Acrylic or Enamal

I use model master and tamiya acrylic paints. Both are reliable. Tamiya thinner works real nice with these two brands.For clear coats / gloss coats I use Model master lacquer and it works well. I hear tamiya clear coat also works well.

As far as airbrush goes I use a HP-CS and other than gloss colors I have really never run into any problems (the gloss kind of spits because of the gloss sheen and typically i cannot get a nice gloss on the model unless I am painting something small). Best part of the CS model is that it is extremely easy to take apart and clean which means that you can make this brush last. After a airbrushing session it only takes me about 5 minutes to clean the brush versus other brushes (master brand) it takes me a little while to clean every  nook.

Unfortunately there is no one place for answers for airbrushing. Even the best airbrushers will tell you that they have their good and bad days with airbrushing. Basically if the flow seems weak it means you need more thinner (that or your airbrush is clogged).

Newbies at airbrushing commonly make the mistake of putting too much paint on at once. Doing this will cause the paint to drip. Just take your time and apply more than one quote. You do not need that extra wet look because remember once it dries it won't look like that so why risk paint running marks.Starting with primer also makes painting with acrylics (and probably all types) a little easier.

Learning the trade of airbrushing is long and tedious. Take your time and start off with cheap model kits and practice on them.

Hematite Bead Strand

at Hobby Lobby, in the beaded necklace/wristband section

32 inch "Traditions" # 222752 and 16 inch "Traditions" # 223610,,,,the longer necklace has smaller beads, but, more per inch,,,,,,the short 16 inch has a "better" bead for stirring, they are larger, with fewer per inch

I use them in any paint, like Vallejo, when the manufacturer says to shake instead of stirring their paint (I figure they would know best)

Vallejo info is here  http://www.vallejo.nl/gb/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.vallejo.nl/gb/vallejo/modelcolorchart/index.html

LifeColor is here (select language in upper right) http://www.astromodel.it/lifecolor/camouflage-single-colours.html

An intriguing thing I ran into,,,,,,Vallejo Air has a different chemical makeup than Model Color,,,,,and their thinner seems to be something to play with to add "more binding" to paints,,,,,,I will play with that with some color I don't mind turning into "rubber window sealant" one of these days

Floquil old lacquer paints had a method of increasing the binding strength of those paints,,,,,but, that was back in the "original Dio-Sol" days,,,,,,I am sure the new chemistry isn't the same as back then

Rex

I use Vallejo MC paints as well. I pop the cap off and stir the paint with a piece of sprue spun with my rotary tool.

The game colours seem to be more fluid then the MC's.

Rex & Unreality - thank you both for the solid advice & terrific site.  I will heed you experienced advice. (I usually like buying all the same brand 'accessory" items to go with my purchases, including when I work on my real cars-mostly OER stuff unless proven better engineered)

Enjoy the weekend!

Bob

Exactly. And thanks to you, I am now on the lookout for hematite beads, which would greatly help my Vallejo collection.

thanks for that link,,,,,,your site looks to be very helpful

that is what makes discussing things so much fun, I always end up with some benefit from just chatting away trying to help someone else

Rex

I'll add one small addendum to what Tarnship said. When you get an airbrush, be careful of using Windex (or other ammonia-based fluids). If the airbrush has brass parts (like the nozzle and trigger internals on most Iwatas), the ammonia can pit/attack brass over time. So, just flush it out with water afterward.

I still use Windex all the time, especially with Future and to clean the nozzle. And as long as I rinse it with water, it's been fine.

I have an acrylics chart on my website listing thinners and my thoughts on uses. Of course, as Tarnship said, try the proprietary thinner for each acrylic before branching off.

airbrush choices, I have to admit I know completely nothing about

I bought my tools a lifetime ago (as my son calls it), and still use the same ones,,,,,my Badger was purchased before my son was born, and once I learned the pressure and paint volume deal with it, I have used it and the even older "Basic Spray Gun" for over 33 years

I haven't even worn out a compressor for my airbrush,,,I've always used a good shop compressor with a quick disconnect on the "compressor end" of the house connecting my home made regulater/moisture trap set up, the compressor "lives" with the auto tools, and visits the model shop when it is needed

Rex,

Thanks for the thorough reply and for simplifying things.  I will pick up the supplies and get started. 

Bob

PS - I am sure I'll be back with more questions

Is the CS a good brush for painting car bodies? (1/20 - 1/24 - 1/25 scales)  I work w/cars and planes.(1/72-1/48-1/32)

Will this brush do it all or must I look at 1 for broader coverage and 1 for finer work/smaller pieces?

Thanks, Bob

I forgot this

Once you know you can put the paint where you want it, and it will stay there when you mask it, without peeling up,,,,,then you can start to fool around with all the things that might make the paint dry faster, slower, make crisper lines at your masking point, make the lines more feathered,,,,,,,,all the things we like to do with that airbrush

don't worry about the "too many different thinners" deal, either,,,,,,in my Enamel and Floquil days,,,,,,I had at least 5 different cans of "stuff" around,,,,,ranging from Dio-Sol to Lacquer thinner, to different "heats" of Testors or Humbrol, etc, "house brands" of thinners,,,,,,,,and generics that someone told me to try

so, one for each Acrylic line, plus some Windex and Distilled water,,,,,,,is not that big a deal

Bob

just like Unreality, I believe in primers. I do believe in some things concerning paints that others do not.

but, for a new user of a paint line, I believe there is one easiest way to do this

use the brand of fluids and add-ons that match the paint range you are trying to learn

once you know how the paint you are trying to master works with it's own thinner,,,,,you can run off and experiment to your heart's content,,,,,,,,because you know what you are trying to achieve as your expected "normal" results

when you read someone type out "LifeColors are no good",,,and then learn they tried thinning them with "Smuckatelli's woop-dee-doo tip of the week" fluids,,,,,,you really don't know if that paint is usable or not,,,,,all you know is that the "Smuck stuff" didn't work for that one person

so,,,,you need a thinner,,,,,for my LifeColors, I have their thinner (and their thickener), for Vallejo, I have their's also,,,,,,and the Model Master universal for their Acryl and related PolyScale paint lines

"normal" cleaner,,,,,,this is what you run through the airbrush to clear it out of paint and paint/thinner mixture, to keep paint from drying in the airbrush mechanism,,,,,,Simple Green, Windex, Windshield washer Fluid,,,,,I use "Green Works " natural cleaner, a Chlorox product, with a gallon of Windshield fluid as a stand by

Airbrush Cleaner,,,,,,,this is different, this is the strong stuff,,,,,some people use Windex, etc for this,,,,,I use the Medea Airbrush Cleaner,,,,with a distilled water rinse to clear that out of the system,,,,,if you get Acrylic paint dried on or in you airbrush, you can take the brush apart, soak it in the Medea, and then assemble it, and spray a jar or paint cup full of the Medea through it,,,,,,,you do need to learn what not to soak for your specific airbrush, though

last is some sort of retarder or flow aid,,,,,,,if you can slow down the fairly rapid drying time of flat acrylic paints, you can keep the dried paint problem from rearing its head very often,,,,,Liquitex makes products for this,,,,,,,I still use Liquitex Flow Aid from my PolyScale days, with my LifeColor and Vallejo paints,,,,,,it is just an old habit I continued

Vallejo wants us to shake the paints vigorously and get them mixed well,,,,,,get a Hemetite necklace and cut the string,,,,,drop one of those beads into your Vallejo bottle,,,,,it will help with the mixing (don't worry about rust with the Hemetite, it already has it's bonds to Oxygen) ,,,,,,the "nipple" on a Vallejo bottle comes off with gentle pressure while held in a paper towel

so, Thinner, Normal Cleaner, Airbrush Cleaner, a Flow Aid, some Hemetite beads,,,,,,that will get you started

also, Vallejo and LifeColor have their own Primers,,,,LifeColor's is White, Vallejo's regular sized is gray,,,,and Vallejo has some special colored primers (I have not tried those yet)

hope this is of help

Rex

Bobfest13

BTW, i have been reading that the Vallejo line of paints is very good for air brushing and brush painting.  And if that line could be the only one used, it might make things easier for the challenged! (ME)  Any opinions re: Vallejo paints?  And are there major differences between the Model Air, Model Color, Game Color, etc... lines that they have?

 

Thanks, Bob (old newbie)

 

PS - also looking for a good general purpose airbrush for both aircraft & autos - comments welcomed

I was a hardcore Pollyscale user until their military line got dropped. Now, I'm pretty much a Vallejo user. Model Color is the main line (along with the Panzer Aces colors). Model Air is thinned down Model Color. Game Color is actually a bit different from MC; it acts more like gamesworkshop paints. I prefer the MC line, which can be airbrushed if you use their thinner. That's the other point...these paints are very unique. It may take awhile to get used to how they behave. Always thin them with their thinner (for either brushing or airbrushing), and always use a primer with them (for adhesion).

For an airbrush, my Iwata Eclipse HP-CS is a beast. I've had it 6 years and it hasn't quit yet. Iwata is also a good company that will stand by their products.

If I had a spray booth & someone else to clean my airbrush for me, I'd use nothing but enamels.  Of course, I don't have either, so I've been trying to use Tamiya acrylics lately for airbrush sessions. They work very well for airbrushing, wish they were easier to brush-paint though.

TarnShip,

Your suggestion sounds like it would be of use to me.  What's the difference between thinner, "normal cleaner", and airbrush cleaner?  I figured one could use a thinner to clean. (like with enamels) 

Please elaborate - I am trying to figure all this out. 

BTW, i have been reading that the Vallejo line of paints is very good for air brushing and brush painting.  And if that line could be the only one used, it might make things easier for the challenged! (ME)  Any opinions re: Vallejo paints?  And are there major differences between the Model Air, Model Color, Game Color, etc... lines that they have?

Thanks, Bob (old newbie)

PS - also looking for a good general purpose airbrush for both aircraft & autos - comments welcomed

Don Stauffer

In fact, the fast drying of acrylics makes it harder to get a really good gloss on acrylics, so if you want a glossy finish with acrylics you frequently have to overcoat with a clear gloss.

True.

I'll generally avoid gloss paint wherever possible, going the flat then clear route to get gloss when required (I don't do much in the way of glossy stuff right enough) & find that I'm still finished sooner than if I had use a gloss acrylic alone.

Some Tamiya gloss colours can take an eternity to dry......

we should make up a little list to use as a "starter set" for new Acrylic users

it wouldn't start with any paint colors at all, but with

airbrush cleaner (the kind you soak your airbrush in to remove dried on Acrylics)

thinner

"normal" cleaner

retarder/reducer/flow aid

trust me,,,,with any newbie,,,,,,those 4 items would get more use in the first 2 months than a "correct Olive Drab" would, lol

Milairjunkie

Another benefit to acrylics is their drying time which is much shorter than enamels. Flat acrylics also dry much faster than gloss acrylics.

In fact, the fast drying of acrylics makes it harder to get a really good gloss on acrylics, so if you want a glossy finish with acrylics you frequently have to overcoat with a clear gloss.

Another comment.  While cleanup of water-based acrylics may use less messy stuff, if you let it dry in a brush or airbrush it is usually harder to clean up that than it would be cleaning up enamels.  So you must be diligent about cleaning up immediately after painting.

Another benefit to acrylics is their drying time which is much shorter than enamels. Flat acrylics also dry much faster than gloss acrylics.

ThomasfrmPA

I have many questions. The first being, what is the preferred type of paint water or oil based for plastic models?

Keep in mind that "water based" is sometihng of a misnomer when we talk about acrylic paints. Though many acrylic paints are water-soluble when wet (thus affording easy cleanup) it does not necessarily mean "water based". 

The term "acrylic" when applied to paint refers to the chemical composition of the polymers in the paint's binders and does not simply mean "water based". Some (eg. Tamiya and Gunze Aqueous) acrylics use alcohol as a primary solvent.

TomZ2

Short compatibility matrix (thanks to Masataka Narita)

 

____________ Over coat Under Coat___________	Acrylic	Enamel	Lacquer
Acrylic	OK	Maybe	NO
Enamel	OK	OK	NO
Lacquer	OK	OK	OK

The L E A (Lacquer Enamel Acrylic) Rule: Lacquers, enamels & acrylics can safety cover base lacquers. Enamels & acrylics can cover enamels (but not lacquers!). Base coat acrylics can only be covered by more acrylics.

TomZ2

Short compatibility matrix (thanks to Masataka Narita)

 

____________ Over coat Under Coat___________	Acrylic	Enamel	Lacquer
Acrylic	OK	Maybe	NO
Enamel	OK	OK	NO
Lacquer	OK	OK	OK

The L E A (Lacquer Enamel Acrylic) Rule: Lacquers, enamels & acrylics can safety cover base lacquers. Enamels & acrylics can cover enamels (but not lacquers!). Base coat acrylics can only be covered by more acrylics.

One exception I would make to this chart is Testor's Glosscote and Dullcote are lacquer-based, but can be use over enamels (they recommend that the undercoat be given 24 hours to dry and that the clear coat be applied in light coats). 

The only problem that I've ever had personally with compatibility was when trying to apply Dullcote over  acrylic.

Mark

you are going to get a lot of varied opinions on this,,,,,some of us have had different opinions as far as paint types in different periods of our modeling lives

I was a die hard enamel user,,,,,,,,then switched to Floquil Lacquers, with enamel paints for small brushed on details, old Humbrol was really great for that job

then I got all tail wagging happy for a couple of decades when Model Master and then a bit later, Model Master II, came out, again with Humbrol and then XtraColor supplements

then, I found out that my Lady has breathing problems around Lacquer or Enamel if they are out gassing in even the slightest amounts (and some paints take a very long time to dry)

so, after over 40 years of enamels, now I have had to try acrylics,,,,,,,,and discovered that I wish I had tried them sooner

it still takes more than one paint line to get all the colors I need,,,,,but, as long as I use a good primer, get a good mix ratio of paint to thinner for the job I am doing, and use matching thinners,,,,,,,I am loving every minute of the switch

some complain about having to keep the airbrush clean or it will be hard to get the acrylic paint out,,,,,,,,but, ummm,,,,,,just for reference, I never let Enamels or Floquil Lacquer dry in the airbrush, either, lol

no matter what you choose,,,,,,use the matching thinner until you get the hang of your paint range, remember that different colors or sheens of a paint range might need different treatment,,,,,,,,and after you "get it" , then go ahead with trying alternate sources for thinners, etc

that way, you will have a baseline of what to expect things to be like, without chasing the simple task of getting a brushfull of red to lay down right, lol

Short compatibility matrix (thanks to Masataka Narita)

The L E A (Lacquer Enamel Acrylic) Rule: Lacquers, enamels & acrylics can safety cover base lacquers. Enamels & acrylics can cover enamels (but not lacquers!). Base coat acrylics can only be covered by more acrylics.

In general, I like enamel (or laquer) better because it sticks on tougher and is not so inclined as to pull off with masking tape, as is acrylic.

Basically as tojo said, it works down to personal preference what works for you and what you can get hold of.

It's based on your preference,both have advantages and disadvantages.I use mostly acrylic for my armor models,and enamels for aircraft.

Enamels generally airbrush easier and give a nice coverage,but the fumes can be harmful

Acylics have easier cleanup and less fumes but are sometimes harder to airbrush,I realize this is very general,and you will get lots of comments,but it boils down to your own preference