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Future before gloss black base to alclad?

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  • Member since
    December 2012
Future before gloss black base to alclad?
Posted by Z Square 8 on Wednesday, March 6, 2013 12:51 PM

Been perusing the forum topics for info...figured I'd ask for opinions or specific threads to review.

I'm working on a 1/48th B-29 in the Gift GB. I have done some putty/sand seam work. (I realize that I need to spend some additonal sand and polish time before Alclad).

 

Known variables:

20+ years away from the hobby, so alclad is new to me.

I will be using Krylon fusion gloss black...had it on hand before the build started.

Sanding and surface prep (including the use of putty for seam work)-new processes for me-willing to spend the time for sure.

no airbrush experience-neighbor is kind enough to let me borrow his for the painting-no idea what brand it is but can find out as nec. 

this project is personal to me since the build is being customized to honor wife's fallen uncle

My questions are these:

1.Would anybody recommend or have tried the application of future to the sanded areas before going to the gloss black base > Alclad? (wondering since I've read that future has a "self-leveling" property to it).

2.Would this aide in hiding sand/polish shortcomings?

3.If this is doable, would one recommend to coat the entire model or just the sanded areas that might not be up to par?

4.Any potential treatment reactions?

5. post alclad- apply future to re-inforce/minimize handling impact like for dusting? (anti wear prevention and protect decals)- Then top coat recommendations to knock down the gloss?

 

Appreciate any and all feedback as time permits!

--Rich

Site builder of CooksonTributeB29.com 

  

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: MN
Posted by Nathan T on Wednesday, March 6, 2013 2:47 PM

So you basically wanna know if you should use Future as a primer?? No way. I'd prime the model (with an actual primer) after you're done sanding, so you can check for flaws. You can even wet sand the primer with fine grits then spray the gloss black. Then you can even sand and polish the gloss black if you wish. Then spray alclad. Then "Future"...or any clear gloss you like, then decals, then more clear gloss. Then weather as you wish. Then flat coat.

 

 

  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: Earth
Posted by DiscoStu on Wednesday, March 6, 2013 3:37 PM

Alclad offers a "Clear coat primer" in their paint line.  It may be that some are using Future as a substitute for this primer.  It kind of makes sense as it provides a smooth, polished surface as a starting point for your NMF build.  But I've never tried anything like it before.  I typically use Gloss black for shiny finishes and standard gray for common aluminum.

"Ahh the Luftwaffe. The Washington Generals of the History Channel" -Homer Simpson

  

 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Wednesday, March 6, 2013 3:54 PM

First of all, you really want to take some time to learn how to use Alclad II before tackling your model. I started with flat sheets of styrene. Test all combinations of primer and finish over enough times to get consistent results. It'll take you a while, but it is well worth it. Also, while you are at it you can try different colors of Alclad. For a good looking Superfort, you'll want at least three or four different ones. Having the brushouts handy and labeled will really help you out.

I would not use Future as a base for a number of reasons. First, compatibility. Try it on a test and wait a few days to see what happens. Alclad may very well eat right through it.

Second, Future is good stuff but it's thick and tends to fill small details, but it's not like Mr. Surfacer and it will hide both the good and the bad. Also, it will develop drips on you. No matter how careful you are, somewhere on the model there will be a run or two. Normally you would never know because it is invisibly clear. But paint it and they will really jump out.

Krylon is really hot stuff. I have no idea what it would do over Future, but it cannot be good. I also don't use it. I started using it under Alclad when I started using Alclad, because that was the gospel, but it's uncontrollable out of the can and even decanted is hard to use without a mess. I also find it to be entirely unreliable from can to can. My recommendation for Alclad primer is Testor's enamel gloss black, the stuff in the little square bottle. Just give it a couple of weeks to cure, but it works very well for me.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    February 2015
Posted by Bick on Wednesday, March 6, 2013 5:03 PM

There's a wonderful description of how this modeler uses Alclad for NMF HERE. His results with Alclad are beautiful! He has done a B-29 - about the ninth photo down in the link - have a look at some of his other models while your there.

  • Member since
    December 2012
Posted by Z Square 8 on Thursday, March 7, 2013 7:59 AM

Let me express my sincere thanks to all so far that have replied and shared their experience/advice. Bow Down

I appreciate it and I know that my research to find the best advice has paid off before starting this project...it wasn't just a place to post WIP images or a final photo for me as previously indicated by it being a personal project. Toast

Early in my research before starting, I did read and execute a grey Testor's primer on all the kit parts from rattle can with good results. The wing/fuselage and a couple of areas on the top fuselage join needed some work which prompted the questions...especially since I read about putty/sand for fill. Unfortunately, I did not spend enough time researching more tips on executing this process well. With that said, I knew I had some back up correction steps that needed time. This morning I reviewed and researched Mr. Surfacer and will pick some up to aid me in the corrections needed. I believe it really comes down now to experience in execution which is my challenge in meeting my expectations/satisfaction.

Obviously, I will refrain from using Future as a sanding filler based on the input received.

Also, from researching Mr. Loch's site and Swanny's site previously, I read where sanding and polishing with some very fine grit is advisable. In preparation, I have already aquired grits up to 12000,(small 2x2 pads and a polishing cloth).

My next questions are:

1. Even with grits this fine, will not the raised panel lines and detail of the molding be damaged? Or is it so fine that the "thinness" of the Alclad will still pick up on the remaining detail from a very light sand?

2. Would you avoid sanding over these details and if so, how would you advise the detail sand/polish process? How would one get up close to these details? Mask them?

 

Really makes me wish I had done a "practice" kit build before this bird...but I can use the other parts of the kit like the fat boy bomb and incendiary bomb halves as test pieces in lieu of since I will not be using them for a diarrama or display this time.

--Rich

Site builder of CooksonTributeB29.com 

  

  • Member since
    December 2006
  • From: Phoenix, AZ
Posted by Fly-n-hi on Thursday, March 7, 2013 8:11 AM

Prime with Tamiya primer and use Alclad's Gloss Black Base.  Works great.

  • Member since
    December 2012
Posted by Z Square 8 on Thursday, March 7, 2013 8:14 AM

GMorrison

Also, while you are at it you can try different colors of Alclad. For a good looking Superfort, you'll want at least three or four different ones. Having the brushouts handy and labeled will really help you out.

GMorrison- thank you for this tidbit as well. I have two colors already from Alclad, "Dull Aluminum"  and "Aircraft Airframe". What others would you suggest as I am looking to add depth to the finish from a color standpoint. Maybe even doing some wash for engine exhaust stains.

Thank you in advance

--Rich

Site builder of CooksonTributeB29.com 

  

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