whats the secret to using a wash

+1 Don. People tend to over exaggerate panel lines. Like you said maybe dark around panels that are often taken off, but not the whole plane. I have been to many air shows and seen every a ton of different planes, propeller and jet and panel lines are not as visible as people tend to think. Plus in the real world, there are not huge gaps between panels as depicted on models. Panels are flush together thus not really allowing an extreme build up of grime. Now granted if the planes is old and sits out in the elements all the time and is never washed, then yeah the panel lines are going to be more visible, but not midnight dark. I tend to model my panel lines very light, to the point that they are almost not visible, but juuuuust enough to hint at seperate panels when you inspect the model. Thats the most realistic way to do it in my opinion.

I'll mention one thing to watch out for with the Flory washes.  Do not contaminate the wash with any solvent or object used with solvent, ie. a stirring stick or brush.  The solvent will ruin the wash; it will "separate" and never behave right again...amhik  Just sayin'...

Gary

I've never had any luck using any bottled hobby paints for washes. I only use Flory's aka Promodeller, or oil tube paints. Everytime I use oils I'm just completely blown away on how easy they are to use and blend in, and then wipe away when you're done. You do want to make sure your gloss coat is dry before doing a wash, otherwise the wash will soak into and stick to the gloss coat, to be never wiped off again. They key to making your own washes is good paint and finding the right thinning ratio.

I gave the Flory wash a try and it worked very well. I suspect my original issue was that I was not waiting long enough for the clear coat to dry before applying the wash. Someone did mention that not all acrylic paint are the same. I think the inexpensive paint I purchased to make my wash contributed to my  headache. I'm sure others have had good successes with their method of weathering but the Flory wash was the easiest I have used and it will be my preferred method for weathering.

waikong

Yes, this should apply to weathering over clear coats. Thinned oil paint will attack an enamel coat. While a future coat is pretty tough, it's still possible to damage it with acrylic paint, especially with lots of thinner.

I see from the comment that you use the 'sludge' wash method. You can try just dipping a small amount of paint into the panel line and let capillary action to draw the wash in. Much less clean up to do. This is my preferred method (oil over future) as its gives me more control, but it is more time consuming.

Would India ink fall in the oil category?

Yes, this should apply to weathering over clear coats. Thinned oil paint will attack an enamel coat. While a future coat is pretty tough, it's still possible to damage it with acrylic paint, especially with lots of thinner.

I see from the comment that you use the 'sludge' wash method. You can try just dipping a small amount of paint into the panel line and let capillary action to draw the wash in. Much less clean up to do. This is my preferred method (oil over future) as its gives me more control, but it is more time consuming.

Your comments have been helpful. I suspect that maybe I am not waiting long enough after applying the gloss coat. I have tried both Future and a Acrylic gloss. I do have another question. Since we should have dissimilar coats i.e. Acrylic over enamel. Does this apply to the clear coat? I paint with enamel and then seal with acrylic clear then apply decals and attempt weathering and for a final clear I again use acrylic flat clear. I have tried artist oils and artist acrylic oils but have not had good luck. I'm assuming the rule of dissimilar also applies with the artist oils? Maybe once the clear coat is completely dry either enamel based or acrylic it does not matter what I use for weathering?

thanks,

Chris makes a good point - most acrylics are water mixable, but once dry it will take something stronger to rejuvenate them  in order to wipe them off.

Another thing to try is less drying time, and more accurate application of the wash, aka pinwash, so there is only minimal cleanup.  Rely on capillary action to fill in the lines.

regards,

Jack

IMO, acrylics are terrible for washes because once they dry, it's difficult to remove them, as in your case.

Use artist oil paints instead. They are fool-proof because they are slow drying and they are super easy to remove if you don't like the result.

I see many panel lines done to dark anyway.  Do other weathering and let panel lines go until you are truly expert.  Maybe start panel lines only around removable panels.  A plane has to be really a beater to show much around non-removable panels.

According to this article, Flory and Promodeller washes are one in the same?

http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Rev2/1901-2000/rev1972-Promodellers-wash-Wood/00.shtm

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Couple things that might be causing problems with home made washes:

1.) - the gloss coat or paint hasn't fully cured, and the wash becomes imbedded into the surface.  Someone once said, if you can smell it, it's still drying.

2.) - acrylic paints are not all the same, and some brands might be more "hot" than others - who knows what chemical ingredients are reacting to the gloss underneath.

regards,

Jack

Here is the US, Pro Modeller wash works in the same manner and cleans up easily enough. Dissimilar layers also help. On top of the enamel, I usually use Future, and then if I am not using PM wash I use enamels- usually MM Burnt Umber in most cases.

A good gloss coat really seals it in and protects the paint.I found the Future Floor Wax really does the job.And as for the wash,you gotta try this stuff, www.florymodels.co.uk/washes

works great,and easy to use,you can get it from spruebrothers in the states