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i am drawing a blank

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  • Member since
    February 2016
Posted by alumni72 on Monday, August 20, 2007 1:21 AM

I just recently finished rereading a favorite book of mine - 73 North, b Dudley Pope.  It recounts the Battle of the Barents Sea at the end of 1942, when four RN destroyers successfully defended a convoy above the Arctic Circle from an attack by the Hipper, Lutzow, and six German destroyers.  The failure to sink a single convoy ship in this attack was the trigger for Hitler's disbanding the German Navy.

The book also discusses, at length, the ideological differences between the German Naval staff and your run of the mill Nazi - Hitler in particular viewed the Navy as old school and aristocratic, a throwback to pre-WWI Germany.  He had felt it was necessary to retain this element in the regime in order to appeal to more Germans as the Nazis attempted to gain power, and that aristocratic air remained until Raeder was replaced by Donitz.  Hitler at the same time distrusted the Navy, as did many Germans, feeling that they had their own agenda apart from that of the Nazi party - the scuttling of the German High Seas Fleet at the end of WWI was the primary cause of that distrust.  So the Navy was never a part of Hitler's inner circle - no naval officer ever went to jail with Hitler, threw rocks through the windows of Jewish shops, participated in the Night of the Long Knives, or engaged in beer hall brawls in his name in the early days. 

The German Navy was indeed a throwback to earlier days - the days of 'gentlemanly' warfare, the Emden and the Goeben, and when U-boat commanders gave a ship's crew time to man their lifeboats before their ship was torpedoed.  Unfortunately for them, they were handcuffed by Hitler's diametrically opposed demands, that they attack the enemy while at the same time not taking any risks.

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by DURR on Sunday, August 19, 2007 10:41 PM

early in the war some of the ship's commanders where old school navy  (gentlemen if u will)

battle was much like the old gentlemen's duels of old yes a victor and a loser   with respect towards each other

MJH
  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Melbourne, Australia
Posted by MJH on Sunday, August 19, 2007 10:21 PM

It appears the German Navy's surface fleet, at least at this early stage, were not too badly infected with Nazism and still respected their opponents, a state of mind reflected later on the British side after the Bismarck was sunk.

Your enquiry caused me to research this matter a little further and I came across the remarkable photo below, apparently taken from Hipper's bridge, or crowsnest, and showing Glowworm making smoke as a shell hits the water short.  I've never seen this before.

Refer to; http://www.maritimequest.com/daily_event_archive/2006/april/08_hms_glowworm.htm

Michael 

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  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by DURR on Sunday, August 19, 2007 3:57 PM
after all this   i found the whole story on an old  sea classics  mag in my ref library
  • Member since
    February 2016
Posted by alumni72 on Sunday, August 19, 2007 11:43 AM
What a great story - I had forgotten completely about that!
MJH
  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Melbourne, Australia
Posted by MJH on Saturday, August 18, 2007 11:53 PM

I suspect you are referring to the action between the German Heavy Cruiser Admiral von Hipper and Destroyer, HMS Glowworm, during the Norwegian campaign early in the war.

 

The following, relating to events after Glowworm sank in the unequal fight, is a quote from;  http://www.historyofwar.org/articles/weapons_HMSGlowworm.html

 

"The Captain of the Hipper, Helmuth Heye, gallantly stayed for over an hour picking up survivors. He positioned Hipper so that the tidal currents would carry the survivors to them. All the personnel on deck helped with hauling survivors aboard but many were too exhausted to make the final effort of climbing up the ropes and ladders and slipped away, including Lt Cdr Roope who helped many of his men to get life jackets on and to get to ladders. Out of a crew of 149, only 31 survived, the only officer being Lt Robert Ramsey. The prisoners were treated well by the Germans who congratulated them on a good fight, and Captain Heye told the men that their Captain was a brave man. Later, Heye sent a message through the International Red Cross recommending Lt Cdr Roope for the Victoria Cross, the only time in British history that a VC has been recommended by the enemy. The survivors spent the rest of the war as PoWs and afterwards, Lt Ramsey was able to return home and tell the whole story. The story was published on the 10th July 1945, in the Fourth Supplement to the London Gazette for Friday, 6th July 1945. As a result, Lt Cdr Roope was awarded the Victoria Cross, Lt Ramsey the Distinguished Service Order and three other ratings received the Conspicuous Gallantry Medal".

Michael 

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  • Member since
    April 2005
Posted by ddp59 on Saturday, August 18, 2007 11:24 PM
hmas sydney & german raider kormoran 19 nov. 1941?
  • Member since
    March 2007
  • From: Carmel, CA
Posted by bondoman on Saturday, August 18, 2007 10:11 PM
Sounds like Von Luckner in the first war. Don't know
  • Member since
    July 2013
i am drawing a blank
Posted by DURR on Saturday, August 18, 2007 10:08 PM
there was in wwii a british  ship that was sunk by thee ger. and the ger commander put the ship and the capt/crew in for a medal   the was a post on here about it and in it a web site about the story  can anyone remember it
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