my fat fingers broke one of the ratlines. The gratings by the ship's wheel popped off, and worst of all, I got liquid cement on my finger and smeared the white paint into the red. I have reattached the grates and extracted the remants of the ratlines. Luckily, I am making some more sets of photoetch! I think the paint can be touched up without problem. I just had to walk away for a while before I destroyed everythingAngry [:(!]

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, March 16, 2006 8:07 PM
Did you use AutoCad to design the fret?
  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Thursday, March 16, 2006 8:24 PM
I did use Autocad. I used the model, a copy of plans supplied by Dr. Tilley and a bunch of photographs of the real ship to come up with the designs. I plotted them on paper for a test fit. The ratlines fit well. The railings are a little long but can be trimmed to fit. The most time consuming part was putting the sag in the ratlines. Each one was done separately. The sag gets less as you go up and the spans are shorter.

Does anyone know if the ratline sizes are standard across the Imai series of tall ships? I haven't seen any of the other kits, so I don't know if any of the ratlines or railings will work on the other kits.

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Friday, March 17, 2006 1:25 AM

I haven't seen all the Imai sail training ships by any means, but if they're at all accurate (as I think they are) they won't have interchangeable shrouds and ratlines.  The heights of the masts, the number of shrouds, and the spacing between them vary from ship to ship. 

The obvious exceptions are the kits that use interchangeable hulls and masts.  I imagine the same parts would work for the Eagle, Gorch Fock, and Sagres.  (The original Gorch Fock and the Sagres were/are sister ships of the Eagle - exept for that nagging problem of length.  The present Gorch Fock, sometimes referred to as the Gorch Fock II, was built more recently, but is in general quite similar to the original one.  My guess is that Imai used the same parts for it.)

You might be able to get away with a generic set of shrouds and ratlines, drawn deliberately oversized to be cut to the dimensions of the particular model.  I don't know for sure whether that would work, but it might be worth investigating.

One point to watch:  I'm pretty sure that some of the lower "ratlines" of those training ships are in fact iron or steel bars.  Many latter-day sailing ships used such gear - though the Eagle doesn't.  The metal "ratlines" obviously don't sag - so they'd be a lot easier to draw.  (Believe me, I'm intimately familiar with the problem of drawing the sag in all those rope ratlines.)  Best to check pictures of the actual ship.

At this point the last thing you probably want to here is another idea for photo-etched parts - but does your fret also include the shrouds and ratlines for the fore and main topmasts?  Another good subject be the safety netting under the bowsprit.  It's quite prominent, and if done to scale would really add something to a model.

Regarding decals - if you do want to include the "racing stripe," you might want to seek out the sheet of generic Coast Guard aircraft insignia from Superscale (aka Microscale).  It includes lots of beautfully-printed CG shields in several sizes, as well as the "U.S. Coast Guard" lettering in the right font.  (That font, incidentally, is called Zurich Bold Extended.  It's among the fonts that come with WordPerfect.)  I'm not sure whether any of the sizes on the sheet would work for a 1/350 Eagle, but it would be worth checking out.

If you decide to dispense with the stripe and represent the ship in her pre-1976 configuration, you'll probably want to study some pictures.  She's undergone quite a few modifications since then.  Maybe the most conspicuous one concerns the rigging of the spanker.  I believe the kit has the "double spanker" rig, with two gaffs.  That's how the ship was rigged originally, in her German days.  Shortly after the CG took possession of her the lower gaff was removed - perhaps because the double spanker rig was rather distinctly German.  She sailed for many years with a single gaff and boom.  I don't know exactly when the double spanker rig was restored; I think it may have been part of a major refit she underwent in the early nineties.  

Hope that helps a little.  Good luck.    

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Upper left side of the lower Penninsula of Mich
Posted by dkmacin on Friday, March 17, 2006 5:53 AM
Is that superscale decal sheet still available?
It used to be for 1/72nd scale and not include the letters U.S. which is now used in front of the COAST GUARD, (as if people would confuse the aircraft with the Canadian or other Coast Guards)

Don

I know it's only rock and roll, but I like it.
  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Friday, March 17, 2006 8:33 AM
 jtilley wrote:


At this point the last thing you probably want to here is another idea for photo-etched parts - but does your fret also include the shrouds and ratlines for the fore and main topmasts?  Another good subject be the safety netting under the bowsprit.  It's quite prominent, and if done to scale would really add something to a model.



I had thought about making those. I guess I just got too impatient and wanted to get something done. There seems to be alot of interest in my photoetching. Let me know things to add for the next time or for other ships. I have both the Jolly Roger and Captain Kidd at home. One of them, I don't remember which, has some grates molded into the deck. How about some etched replacements?

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Friday, March 17, 2006 9:54 AM

Regarding decals - I don't know whether that Superscale sheet can still be found or not.  I bought mine a long time ago.  As I understand it, Superscale nowadays doesn't do repeat runs of aircraft decals; when a particular sheet is sold out, it's gone.  A few minutes ago I took a stab at finding that sheet on the Squadron Mail Order site; no luck.  I suspect quite a few copies are knocking around hobby shops and the private stashes of aircraft modelers.  I'm no expert at locating obscure aircraft decal sheets; maybe somebody in the aircraft section of the Forum could help.

The sheet was indeed labeled "1/72 scale."  But it covered quite a few different airplanes and helicopters, and included shields and lettering in quite a few sizes.  Whether one of them would work for a 1/350 Eagle I don't know.

When I was doing drawings for the Coast Guard Historian's Office I had occasion to get shown around the Coast Guard Air Station at Elizabeth City, NC.  I think that was in either 1990 or early 1991 (I'm not a hundred percent sure).  The station had just taken delivery on a brand new, shiny Hercules, which had "U.S. Coast Guard" painted on the fuselage.  The other aircraft on the station (mainly Pelican helicopters) just had "Coast Guard" painted on them.  The explanation, according to the pilot who was showing me around, was that George Bush's Secretary of Transportation had directed that "U.S." be added to the logo.  Newly-acquired aircraft were painted that way, and older ones were getting the "U.S." added as they got repainted in the course of maintenance.  I imagine ships were being treated the same way.  The Superscale sheet was issued a few years earlier (I don't know exactly when), so it doesn't have the "U.S."   As I remember, though, there are several copies of the lettering in each size on the sheet.  So an Eagle modeler would have a couple of options:  depict her in her pre-first-Bush-administration configuration (she would have had the "slash," shield, and "Coast Guard" from 1976 until at least 1989), or scavenge a U out of GUARD and an S out of COAST.

Another solution, if your computer has the Zurich Bold Extended font, would be to buy some decal paper and make the lettering yourself.  Nitpickers beware:  that's a pretty distinctive font.  Several more common ones look almost like it, but not quite.  To find out whether a model of a Coast Guard aircraft or vessel really has the right lettering, take a close look at the lower half of the capital G.

I'm a big believer in cross-pollenation in the hobby; I think aircraft, ship, armor, figure, and railroad modelers have a lot to learn from each other.  But cross-pollenation does have its limits.  Some years ago I worked as a judge in a ship model competition that emphasized Coast Guard-related models.  One guy had entered a nice model of some modern CG vessel or other (I have no idea which one) with a beautifully-rendered "slash" and shield on the bow.  The modeler's only problem was that he hadn't figured on getting a near-sighted judge.  (I have trouble recognizing my wife from across a room, but until recently I could do almost all model-related tasks without my glasses.)  It struck me that the lettering on that CG shield looked a little odd.  Close inspection revealed that it read "Union Pacific."  Oops.

Regarding additional photo-etched parts - I do think there's a small market for sailing ship parts.  Several companies make square-mesh sheets that work for gratings, but finding them in a believable size is a hit-or-miss game.  A series of grating sheets on various common scales, to be cut to size and shape by the modeler, would certainly be welcome.  Generic netting, for such purposes as the bowsprit netting I mentioned earlier, also would be nice to have.  On really small scales (1/350 and downward), photo-etched footropes, with built-in sag, might look ok.  (They'd have to be custom-made for individual yards on specific ships, though.)  One fairly straightforward subject for photo-etching that I personally would like to see is a set of lettering, to represent carved lettering on a ship's bow and/or stern.  It would be particularly helpful to have such an alphabet in inclined lettering.  If you prowl the railroad decal department of a good hobby shop you can occasionally find gold alphabets that lean to the right (for the starboard side of a ship's bow), but left-leaning alphabets (for the port side) seem to be almost unheard of. 

The big limitation of photo-etching for sailing ships models, of course, is the limitation on thickness.  To my eye, at least, photo-etched parts representing three-dimensional prototype parts (railings, shrouds, and ratlines, for example) look great on 1/700 scale and pretty good on 1/350.  On larger scales than that, the "flatness" becomes problematic.  A photo-etched guardrail or ladder on any scale bigger than that starts to look like a piece of tape with holes in it.  My inclination is to think that, on the larger scales that most sailing ship modelers deal with, photo-etching is most effective to represent stuff that really is flat.

Those are just some random thoughts.  The topic is certainly worth discussing; I imagine other Forum members will have some other ideas. 

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Friday, March 17, 2006 1:31 PM
 jtilley wrote:

Regarding additional photo-etched parts - I do think there's a small market for sailing ship parts. 



The market does not have to be too large for me. If I can make a dozen copies, I can cover my costs for making the things I can use.Big Smile [:D]

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Upper left side of the lower Penninsula of Mich
Posted by dkmacin on Friday, March 17, 2006 7:52 PM
That sheet is OLD.
It was made for the Airfix 1/72 Herc, the Monogram 1/72 Albatross and the Aurora 1/72 H3E(F).
The shields are too big for the 1/72 scale Matchbox/ Revell of Germany SA365N (HH65) so I think they would be too big for the Eagle too. I'll check it out tomorrow.
As for the changes to US and Coast Guard, I was in Detroit at that time and we had the last three white painted HH65A's. All the others were painted orange with the white racing stripe. . .ugly!
Lets hope they never decide to paint the Eagle orange.
Let us know if those rat lines are available I might be able to scare up some change for a set.

Don

I know it's only rock and roll, but I like it.
  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Tuesday, March 28, 2006 9:06 PM
Here is a shot of the brass propeller installed. I photoetched the propeller and the hub on the side you can't see. The rounded end of the hub I made from an old brass tack. I chucked it up in the lathe and had at it with a file and sandpaper.



  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Greenville,Michigan
Posted by millard on Sunday, April 2, 2006 4:58 PM

I received a set of these Photo etch from Powder monkey  yesterday.I must say very good .Pete did and excellant job on them.They will also work on other Imai 1/350 sailing ships.I'm going to order more sets in the near future.He also makes a fret of eyebolts that he sells seperate that I got.Tons of uses for them.Thanks Pete.

Rod

 

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Upper left side of the lower Penninsula of Mich
Posted by dkmacin on Sunday, April 2, 2006 5:22 PM
Okay, How much for a set?

Don

I know it's only rock and roll, but I like it.
  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: Walworth, NY
Posted by Powder Monkey on Sunday, April 2, 2006 7:19 PM
 millard wrote:

I received a set of these Photo etch from Powder monkey  yesterday.I must say very good .Pete did and excellant job on them.They will also work on other Imai 1/350 sailing ships.I'm going to order more sets in the near future.He also makes a fret of eyebolts that he sells seperate that I got.Tons of uses for them.Thanks Pete.

Rod

 



Thanks for the kind words. I am glad you like them. Which of the Imai ships have you checked them against? Do you think they will work across the board?

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Greenville,Michigan
Posted by millard on Monday, April 3, 2006 10:04 PM

Pete

  Looks like Imai kits Esmeralda,Gorch Fock, and Sagres.The railing should fit with no problem.I'm going to check out the Nippon Maru also.

Rod

  • Member since
    January 2021
Posted by Zidu61 on Wednesday, January 20, 2021 3:00 PM

Hello

I read this 16 year old post with great interest. Power Monkey, I would be very interested in your photoeteched set for USCGC Eagle in scale 1/350 if it is still relevant after such a long time. Please see the PM.

 

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