Switching from airbrush to rattle can

IMHO, the airbrush is overplayed.

As you point out, the rattle can is a lot lower maintenence.

The only disadvantage is getting certain special colors that only come in a bottle.

But then, honestly, I can get just as good or a better finish with a bristle brush as I can airbrushing when it comes to metallic colors.

I am building an old Monogram F3F, and I airbrushed the planes external features, and the silver/aluminum finish is not as good as my Williams Brothers Sparrowhawk, which I exclusively hand-brushed.

The only advantage of an airbrush is getting some of the "worm-track" camo schemes with fuzzy edges right.

I find it ironic that the devout airbrusher has to have a special masking technique (often using play-dough, etc.) to get the RAF style hard-edge camo schemes, which I can do free-hand with a bristle brush.

And of course when it comes to WWI subjects the airbursh againis at a disadvantage against a hand-bristle brush.

Your most skilled figure painters start out by painting a base coat on the figure from a rattle-can before going to a hand brush for details.

Tom T

Rattle-cans offer very little control & all kinds of overspray (and therefore all kinds of stinkin' up the house!). I always found it hard to control the amount of paint built up, especially gloss colours on a car for example. I use clear-coats from a can, everything else through the airbrush, also use a single-action Badger. As far as the cleanup goes, I was finding that a hassle too. I switched mostly to acrylics for the quick drying time, and also for the fact that I can clean up the a/b with isopropyl, less fumes than enamel thinners.

The bottom line - if it makes more time to model & you're happy with the results, go for it. (But I don't want to switch back!!)

Personally, I think you're taking a major step backwards.  I'll grant you using an airbrush is time consuming; but the rewards far outweigh the alternatives.

I've used rattle cans before to do my painting.  The problems are:  you can't do a whole lot of color matching, the dye lots can vary wildly even with the same product and I'm sure there are others that escape me at the moment.

I started out with a Badger 150.  I actually went through two of them before biting the bullet and buying a single action Paasche from Hobby Lobby.  I'm still a "single action" guy.  There are some who swear by using "double action" airbrushes; but I'm just not ready to make the switch.

What are the kinds of problems you're having?  Maybe we can help.

If you don't enjoy it, you shouldn't do it.  It's a hobby.

Don

That was amusing Tom.

It is obvious you need to spend a lot more time practicing with the airbrush if you can do just as good with a paint brush.

The only advantage of an airbrush is getting some of the "worm-track" camo schemes with fuzzy edges right.

Haha! Try painting exhaust stains on an A-1 Skyraider like this with your paint brush.

The airbrush is almost limitless and beats a paintbrush in every way other than drybrushing and delicate figure painting.

 I wouldn't dare try Green.

Your Skyraider is the perfect subject for the airbrush preference, both with the fuzzy-edged camo and the niecly done oil stain on the fuselage.

I've got a couple of old Revell SpAD's and for those I intend to break out the airbrush.

One point of detail I would like to mention is that the streaks you see on the typical USAF AD's (AKA Sandy's) is not simply engine exhaust.

The engine's oil tank was almost as big as the plane's fuel tank,and it consumed it at about the same rate as the fuel.

So the black stain on the fuselage sides of the typical USAF Sandy was in fact dirty engine oil, and I have a photograph of one and it has an ugly solid black streak on each side, which I could do with a bristle brush, but I like the look of yours better.

Appearantly the Navy kept their planes cleaner then the USAF, and of course the dark blue paint scheme some had would make it not so noticeable.

Tom T

BTY, I own a couple of compressors, three simple single-action and three double action air brushes as well as a couple of cans of propellent and can adaptors.

I like them OK, but if I can get by without them, I do.

Tom T

Thanks for clarifying that Tom, I failed to mention that.

As crew chiefs and pilots used to say, "If the Wright engine wasn't slinging oil then something is wrong." 

Don Wheeler

If you don't enjoy it, you shouldn't do it.  It's a hobby.

Don

I'll second what Don says so well.  Go with what's best for you.  Rick

T_Terrific

BTY, I own a couple of compressors, three simple single-action and three double action air brushes as well as a couple of cans of propellent and can adaptors.

I like them OK, but if I can get by without them, I do.

Tom T

I have two silent compressors and 14 double action airbrushes.

What works best for you is all that matters my friend. If you can get the results you like with a paintbrush alone then go for it. Clean up is a lot easier as well.

By the way, that Skyraider was an old Monogram kit.

I know how you feel, i just completed my first model using the airbrush, and i turned out quite well.

i will still be using rattle cans for white, because that is a horrible colour to airbrush.

defiently keep the airbrush, and keep practicing with it, anytime you get a chance.

I've got a badger double action.

bluenote

I'm finding the airbrush to be pretty time consuming (thinning the paints, cleaning airbrush, troubleshooting, etc).  In fact, I sometimes put off working on my model if I know I have to airbrush.  Last night I struggled for a half an hour with my airbrush (Badger single action), and ended up not getting anything done. 

Just a couple more thoughts:  Thinning is pretty easy once you learn what properly thinned paint looks like, but that takes a little experimenting.  Cleaning shouldn't take more than about 10 minutes unless you're doing it wrong.  And, if you keep the brush clean and take care of it, troubleshooting should rarely be needed. When it is needed, it will be easier if you understand how the thing works.  Maybe you just need a little help.  There is plenty of it on the web.  Which model Badger do you have?

Don

I know quite a few people that refuse to touch an airbrush. Some like a rattle can and some like a paint brush. They all do very nice work. I enjoy using an airbrush. It's my favorite part of building. Mixing, thinning, spraying, getting it just the way I want it. That's all very relaxing to me.

Tony

I'm a devout rattle-can user... Excpet for the finer stuff that only an airbrush can do, like dusting, fading, and other special FX, a rattle can finish is quite east to do once you understand how to control it...

Feathered edges are accomplish via the masking tape not being pushed down on the odel, but folded under about an 1/8th-inch, leaving a soft edge..

Simple camouflage schemes are rattle-can specialties... Overall OD on a tank, why airbrush it if the right shade is already there.. Same with German Dunkelgelb, Russian Green, whatever you want...

Try painting exhaust stains on an A-1 Skyraider like this with your paint brush.

Pastels are what I use for any kind of exhaust or gun-stains...  Way more control over the color and intensity of it, plus mistakes can be wiped off instantly.... Try that with an airbrush...

I do use an airbrush, but only for special applications where a fine paint-line is needed.. for over painting of one-two, and three-color camouflages, rattle cans are fine..

Sure, there's a lot of over-spray, but I don't mind it, don't mind the smell (actually, I like it), and one can of paint is good for several models... Need clear coats? Rattle can Dulcoat or Glosscoat.. Done in 60 seconds..

Airbrushing IS and art-form and takes practice, pratice, practice... It's also a difficult tool to master, although it can be tamed to work for a beginner rather quickly...  But like you said, the constant clean-up of the thing is why I only use mine for special jobs...

I'd be happy to show you some tricks and tips I've learned from using rattle-cans for thirty years... One right now.. Before a painting session, warm the cans in a pan of hot water (about 120 F) for a few minutes... This will make the paint come out in a finer mist...

Contact me back-channel for anything you need in the way of help..

 CAF P-82, rattle black, rattle-can clear satin:

 Rattle-can Model Master Dunklegelb;

Rattle-can semi-gloss white, oversprayed with flat clear.:

After pastel w/ brush weathering:

ModelMaster OD, Testor's red rattle can

Rattle-can camo- MM for both colors, underside Wal-Mart grey primer- Pastel exhaust staining..

, ..

Anyway, all I'm pointing out is that there's nothing "wrong" with using rattle-cans.. With a liitle practice (far less than an airbrush), and knowing a few masking tricks, they turn out pretty good..

I used to feel a similar way you do.  My airbrush scared me (and I ruined some nice models too) and it took a long time to get a setup that was right for me.  But once I figured it out, I haven't looked back. I also switched from an Aztek A470 to a Badger 200 which solved a lot of problems for me, and got a good paint/thinner combo that is dynamite.  Although my Aztek is still an ok airbrush I find the 200 easier for day to day use.

I have a couple of Badger single actions myself (200G and 200NH) and I have found them extremely easy to use, clean, and are pretty reliable.  I can dismantle and clean them inside and out in about 5 minutes.  And doing the paint/thinner mixing takes me a mere minute since I mix it in the airbrush color cup.

If you don't mind, could you describe to us what exactly what problems you are having with your airbrush? Is it the paint finish or the tool itself giving you problems?  What kind and how are you mixing your paint/thinner?  Why do you find it time consuming?  <-- Just a few of the thoughts I've had while reading your post.

Thanks for all the responses.  I find with the airbrush that one day it'll work perfectly.  The next day, the paint sputters through the nozzle, I thin it, then it's too thin, etc.  Then, I'll disassemble and clean to see if that will help.  The model I have is a Badger 350.

I just find it frustating certain times.  Whereas a rattle can is ready to go right away.  I'm going to keep experimenting with both, but if I can get the same finish with a rattle can, then I will make the permanant switch.

The problem is that most of the time when someone ask for an AB suggestion, folks tend to suggest AB's without considering the OP is usually a newbie. Airbrushing has a learning curve that can be intimidating and can even drive away someone starting to airbrush. I would NEVER recommend a Badger, Iwata or any of those  ABs to a beginner. One has to crawl before walking and those AB's are very time consuming during a learning curve. In my humble opinion and by personal experience, there is no better AB system to learn what airbrushing is about than an AZTEK. They are so simple to use and easy to clean and get a hang of airbrushing, that one can put more that time learning how to use instead of becoming a jeweler to make it work.

Once one get a hang to airbrushing simply move up to another model or brand. When a newbie ask me in my forum for a new digital camera, I always ask for the budget. I wouldn't put a person thru the latest and the greatest with a camera full of features that wont help his/her photography's  learning curve, but rather overwhelm and possibly scare away from the hobby.

I'm guilty of owning besides my AZTEK a Badger and Paasche. Every time I finish a complex project I ask myself why the system is so bashed and underrated. Could it be that I learned to airbrush with it; and during that learning experience I've got to know how the nozzle system behaves with acrylics and/or enamels at different PSI. Truth is that IMO, there is no better system to learn AB than Aztek and I tend to leave the illustrators and graphic artists with the most fancies AB's. Again, IMHO, mileage might vary.

It's all about what you're comfortable with.

Personally...I find I can get much better, more consistent results through an airbrush than I can out of a rattlecan or brushpainting. I'm happy to brus paint small things, but pretty much whatever I can, I airbrush. 

Cleaning can be tedious, especially the every so often that the airbrush needs a deep clean (I have an Iwata HP-C+ that one got enamel paint in the trigger mechanism...THAT was fun to clean), but I find rattlecans just as tedious (have to soak them in warm water, have to hope it's not too humid or too hot, have to lay out coverings so I don't spraypaint the grass/driveway/cars/dogs, have to work by the exterior house lighting since I do my modeling at night after the wife and kids are in bed).

bluenote

Thanks for all the responses.  I find with the airbrush that one day it'll work perfectly.  The next day, the paint sputters through the nozzle, I thin it, then it's too thin, etc.  Then, I'll disassemble and clean to see if that will help.  The model I have is a Badger 350.

I just find it frustating certain times.  Whereas a rattle can is ready to go right away.  I'm going to keep experimenting with both, but if I can get the same finish with a rattle can, then I will make the permanant switch.

The Badger 350 is pretty near bulletproof, being a single-action, external mix brush. It's a decent enough brush to learn the basics with. It does, however, have a tendency to put out a flood of paint at anywhere past "just" open.  

Like Phil said, the 350 is dead simple, and cleaning shouldn't take more the 5 minutes, especially if the metal paint cup is used.  The spray adjustment is very sensitive, but way better than a spray can.  I think your problem might be the paint or thinner. If the paint starts getting clumpy ( the little pigment particles stick together), it can cause what you're seeing. If you are using acrylics, maybe you are getting tip dry and need some retarder.  I don't use acrylics, but a lot of guys here do and can give advice on particular brands.

Maybe your cleaning solvent is not strong enough, or you're missing something that breaks loose later and clogs.

Also, the external mix airbrushes take a little more air than the internal mix. 25 psi works OK for my 350, but the compressor has to have the capacity to keep up.

Before you give up on it, you might get some fresh paint, use the manufacturer's thinner, and practice on some junk plastic, like bottles.  If you want help on cleaning, pm me.

It is a real Badger and not a Chinese copy isn't it?

What it boils down to is that there is no shame in using spray cans.  If that makes the hobby more enjoyable for you, go for it.

Don

What kind of paint/thinner and ratio are you using and what pressure are you spraying at?

I occasionally have the same issue and have narrowed it down to:

1.  Me screwing up something when I reassembled the airbrush or nozzle

2.  The paint itself

3.  Compressor dropped pressure for no apparent reason

El Taino

I would NEVER recommend a Badger, Iwata or any of those  ABs to a beginner.

I disagree. What does the brand have to do with it anyhow? I started with a Paasche VL 20 years ago..... now that is harder to learn with as they are not very precise.

Start with a double action and practice, practice, practice. It's not that hard to learn.

GreenThumb

 

El Taino:

 

I would NEVER recommend a Badger, Iwata or any of those  ABs to a beginner.

 

I disagree. What does the brand have to do with it anyhow? I started with a Paasche VL 20 years ago..... now that is harder to learn with as they are not very precise.

Start with a double action and practice, practice, practice. It's not that hard to learn.

I think starting with a single or double action depends on the user.  I have found for me that a single action is much easier to use and gets me more consistent results than the double action.  It just depends on the user and application.  Badger's are easy for beginners to use, but I would not recommend a pricey airbrush or compressor to someone new to the hobby, start small and build up.

Airbrushes are highly personal and subjective. They remind me a lot of baseball gloves and golf clubs and hockey sticks in that way. One person swears by one, and the other hates it and has another brand/model they prefer.

Personally, I have two Badgers (Patriot and Renegade Velocity) and I'm just not that thrilled with them. I find I prefer the more linear needle/trigger action of my Iwatas and my H&S. I'm accustomed to that and feel like I have very little control over the badgers. That and the lack of any protection around the needle has me paranoid even setting the things in the airbrush holder on my bench. I recognize that plenty of others love them and prefer them to the other brushes I have...but yeah...highly personal in nature.

I also was not a fan of and sold my Grex Tritium. As an airbrush it was actually pretty great. But man, that pistol grip was not for me. Takes a lot more effort holding it 25% open than it does with a traditional airbrush.

The biggest frustration for me is the inability to "test drive" airbrushes. Even though most of them aren't that expensive, they are pricey enough that I'd love to go on personal impressions rather than reading reviews and hoping.

Don Wheeler

If you don't enjoy it, you shouldn't do it.  It's a hobby.

Don

     Ditto. I've had a Badger 350 for 15 years and it's the only airbrush I've ever owned or used. With a lot of practice I've become pretty good with it. However, unlike (apparently most) modelers, I don't love airbrushing. It is somewhat of a hassle. Although I usually paint the exterior camo with the Badger, I've obtained excellent results with a spray can and/or a brush. I brush painted a Luftwaffe F-104 last year in the German lizard camo, and although I don't have pictures to prove it, I swear it looks as good as anything I, or most other modelers could have airbrushed. The key to a smooth brushed on finish is thin paint and a couple of coats. I actually find it relaxing and brush paint all of my interior details. Effects are accomplished strictly with washes and pastels.

Once the AB is familiar to you, it's much more economical to use one. I'm surprised Hans, but I suppose when you say "rattle can" we aren't discussing a $ 9 can of Tamiya Primer.

One thing all the sign companies that build my stuff do is reverse decant (cant?) liquid paints into aerosol cans so their people can touch up signs in the field. I get that done for me now and then for big paint jobs.

COLDIRON

 

GreenThumb:

 

 

El Taino:

 

I would NEVER recommend a Badger, Iwata or any of those  ABs to a beginner.

 

I disagree. What does the brand have to do with it anyhow? I started with a Paasche VL 20 years ago..... now that is harder to learn with as they are not very precise.

Start with a double action and practice, practice, practice. It's not that hard to learn.

 

 

 

I think starting with a single or double action depends on the user.  I have found for me that a single action is much easier to use and gets me more consistent results than the double action.  It just depends on the user and application.  Badger's are easy for beginners to use, but I would not recommend a pricey airbrush or compressor to someone new to the hobby, start small and build up.

I'm not saying that the brand has anything to do perse. But what I meant was the system as a whole and it doesn't get any easier with an Aztek System where you can practice, practice, practice by simply changing a nozzle instead of disassembling tiny parts and damaging needles and other parts during the learning process. Make it simple during that stage. I have no doubts some have learned with other systems, there are always exceptions to the rule.

I could never understand why people have more trouble with a double-action airbrush.

All you do is push the trigger down, hold it there and pull back on the trigger slowly.

It beats a single-action airbrush in every way.

GreenThumb

I could never understand why people have more trouble with a double-action airbrush.

All you do is push the trigger down, hold it there and pull back on the trigger slowly.

It beats a single-action airbrush in every way.

 

 

Couple years ago I made a post on just that.  Double actions for me cause pain in my hand from having to pull the trigger back, which is why for me it's easier to use a single action for most stuff.  Although I may try a double action at some point in the future with a smaller trigger throw - we'll see.

And I will say, I love airbrushing!  I find it relaxing and creative at the same time - but it sure was a rocky road getting there.