side, gravity, syphon feed??

I used to be a big syphon feed fan until I purchased my Iwata Revolution CR. This brush sprays nicely at very low psi, cleans up quick, and results are astonishing. With the exception of a Paasche H, and three azteks, I cannot comment on any of the above brushes but I absolutely love this Iwata.

Like Hungfarlow, I recently got a Badger 360 and an Eclipse SBS. I agree that the gravity cup on the 360 is a little small, and the Aztek cups don't fit the Eclipse properly.

The problem I have with the 360 is the universal needle. It has a very "fast" taper, meaning that a small backward movement of the "trigger" causes a large change in the paint flow. I find this very annoying. I just don't have the necessary finger control. Maybe this will come with practice?

I got a preset handle with the Eclipse, which basically limits the rearward movement of the needle. This should make it easier to use (for me).

Another thing I have done is to get vinyl hoses to replace the braided ones. I found the braided hose way too stiff, limiting the free movement of the airbrush when spraying inside my spraybooth (a large cardboard box). Braided hoses also pulled the airbrush off my home-made holder, spilling paint everywhere. With a vinyl hose, I don't even notice it - far more flexible.

Cheers

Cheers

Hi Daniel,

During the past two weeks, I got both a Badger 360 and an Iwata Eclipse SBS which is the side feed variant of the Eclipse. Like youself I got these as replacements for the Aztek. I got these for a couple of reasons. One is because you can use these in gravity feed mode and siphon mode. Two is because they don't require changing tips or needles for spraying fine to broad patterns. So far I using the Badger 360 better, but they are both good brushes. The one main flaw with it is that in gravity feed mode, it doesn't hold too much paint. It would be nice to have a adaptor to hold more paint in gravity mode for the Badger 360.

You can consider side feed brushes as hybrids because they allow you to both use gravity feed and siphon feed. The advantage of siphon feed is that you can use larger containers to hold paint and also quicker color changes when you have to go between colors. Gravity feed allows lower pressure to be used for really tight patterns.

One last thing about the Iwata Eclipse: I got it because I thought I could use the color cups from the Aztek. You could, but they don't really fit. You have to force it in. Maybe I'll grind down the cups for a better fit. You won't be disappointed with the Eclipse SBS.

By the way, do you get good results with the Aztek? I got good results but I got tired of replacing the tips. Once they get paint clogged inside you have to disassemble them to clean, but that could result in a ruined tip. Hobby acrylics tend to clog up airbrushes a lot more than enamels. The other thing is I can't use the tan tip with acrylics for the fine details without having to deal with clogging.

The revolution CR seem like a great deal if the cost of an HP-CS is too much. The Gravity Feed cup has the same profile as the CS and seems like it would be as easy the clean. The CR doesn't have the quick access to the needle and the nozzle is .5 mm instead of .35. For modellers who don't need the detail of a CS it seems great.

very simple
<subliminal message>
IWATA REVOLUTION CR!!!
</subliminal message>
pretty inexpensive, decent, better than a crap-tek (aztec)

its worth your time and money.

QUOTE: am not sure of airbrush shops in Orlando but I could ask in the airbrush forum I attend and see if they know of somewhere.

That would be great.

QUOTE: Originally posted by dancar I'm convinced! I will be getting either a Iwata HP-CS or a Omni 4000.

Those are both good choices.
The Eclipse may be a bit more smooth but parts are higher priced should you need them and Iwata's customer service isn't even in the same league with what Badger gives you with the Omni.

I made a mistake in my earlier post about the HP-CS not being able to spray enamels. I was referring to the HP-C and not the Eclipse model (HP-CS) that you were referring to. I was thinking the HP-CS was the new version of the HP-C with the fancy new handle, I was wrong.

The HP-C is an illustrators airbrush and will not handle enamels that well unless they have really fine pigment. The Eclipse HP-CS on the other hand is suitable for enamels, acrylics, lacquers, and urethanes as it was designed as an all-purpose airbrush.

Glad we could be of help to you.
I am not sure of airbrush shops in Orlando but I could ask in the airbrush forum I attend and see if they know of somewhere.

Mike

I'm convinced! I will be getting either a Iwata HP-CS or a Omni 4000.
Thanks a lot Guys that realy helped.
Because I live in Brazil It's not a good Idea to order this kind of thig through a international site (importation taxes can get to 60% )
But the good thing is that I'll be visiting Orlando this january so I can buy one at a local shop there.
BTW does anyone know where can I get Iwatas or Omnis at Orlando area?

And again, thank's a lot MikeV and plum1030, I'll be starting the year with a brand new brush

QUOTE: Originally posted by dancar I see that a lot of people uses gravity feed brushes, and they are cheaper than side feed ones. So what are the advantages of a gravity feed brush?

Actually the side-feed are also considered gravity feed also as they react about the same way. The reason gravity-feed are so popular is because they can be sprayed at lower pressures so that detail can better be achieved with the airbrush, and they are fairly easy to clean as the color cup is built into the body of the airbrush.

Mike

Gravity feeds are easier to clean as there are no joints to attatched color cups. Also, as I wrote before less air is required to bring paint into the mechanism of the brush allowing you to spray at lower pressures while maintaining the same level of atomization. Lower pressures mean more control and less overspray. As for price, www.bearair.com has both the Iwata HP-CS (gravity) and HP-SBS (side feed) for $89 and the Omni 6000 for $87. www.dixieart.com has the Iwatas for $105 and the Omni 6000 for $89 all with free shipping.

I see that a lot of people uses gravity feed brushes, and they are cheaper than side feed ones. So what are the advantages of a gravity feed brush?

Daniel,

Another thing you will like is that the Aztek side-feed cups fit in the Iwata side-feed airbrush so you already have cups that you can use.
They may fit the Omni 6000 also, though I am not sure.
The Aztek cups are easy to clean and are much cheaper than the Iwata cups too.
Plum1030's post about the differences in the HP-C and the HP-CS are correct, the main difference is the newly designed handle for quicker needle access, although these are gravity-feed and not side-feed models.
If you are spraying enamels than I don't recommend the HP-C line as they are too fine of a needle and tip for enamels. They work pretty well with thin acrylics though.

I personally prefer the T&C Omni airbrushes and they make a side feed which is called the model 6000.



The T&C Omni costs $89.50 U.S. and the Iwata HP-SBS costs $96.00 U.S. from Coast Airbrush. http://coastairbrush.com/

Neither of these comes with an airhose though so that will cost extra.

Either one would be a good choice for a side-feed model.

The Iwata does not come with a Teflon needle bearing so if you want one it will add another $14.95 to the cost. The Teflon needle bearing is not really even needed though unless you plan on putting urethanes through the airbrush someday.

Mike

The CS has a .35 mm nozzle while the C has a .3 mm nozzle. The other differences I can see is that the CS has an open handle allowing you to quickly pull the needle back to quickly clear small blockages. Also, the paint cup on the CS looks to be contoured for easier cleaning and better paint flow into the mix chamber. And yes the HP-SBS is the side feed version of the HP-CS, same specs otherwise.

What#347; the diference between hp-cs and hp-c?

Gravity feed requires less air pressure to draw paint into the brush allowing spraying with lower pressures. Side feed will also have this advantage over siphon feed brushes. If you're attatched to side feed most companies offer side feed versions of their brushes. I use gravity feed and find color changes to be very quick so I don't find it to be an issue. Subliminal Message: IWATA, IWATA, IWATA, IWATA... You'd never regret it. Great quality and easy, easy, easy. HP-SBS (i think) is their side feed eclipse model.

BTW I paint 1/48 aircrafts molstly luftwaffe(lots of detailed camo), and I use enamel paints (Humbrol).
So witch will be the better choices