modern day paints ... lets talk about it

As Manny would say

"Yes and no"

Ive always looked at it from an art point of view.

Oils - Thin with spirits or oils (Linseed etc) or a product i use called liquol. Clean up with white spirits (Turps etc)

Water colours - Thin with water, clean up with water.

Acrylics - The happy medium. Acrylics are an odd kind of paint, the only reason i use them is because of the simple cleanup. Theyre a kind of paint where trial and error comes into play alot. Some are more oil than watercolour. Some are more watercolour than oil (Tamiya)

As with everything. Do your research before you start using a new type of paint.

Konigwolf13

As Manny would say

"Yes and no"

..ok ....thanks

Ok on a more serious note, I grew up using enamels and brush painting, never even hearing of an airbrush. My first experience with acrylcs came around the turn of the millenia when I started to get back into models and my experience in brush painting them left me with a very LOW opinion.

As I got more into modeling again I realized that the two market options in acrylics availible in Tasmania are not great for brushing and I eventually got and airbrush and compressor wanting to leave behind the enamels and the smell. On a limited budget I went for the cheapest that worked, turps for the occasional times I use enamels ( and now also artists oils for wash's) and methyalated spirits for Tamiya/Gunze acrylics.

 In the last 12 months as I have branched out into other areas like weathering I have found a preference priming, this has led me to laquers and laquer thinners and with and also some experimenting with brand name thinners. I have noticed some difference with brand name enamel thinners. Tamiya acrylic thinner is a different matter alltogether, for airbrushing I still prefer to use alchohol as a thinner, though Tamiya thinner does dry slower giving an advantage in some situations, when brush painting with Tamiya/Gunze I find water the best thinner, I guess it thins down the solvents in the paint so it doesnt strip/re-activate the already applied layes and gives a much slower drying time.

my 2c

PS the thing that would limit me using the above linked paints is lack of range, looking at what was availible through the Australian supplier black, white and primaries isnt much range in pre-mixed colours.

I dont know if your thinking is way off, but your attitiude is not very helpful...

"it's 2012"

"old timer thinking no longer applies"

"accept it or step aside"

I know many folks out there prefer or only use acrylics. I know some swear by a particular brand such as Vallejo. Those are not me. I will use wahtever works for the job, enamel or acrylic. There are some acylics I absolutely love (Gunze Acqueous, Tamiya) for airbrushing. Handbrushing is a whole seperate consideration. And other acrylics that do not float my boat.

Yet I am still a die hard enamel user. Their simplicity works for me. At this point in my life, time is my most precious commodity. And the simplicity of enamels is what works best in many cases most of the time for me. Thinner + paint and go. No adding flow agents, retarders, etc.. And I have yet to have enamels clog my airbrush. My manner of airbrushing in an open garage makes most safety precautions un necessary- mother natures ocean breeze works as good as any spray booth to remove fumes. I kow these conditions are not universal-they are just what I have to work with.

To name a brand that is not currently or easily available to someone is of no help as well. Yes us "old timers' can reminisce about a particular brand or color of paint that is no longer available. But in the end, that is all it is, memories. The past is not coming back, and none of us has a time machine to go back and get those long gone products. That is the fun of life experience.

Yes I may espouse a particualr line of paints or say this type is what I prefer. But I am not gonna say- 'you are wrong and must change with the times to work in this hobby'. That is a foolish statement. I may fall back upon 40+ years of being in the hobby to say what has and has not worked for me. And I will continue to work with whatever products I choose, old or new, to get the results I want in my builds. All have their place in my work area.

And while manufacturers are working on improving acrylics, I doubt it is around the clock. At least I hope not. I think there are more important things out there needing that sort of attention from chemists than making a superior acrylic paint

stikpusher

I dont know if your thinking is way off, but your attitiude is not very helpful...

"it's 2012"

"old timer thinking no longer applies"

"accept it or step aside"

I know many folks out there prefer or only use acrylics. I know some swear by a particular brand such as Vallejo. Those are not me. I will use wahtever works for the job, enamel or acrylic. There are some acylics I absolutely love (Gunze Acqueous, Tamiya) for airbrushing. Handbrushing is a whole seperate consideration. And other acrylics that do not float my boat.

Yet I am still a die hard enamel user. Their simplicity works for me. At this point in my life, time is my most precious commodity. And the simplicity of enamels is what works best in many cases most of the time for me. Thinner + paint and go. No adding flow agents, retarders, etc.. And I have yet to have enamels clog my airbrush. My manner of airbrushing in an open garage makes most safety precautions un necessary- mother natures ocean breeze works as good as any spray booth to remove fumes. I kow these conditions are not universal-they are just what I have to work with.

To name a brand that is not currently or easily available to someone is of no help as well. Yes us "old timers' can reminisce about a particular brand or color of paint that is no longer available. But in the end, that is all it is, memories. The past is not coming back, and none of us has a time machine to go back and get those long gone products. That is the fun of life experience.

Yes I may espouse a particualr line of paints or say this type is what I prefer. But I am not gonna say- 'you are wrong and must change with the times to work in this hobby'. That is a foolish statement. I may fall back upon 40+ years of being in the hobby to say what has and has not worked for me. And I will continue to work with whatever products I choose, old or new, to get the results I want in my builds. All have their place in my work area.

And while manufacturers are working on improving acrylics, I doubt it is around the clock. At least I hope not. I think there are more important things out there needing that sort of attention from chemists than making a superior acrylic paint

I second this.

Stymye,

Could be an interesting thread. I'm interested! But, if I'm not mistaken, the first acrylic paints were solvent based lacquers. Prior to the 1950's automobiles were painted with enamel then the paint industry developed acrylic lacquers which had  better permanence and better gloss and suddenly we had shinier cars. The connotation that acrylic paint is water soluble is a recent misuse of the term brought about by hobby paint manufacturers (distributors) themselves. Yes, some acrylic paints are 'water cleanup' but not all. Some of the craft acrylic paints when dry (or solvent evaporated) are dissolved only with aggressive solvents like acetone and I think this includes things like Testor's Acryl (yes, I'm aware of ammonia or isopropyl alcohol based stuff to remove some acrylic paints). I have no idea which is the best diluent for 'acrylic' paints but I'm surely in favor of easier to use less toxic stuff to paint my models. Bring on the new paint technology - but no urethanes, epoxies or petroleum based stuff, please.

Bob

thanks for pointing out 'acrylic washup with water UNTIL DRY'

i thought something was funny there.

wrecked the tip on my airbrush with that dried on acrylic.

next is soaking it my girlfriends 'acrylic' nail polish remover.

don't want to buy any 'made for removing dried acrylic' products.

if they don't work i've thrown away $4-5.

i'm taking note of the case for 'old fashioned enamel'.

Have A Nice Day!

Well theres your problem.

"Ive thrown away $4-5"

No you haven't, you've spent $4-5 on an education. Anything you learn from is never a waste.

I've seen models built by people of the "old timers" using the old testors square bottle enamels that look way better than something I can do ( I mainly use acrylics), and I consider myself fairly experienced. So its not the paint its the modeler. But yes, I have found that some paints are just easier to work with, and less smelly, thats why i lean towards gunze acrylics, just a few drops of paint, a few drops of thinner, and spray as fine or large an area as you want...No tip dry, then rinse under the sink and clean up the dried stuff w/ alcohol or windex...that simple. thats my situation. I've found that its hard to find a paint that does everything you want it to...Thin way down, airbrush well, and brush paint well (dry-brush well, ect.) so I have a range of brands and types in my stash.

Then you can add "metalizer," "Aclads" and others into the mix, and it becomes very complicated.  My main gripe is that the manufacturers do not provide proper instructions, especially those who provide only Japanese language on their packaging.  I have learned to spray and test and experiment on a sheet of polysterene first, before wrecking a nice model.

Maybe I am sadistic, but part of the modeling experience for me 'is' the paint. I use a wide variety. Vallejo, tamiya, floquil, some old polly scale. Enamels, from MM to plain old testors. I've recently been tinkering a bit with Alclad, as well.

Some models just look better with enamels over acylic, vice versa. Some brands' colors are better than others, to my eye. Perhaps I just haven't narrowed it all down yet. One of these days I may stick to one type or brand. For now? Nah. I suppose its like anything else in modeling. Well..that didn't work. I'll try this. It doesn't have to be exact all the time to be fun, though we all strive for that!