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Airbrush / Miniature Spray Gun Upgrade Help

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  • Member since
    January, 2017
  • From: East Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Airbrush / Miniature Spray Gun Upgrade Help
Posted by damouav on Wednesday, May 03, 2017 11:16 PM

Background

I have started with 1/48 aircaft, would like to start some 1/32  or even 1/24. I may adventure into other modeling forms at a later stage. I use a cheap chinese double action, gravity feed internal mix .35mm AB for general use (Primers, clear coates etc). Being over 10 years old its starting to lack in performance.

I also own Iwata HP-CS which is brilliant and has become my go to AB for almost everything.

Problem

I am in need of an AB or Mini Spray Gun that can handle thicker paints, clear coats etc. My original thought was an Iwata Eclipse HP-BCS which would handle heavier paints but I dont believe it would lay sufficient paint down to obtain that great finish I'm aiming for. Then there is the Iwata RG3 .6mm which Im not sure is overkill, but Paul Budzik make a solid positive comments about?

I read Paul Budzik's exquisite series about Spray Guns and AB but I just need some input before pulling the trigger on the investment.

I can over analyise things from time to time, and this one of those situations...

Thanks in advance

Damian

 

In Progress
1/48 Hasegawa Corsair AU-1 (F4U-6)
Pending
1/48 Hobby Boss TBF-1C Avenger
1/48 Tamiya P-47-D Bubbletop
1/48 Hasegawa P51-D
1/48 Roden S.E.5a
  • Member since
    October, 2008
  • From: Fullerton, Calif.
Posted by Don Wheeler on Thursday, May 04, 2017 11:10 AM

As Paul points out in his video, a high quality mini spray gun with a fan pattern is the best tool for even coverage over a large area.  So, if you want the best, follow his advice.

Do you need it?  I'm not convinced.  A lot of modelers do very well with an inexpensive airbrush like the Paasche H.  A lot depends on the skill of the user.

Don

https://sites.google.com/site/donsairbrushtips/home

A collection of airbrush tips and reviews

Now also an Amazon E-book and paperback of tips.

  • Member since
    January, 2006
Posted by Paul Budzik on Thursday, May 04, 2017 9:22 PM

Damian ... do not get the fan pattern RG-3 only the round pattern ... If you want a fan pattern look at the Eclipse G-6, G-5, or LPH-50 (you should have a tank compressor for this one)

Not sure if you've seen these ...

 

 

I also take issue with Don's remark about the Paasche H.  Here is a comparison of atomization from a Paasche H (Bottom) and an internal mix airbrush

... which do you think is going to give you a smoother surface finish?  In comparison, the Paasche H looks like a drywall gun.  That's just an inherent problem with an airbrush that introduces paint so far out into the airstream.  It has nothing to do with operator skill.

Paul

  • Member since
    January, 2017
  • From: East Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Posted by damouav on Thursday, May 04, 2017 10:14 PM

Thanks Don for your valued comments.

I very much appreciate your input, having viewed your site on numerous occasions and read the great reviews you have spent many hours complying.

I would prefer to stick with a single brand that I have experenice with if at all possible, being Iwata. The .5mm Iwata Eclipse HP BSC is a siphon, double action which could be the ansewer. It is similar to your suggestion in that they are both siphon AB's with similar needle dia.

Damian

In Progress
1/48 Hasegawa Corsair AU-1 (F4U-6)
Pending
1/48 Hobby Boss TBF-1C Avenger
1/48 Tamiya P-47-D Bubbletop
1/48 Hasegawa P51-D
1/48 Roden S.E.5a
  • Member since
    January, 2017
  • From: East Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Posted by damouav on Thursday, May 04, 2017 10:44 PM

Hi Paul,

I'm going start by thanking you, as it was after looking over your site that it prompted me to get back into this hobby after years away, Thank You!

I have watched all of your videos including the two listed several times. I have also reviewed all your extensive overviews on all subject matter. You have demonstrated, after years of first class results, the best methods of obatining those outcomes.

I suppose my hesitation is in some way, is the cost outlay. Even with the lower cost ebay finds that can be found. But if I aspire to achieve high quality results, as you have created over the years, then some additional outlay is required.

With that, the RG3 would be my weapon of choice, taking into consideration my curent and recent compressor upgrade.

Thank you for taking the time to respond, even though you have already spent many, many hours in the production of your brilliant series on your site for this exact reason.

Damian

In Progress
1/48 Hasegawa Corsair AU-1 (F4U-6)
Pending
1/48 Hobby Boss TBF-1C Avenger
1/48 Tamiya P-47-D Bubbletop
1/48 Hasegawa P51-D
1/48 Roden S.E.5a
  • Member since
    October, 2008
  • From: Fullerton, Calif.
Posted by Don Wheeler on Thursday, May 04, 2017 11:29 PM

I agree with Paul that an external mix airbrush like the Paasche H has a coarser spray than an internal mix.  It's obvious when you mist it on as in his sample.  But, I know from monitoring scale auto forums, that it is a favorite with many of these people.  I also often reference this page by Roy Sutherland who uses nothing but an H. So, I have to believe a nice smooth finish is certainly possible.

If you look at my review of the Badger 250, you can see that even that simple device can put down a smooth coat of paint with practice.

I used the H as an example, it was not meant as a recommendation.

Don

https://sites.google.com/site/donsairbrushtips/home

A collection of airbrush tips and reviews

Now also an Amazon E-book and paperback of tips.

  • Member since
    November, 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Friday, May 05, 2017 9:18 AM

Why can't you thin the thicker paints?

 

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Friday, May 05, 2017 10:21 AM

Don Stauffer

Why can't you thin the thicker paints?

 

 

 

That ^^^ I see no reason why you can't thin thicker paint for airbrushing.

  • Member since
    October, 2008
  • From: Fullerton, Calif.
Posted by Don Wheeler on Friday, May 05, 2017 10:37 AM

Don Stauffer

Why can't you thin the thicker paints?

You can.  Also, because the air orifice is further from the nozzle in an external mix airbrush, they need more air for good atomization.  Whereas 10 or 15psi might be fine for an internal mix, 30 or 35 works better for an H or a Badger 350.

Don

https://sites.google.com/site/donsairbrushtips/home

A collection of airbrush tips and reviews

Now also an Amazon E-book and paperback of tips.

  • Member since
    October, 2008
  • From: Fullerton, Calif.
Posted by Don Wheeler on Friday, May 05, 2017 12:41 PM

Here is an experiment I did back in 2011.  I thought it might be of interest here.

I made a fixture to hold an airbrush 2 inches above the surface.

Then I sprayed the smallest dot of ink or food color I could on a piece of printer paper placed below it.  I was attempting to come up with a better way to compare airbrushes. Here is my sample using a Paasche H with a fine nozzle.

Hdot

For comparison, here is the Iwata HP-CR.

Air pressure was tweaked for best results.

Don

https://sites.google.com/site/donsairbrushtips/home

A collection of airbrush tips and reviews

Now also an Amazon E-book and paperback of tips.

  • Member since
    January, 2017
  • From: East Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Posted by damouav on Friday, May 05, 2017 9:12 PM

You can, and I do thin all my acrylic and laquer paint/primers. On small parts I get a great finish (Using my Iwata HP-CS .35mm), however on larger areas I am of the belief that getting more paint down, allowing to maintain a wet edge and reduced passes would allow for a better end result.

I could try to increase the flash time of the paint by adding retarders or the like,  or just purchase the right tool for the job.

Just comes down to money, and how much I need to part with.

In Progress
1/48 Hasegawa Corsair AU-1 (F4U-6)
Pending
1/48 Hobby Boss TBF-1C Avenger
1/48 Tamiya P-47-D Bubbletop
1/48 Hasegawa P51-D
1/48 Roden S.E.5a
  • Member since
    January, 2017
  • From: East Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Posted by damouav on Friday, May 26, 2017 3:13 AM

I would like to start by thanking all the members for there invaluable input.

I reviewed all the aspects and I made a final purchase today based on two factors;

1. Price, I'm in between jobs so the price point was a very important aspect

2. I have a certain size compressor, which I had no intention of replacing so soon after I bought it

So the Iwata Revoultion CR won my interim vote and is about to be tested.

Happy modelling.

Damian

 

In Progress
1/48 Hasegawa Corsair AU-1 (F4U-6)
Pending
1/48 Hobby Boss TBF-1C Avenger
1/48 Tamiya P-47-D Bubbletop
1/48 Hasegawa P51-D
1/48 Roden S.E.5a
  • Member since
    January, 2017
  • From: East Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Posted by damouav on Monday, May 29, 2017 8:43 PM

I had a chance to put the Iwata Revolution CR to good use on my 1/48 Tamiya De Haviland Mosquito, and boy she worked a treat. Very good control, nice weight, easy to clean and layed down a nice coverage, pherhaps not as much as I would want but this is a matter of air pressure and my skill level.

Out of a rating of 5 I would give it a solid 4.

The following are some shoots taken after I finished unmasking my mossie (MRP White Primer and decanted Tamiya AS spray cans which were AB's).

In Progress
1/48 Hasegawa Corsair AU-1 (F4U-6)
Pending
1/48 Hobby Boss TBF-1C Avenger
1/48 Tamiya P-47-D Bubbletop
1/48 Hasegawa P51-D
1/48 Roden S.E.5a
  • Member since
    July, 2013
Posted by modelmaker66 on Tuesday, May 30, 2017 11:19 PM

damouav

I would like to start by thanking all the members for there invaluable input.

I reviewed all the aspects and I made a final purchase today based on two factors;

1. Price, I'm in between jobs so the price point was a very important aspect

2. I have a certain size compressor, which I had no intention of replacing so soon after I bought it

So the Iwata Revoultion CR won my interim vote and is about to be tested.

Happy modelling.

Damian

 

 

Good choice! That will make so many problems dissapear before you even begin!

  • Member since
    January, 2017
  • From: East Gippsland, Victoria, Australia
Posted by damouav on Tuesday, May 30, 2017 11:24 PM

Oo has it so done that.

Just need to dial in the pressure and I can continue to cook to gas.

In Progress
1/48 Hasegawa Corsair AU-1 (F4U-6)
Pending
1/48 Hobby Boss TBF-1C Avenger
1/48 Tamiya P-47-D Bubbletop
1/48 Hasegawa P51-D
1/48 Roden S.E.5a

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