Iwata V. Badger

This is an often-asked question and you will hear several answers so here's my take.
The Iwata airbrushes are built to a little higher standard of machining and tolerances than most other brands and some people prefer that because they seem to feel a little tighter than other brands.
They do not however, spray any finer or smoother than a Badger which is quite a bit less money, especially for parts. I would also argue that no airbrush company takes better care of their customers than does Badger and that is also a plus. Am I biased towards Badger airbrushes? I think everyone here on the forum would say yes I am and I would agree, but I am biased for the above reasons. Buying an Iwata is not going to make you a better airbrusher, it is more of a preference thing.

Mike

I have a couple friends that are professional air brushers and they both use Badgers. I have a Badger 155 and love it.

thanks i really appreciate it, i was swinging more towards a badger anyways cuz my aztek is like death

QUOTE: Originally posted by MikeV Buying an Iwata is not going to make you a better airbrusher, it is more of a preference thing. Mike

And as a Badger 200NH, and an Iwata HP-CS owner, both of which I love, I could not agree more with Mike.

stinger

I have a Badger 360 which is essentially a 155 Anthem and an Iwata Eclipse. They are both fine airbrushes with pros and cons. I find that I can control the Badger 360 much better, but the Iwata atomizes better at a given air pressure. The Iwata has gone up in price by $10 since I bought it. I probably wouldn't have bought both of them at the new Iwata price.

I have quick connects attached to them. I'm using one for acrylic and one more enamel paints as I use both kind of paint and I tend to build models in mass production mode so I'm painting 4 to 6 at once.

Being one of a fine line fanatic with the airbrushes, it has been my experience that I can spray finer lines with greater ease with the Iwata HP-CS,BS shooting enamels than I can with the Anthem. Due in part to the differences of the airbrushs' nozzle/ needle sizes (Anthem approx. .5mm and Iwata .35mm). Admittingly I did get great atomization of the paint from the Anthem, but for fine lines, free hand camo outlining, small detail painting, shading and other minute spraying effects the Iwata HP-CS, BS was my weapon of choice for 1/72nd scale aircraft modeling. I use my Anthem for some detail but more for single colors and clear coats. My humble two cents...

hrm... is it possible to use badger needles in iwata?

i would say... shockingly... thebadger. its cheaper, and almost the same, and you are supporting your country when you buy it (ha)
however i do prefer iwata its imho easier to control and easier to use

Unnamedplayer, what an intriguing question you have posed. Is it possible to use Badger needles in Iwata? That is a fast and easy answer if you have Iwatas, Badgers and Thayer & Chandlers. The straight answer is…no, the Badger needle will not work in the Iwata. The length of my Badger 100sg AB is too small to fit in the Iwata. BUT…

You did get me thinking. If we broaden the thought and expand the airbrush lines to include Thayer & Chandler then we can compare not ‘apples and oranges’ mismatch but now two different varieties of oranges. I took the Iwata HP-CR Revolution and a Thayer & Chandler Omni 4000 and started to do the same mix of needles and nozzle. Both needles are virtually the same length and thickness and the tapers on the working end of the brush are slightly different but within range of use. I don’t know if I am the first in the world to try an Omni needle in an Iwata nozzle but I can tell you this…IT WORKS. The cheaper Omni needle will work in, at least, an Iwata HP-CR airbrush. I just did a quick test and I they were sprayed within minutes of each other with different colors. While the spray pattern is a little different the airbrush does not act different. Either needle would work just as well as the other. It would just be a matter of getting used to what the spray does. The needles were so close looking to each other I could almost get the two confused as to which needle when in what airbrush. Almost. I can tell by feel which needle belongs with which airbrush. Look at the picture and you can see the results of the mix and match.

QUOTE: Originally posted by roosterfish The needles were so close looking to each other I could almost get the two confused as to which needle when in what airbrush.

Just another example of how Iwata copies another company's designs.

Mike

roosterfish,

Were you the same distance from the surface with both of those spray patterns?
The Omni needle looks like it produced a sharper line and the Iwata needle produced a softer one. That looks like you may have been closer with the Omni needle.

Mike

I was just about to put a revision, Mike. I did the picture in a hurry and didn't really look at the finished product before I did the scan. The JPG picture really doesn't do the picture justice. So waiting 12 hours before I looked at the spray pattern again and giving it a chance to really dry I do want to add that the patterns are very similar. It might be because any scanner (mine has a CIS sensor) tend to be bias towards certain colors and I suspect my scanner is bias toward reds so the web image looks thicker line for the T&C needle. But looking at the original spray pattern if the colors were not different I would not be able to tell what needle was used in the airbrush.

I'm going to redo the spray test again but this time I'll use the same paint color. This is getting interesting. I might just try an Iwata HP-CR needle in the T&C Omni 4000 too!

Here is another comparison picture. Hopefully if the JPG compressed picture doesn't butcher the image you can see that the the cheaper Omni needles will work in the HP-CR. So the combination is HP-CR can use a cheaper Omni needle. But it doesn't work the other way; the Omni AB cannot use the HP-CR needle because the CR needle shaft is bigger (the nozzle is built larger too on the CR). But that is OK; why would I want to put a more expensive needle in the Omni when the standard one will too?

So you can save the high cost of an HP-CR needle by using an cheaper Omni needle instead. And the Omni needle works excellent in the CR.

QUOTE: Originally posted by roosterfish So you can save the high cost of an HP-CR needle by using an cheaper Omni needle instead. And the Omni needle works excellent in the CR.

Better yet, you could just buy an Omni airbrush instead of an Iwata and save even more.

Mike

hahaha mikev

i was also thinking, badger 155 anthem w/ airhose: 169CD
Iwata revolution cr w/ airhose: 140-180 depending on hobby store. which to get... so hard quesetion. cheaper needles or cheaper price...

unnamedplayer,

Those are both good choices and you have to decide that question by what feels better in your hand if you are looking at them in person.
I like Badger as you know. They take care of their customers better than any other airbrush company, as they are a family owned business and they treat not only their workers, but their customers as family too.

Mike

Aaaaah, Mike, I was thinking of some of us people who were mistaken, misguided, and who were moved the wrong way and bought the terrible airbrush, the Iwata. We must now live in the shadows, bear the chains of indignation, hold our mutual heads down in shame and humiliation by owning a poor man’s imitation Badger airbrush.

Iwata HP-CR owners now have an option of being semi-proud and saying they have a better Badger part in their sad airbrush. And with the enlightenment of how well a cheaper American part will work in their foreign brush then the Iwata users might dump their ill-conceived foreign brushes in mass and rush to only American products.

The little test was purely and experiment and option for Iwata HP-CR users to see if another needle would work in another airbrush.

‘nuff said.

QUOTE: Originally posted by roosterfish Aaaaah, Mike, I was thinking of some of us people who were mistaken, misguided, and who were moved the wrong way and bought the terrible airbrush, the Iwata. We must now live in the shadows, bear the chains of indignation, hold our mutual heads down in shame and humiliation by owning a poor man’s imitation Badger airbrush.

roosterfish,

Don't be so hard on yourself my friend. Next time you will know better.

Mike

twistedkrusty I see that you can't wait to join the Marines on June 28, that right? I followed that path in 1965, be carefull what you wish for, it tends to come true. Best of luck and I hope your airbrush questions were answered. I use an Aztec so I'll go hide now G.L.

hrm... i like gravity more, but then it obstructs vision... its easier to clean but..er.... no counter to that

the places where i shop only let me buy them, not feel them, and no refunds or exchanges, i tried 5 places, but none lemme feel. i used a paasche vsr before, really damn good ab, costs less, but i dont like the feel. i think the iwata would be a better choice for me, since it is slightly heavier, and i can control heavy things more than i can control light things. is there any way i can machine a badger 155 to have the bottom feed thing... on the top?

oh mike, how fine lines can 155 do compared to cr or bcr, if more equal?
can bcr take a color cup?
is the 155 have adjustable trigger tension?
are teh airhoses teh same width?
those ar the questions i have

QUOTE: Originally posted by unnamedplayer is there any way i can machine a badger 155 to have the bottom feed thing... on the top?

No. Why would you want it on the top? If you want a gravity-feed model then look at the Badger Omni line such as the Omni 4000 and 5000.

QUOTE: oh mike, how fine lines can 155 do compared to cr or bcr, if more equal?

The Anthem 155 will spray just as fine as the Revolution CR and BCR do, and possibly even finer.

QUOTE: can bcr take a color cup?

Yes.

QUOTE: is the 155 have adjustable trigger tension?

Yes. All double-action airbrushes that I am familiar with have adjustable trigger tension.

QUOTE: are teh airhoses teh same width?

I don't know what you mean here. All Badger and Omni airbrushes fit the same airhose.
Iwata has their own airhose and they don't fit the Badger airhose.

Mike

Mike, how do you adjust the trigger tension on the Omni 4000?

Yeah i am excited to join up, dont worry i will be careful, i am doing reserve, i joined Force Recon Reserve Unit so i think that could go pretty interestingly... Thanks for your concern, I am curious as to how your experience in the Marines went?

Mike: thanks for the answers... however, i am weary to order online, and no where i know has any omni's for sale except the 6000,and im not getting that

QUOTE: Originally posted by Kingbone Mike, how do you adjust the trigger tension on the Omni 4000?

Unscrew the handle and remove it. Then look at the knurled barrel sticking out of the back of the body of the airbrush that the needle exits from. This is the trigger spring adjuster. If you turn it clockwise it will increase tension.
It is part #T612 in this schematic:


Mike

QUOTE: Originally posted by unnamedplayer Mike: thanks for the answers... however, i am weary to order online, and no where i know has any omni's for sale except the 6000,and im not getting that

You can order one on the phone can't you?

Mike

never knew that i would start a "hot topic" topic, kinda kewl I am hoping to recieve my anthem tomorrow, really excited to use it!!

no credit card... however, just a min ago i saw some guy offer one HERE on fsm, 30 bucks, revoltuion cr. you know who you are, come to the dark side

QUOTE: Originally posted by unnamedplayer no credit card... however, just a min ago i saw some guy offer one HERE on fsm, 30 bucks, revoltuion cr. you know who you are, come to the dark side

Yes, that was Greg who saw the light and came back to the airbrushes of the good old U.S.A.

Mike

QUOTE: Originally posted by unnamedplayer no credit card...

You could call the place online that is selling them and get a total cost for it and then go get a money order and buy it that way. It's up to you of course.

Mike