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finishing (weathering/panel lines/varnishes) with enamel paint base ...

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  • Member since
    November, 2016
finishing (weathering/panel lines/varnishes) with enamel paint base ...
Posted by zubin31 on Sunday, November 06, 2016 1:20 AM

hi,

i've made model kits before but this is the first time i'm venturing into the more advance techniques such as panel lines, weathering and varnishes. my understanding is as follows -

paint the model kit, apply varnish to protect the underlying paint, apply decals, apply varnish again to protect the decals, apply panel lines/weathering and a final coat of varnish (if needed).

broadly speaking, is the above procedure correct? 

also - i paint using enamels (modelmaster). online, i mainly see varnishes for protecting acrylic paints. can i use the same acrylic varnish for enamel paints? would it cause any issues? 

if acrylic varnishes cause issues with enamels, then what varnish/protective coat should i use for my enamels, so that if i do panel lines/weathering (and clean it later using a thinner), the enamel paint coat is not effected?

noob here in these advance techniques ... please help :)

z.

 

  • Member since
    January, 2006
  • From: NW Washington
Posted by dirkpitt77 on Monday, November 14, 2016 5:09 PM

Hi! Looks like your post fell through the cracks. Maybe I can help bump it and get some more input.

Broadly speaking, yes, your procedure sounds good. Paint coat, then gloss coat for decals, apply decals, then flat coat if your subject is military--gloss coat if other, then you start going on with your weathering materials.

I BELIEVE you would be ok using an acrylic clearcoat (varnish) over the enamel AS LONG AS that enamel has fully cured. I personally am not a fan of enamel paints due to their longer cure times. You may try testing an acrylic varnish over a piece of scrap that's been painted with enamel, just to be assured of success. I have some old builds I use for this purpose.

Hope this helps.

--Chris

 

    "Some say the alien didn't die in the crash.  It survived and drank whiskey and played poker with the locals 'til the Texas Rangers caught wind of it and shot it dead."

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Monday, November 14, 2016 5:55 PM

Yes, you can use acrylic clear coats over enamel paint base coats without ill effects. As long as you give the enamel base coat enough time to dry and cure. Or vice versa using enamel clear coats over acrylic paint base coats. I have done both for many years. The dissimilar layers can be critical in some cases, particularly with washes- the dissimilar layer has to be in between the wash and the base color to prevent bad interactions. You do not want to apply an oil or enamel wash over an enamel base color without a clear acrylic layer in between.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Monday, November 14, 2016 7:15 PM

I will throw my thoughts in here.......One thing I have found when spraying MM Acrylic clear flat is that it seems to lighten the basecoat , sort of a dusty whitish look so now I shoot either Testors clear flat lacquer or Alclad Flat Clear.

You should try using Flory Washes. They are clay/water based and are fantastic. Keep a seperate brush for it and do not contaminate the wash, otherwise you will ruin the product. It's available only from the UK but it's very affordable cuz they charge a flat shipping fee of about $4 or $5.

  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Northern New Jersey
Posted by Tojo72 on Monday, November 14, 2016 7:24 PM

I second the Flory Washes,they are very nearly fool proof.I did my Mig 29 in Model Master Enamels,and seal with Future,the Flory worked great,then I sealed it with MM Lacquer Flat.

  • Member since
    January, 2009
  • From: hamburg michigan
Posted by fermis on Monday, November 14, 2016 8:12 PM

I'll throw in a couple cents too!

I use nothing but ModelMaster enamels. I gloss with Minwax clear gloss lacquer (a quart is far cheaper than buying MM lacquer gloss!!! I mix it about 50/50 with store brand lacquer thinner). After the gloss...decals...gloss again, just over the decals.

For the washes. I make my own, using acrylic craft paints. I does not take much paint at all...maybe 1/4 paint to water ratio, with a drop or two of dish soap. I just slop some on the model with a brush, then rub it all over with my finger. Let dry, then wipe away the excess with a soft, damp cloth. Sometimes it takes a repeat or two to get what ya want. Once happy, I'll spray MM dull coat, then do any further weathering with pastel chalks.

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Monday, November 14, 2016 9:26 PM

PJ brought up a good point (among all the many good points in this thread)- alteration of colors. Generally speaking, gloss coats will darken your base coat, while flat or satin coats will lighten them again when applied over the gloss coated paint. And sling that same train of thought. Washes will stain any flat paint that they are applied upon directly upon the paint with no gloss clear coat over it-even Flory's stuff. The gloss coat with its smooth surface alleviates that. 

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    November, 2016
Posted by zubin31 on Tuesday, November 15, 2016 12:59 AM

thanks for the ton of replies and inputs .. and thanks dirkpitt for bumping up the thread. it helped me a lot and im sure any future newbie who's venturing into the weathering aspect of model making.

i'll ensure i give enough cure time to the enamel base coat and then use the clear coat before on over the decals before going for weathering. luckily i have enough spare parts to try this techinique before ruining my model :P

and will def try out the flory washes!!!

thanks a ton again guys!!!

will keep you posted. happy modelling :)

 

  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Tuesday, November 15, 2016 2:04 PM

Forgot to mention if using Future for decal prep, make sure you let the Future cure at least 2 days to prevent clouding up the Future around and over the decal specially when using decal setting solutions.

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Tuesday, November 15, 2016 2:37 PM

plasticjunkie

Forgot to mention if using Future for decal prep, make sure you let the Future cure at least 2 days to prevent clouding up the Future around and over the decal specially when using decal setting solutions.

 

Some decal solutions (especially Solvaset) will cause clouding, even after the Future cures for two days or longer.  Do not worry if this happens. Just apply another coat of Future and the clouding will be removed.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    November, 2016
Posted by zubin31 on Sunday, March 19, 2017 2:42 PM

thank you all for your inputs. shall apply the techniques mentioned into my flow.

  • Member since
    January, 2009
  • From: hamburg michigan
Posted by fermis on Sunday, March 19, 2017 3:37 PM

stikpusher

 

 
plasticjunkie

Forgot to mention if using Future for decal prep, make sure you let the Future cure at least 2 days to prevent clouding up the Future around and over the decal specially when using decal setting solutions.

 

 

 

Some decal solutions (especially Solvaset) will cause clouding, even after the Future cures for two days or longer.  Do not worry if this happens. Just apply another coat of Future and the clouding will be removed.

 

I have completely given up solvaset...well...micro-set. I pitched the bottle I had. I use Future instead...under the decal, just like you would with "set". That's the only purpose that Future has for me. I still use micro-sol on top.

  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Sunday, March 19, 2017 11:05 PM

I've never had any issues using Solvaset or Future. Solvaset is very strong and will actually melt the decal on to the surface for a super bond snuggling over any irregularity.

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