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Jolly Roger Captain Kidd Steering ?

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  • Member since
    November 2005
Jolly Roger Captain Kidd Steering ?
Posted by Anonymous on Thursday, October 19, 2006 8:26 PM
Hey folks, I'm new here and I've been sitting back and reading for a couple of weeks now. I have a question, here goes, I have purchased both Jolly Roger and Captain Kidd, am building Kidd have not opened Roger, where is the big wooden steering wheel that you allways see on the old ships in the movies? This is my first ship, when I was a kid I started the Bon Homme Richard but didn't have the attention span to finish it. My thing has been WWII Air, mostly german. Thanks!
  • Member since
    June 2006
Posted by Paul5910 on Thursday, October 19, 2006 11:14 PM
Mike, I just finished the Kidd and there is no steering wheel.  I just started the jolly roger and it does have the wheel.  Both build into great models.  Do a search and check out the builds of each by Donnie.  You will be impressed I think.  I know I was.

Paul
  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Friday, October 20, 2006 12:56 AM

Both those kits are reissues of Lindberg products from the sixties.  The "Captain Kidd" was originally the German two-decked warship Wappen von Hamburg, and the "Jolly Roger" was originally the French frigate La Flore.  Bearing in mind the standards of plastic kits forty years ago, they're reasonably accurate, well-detailed kits.  The names on the current boxes are nothing more or less than a marketing stunt.  Neither of those actual ships had anything to do with piracy; it's extremely unlikely, if not downright impossible, that any pirate vessel ever looked like either of them.  Both were big, expensive warships, far beyond the means of any pirate to buy, man, or maintain.

The Wappen von Hamburg dates from around 1675, La Flore from the late eighteenth century.  Nobody knows just when the steering wheel was invented, but it's generally accepted to have originated in Britain sometime early in the eighteenth century.  So for La Flore to have a wheel and the Wappen von Hamburg not to have one is almost certainly correct.  The Wappen von Hamburg presumably was steered with a whipstaff - a simple vertical shaft connected to the forward end of the tiller.  In order for it to be practical, the whipstaff could only project one deck above the level of the tiller itself.  (It pivoted on a simple "axle" just below the deck on which the helmsman stood; the tiller swung back and forth underneath.  If the whipstaff had stuck up through the next deck above, it would have been impractical for the helmsman to swing it.)  So it isn't visible above the weather decks on the finished model.  Lindberg got that one right.

If you're interested in scale sailing ship modeling, don't pay too much attention to the ships in the movies.  With a few notable exceptions (e.g., the excellent "Master and Commander" and "The Bounty"), Hollywood representations of sailing ships are pretty laughable.  (Let's not talk about the ones in the cable TV "Hornblower" series, or the "Pirates of the Caribbean" movies.)

Hope that helps a little.  Good luck.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 13, 2006 6:57 PM
Hey you guys! Lotsa help, thanks much!
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