Paint pooling

berny13

Member since
February 2003
From: Panama City, Florida, Hurricane Alley

Paint pooling

Posted by berny13 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 4:46 PM

I just received three sets of intakes for my Tamiya F-4D, E & J from Cutting Edge. The Right intake is light gray in color and the left is a darker gray. I cleaned them as normal and sprayed a primer on one set. The light gray, the primer went on perfect. The dark gray, the primer started to pool up. I cleaned the primer off before it had a chance to set up. I cleaned the intake again with Dawn and warm water. I let it air dry and shot the primer on it again. Same results. Again I cleaned it and got one of the other intakes. I cleaned it with Windex, Dawn and warm water. I used a different type of primer and got the same results. I got the third intake and cleaned it with lighter fluid, Dawn and hot water. I really scrubbed it down good. When it was dry I shot the paint on without priming. The paint pooled. I cleaned off the paint and cleaned the intake again. I used a different white paint and got the same results. For some reason paint or primer will not stick to the dark gray intake. Any ideas on how to solve this problem?

Berny

Phormer Phantom Phixer

On the bench

TF-102A Delta Dagger, 32nd FIS, 54-1370, 1/48 scale. Monogram Pro Modeler with C&H conversion.

Revell F-4E Phantom II 33rd TFW, 58th TFS, 69-260, 1/32 scale.

Tamiya F-4D Phantom II, 13th TFS, 66-8711, 1/32 scale. F-4 Phantom Group Build.

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hobby1268

Member since
April 2003

Posted by hobby1268 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 6:06 PM

Have you tried lightly sanding the area you want to prime? If not try sanding with fine grit sand paper to give it some tooth for the paint to bite onto and see if that works.

Hope this helps.

Robert Garelli Spring Hill, Florida

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berny13

Member since
February 2003
From: Panama City, Florida, Hurricane Alley

Posted by berny13 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 6:41 PM

QUOTE: Originally posted by hobby1268

Have you tried lightly sanding the area you want to prime? If not try sanding with fine grit sand paper to give it some tooth for the paint to bite onto and see if that works.

Hope this helps.

I tried that after I made this post. It didn't help at all. I also tried an automotive primer on it and got the same results.

Berny

Phormer Phantom Phixer

On the bench

TF-102A Delta Dagger, 32nd FIS, 54-1370, 1/48 scale. Monogram Pro Modeler with C&H conversion.

Revell F-4E Phantom II 33rd TFW, 58th TFS, 69-260, 1/32 scale.

Tamiya F-4D Phantom II, 13th TFS, 66-8711, 1/32 scale. F-4 Phantom Group Build.

Reply

hobby1268

Member since
April 2003

Posted by hobby1268 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 6:50 PM

The only thing I can think of would be to call Cutting Edge in the morning and see if they might have a solution.
Sorry, I was not much help.

Robert Garelli Spring Hill, Florida

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MusicCity

Member since
January 2004
From: USA

Posted by MusicCity on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 7:05 PM

Was the primer an enamel or laquer? It sounds like there is something in the resin that is preventing paint from sticking. Laquer might be volatile enough to stick. You might also try thinning your primer with laquer thinner (I'd try that on a mold block or something unimportant first) and see if that helps.

Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page

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berny13

Member since
February 2003
From: Panama City, Florida, Hurricane Alley

Posted by berny13 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 7:19 PM

Scott

I tried enamel and laquer primer. Both would not stick. I cleaned up the first set I painted and placed it in boiling water with Dawn. I let it boil for about five minutes and removed it and let it air cool and dry. It was still a little warm when I primed it again. This time the primer stuck to it.

The water had an oily film all around the pot. I guess by boiling it, I boiled out the oil. Problem solved. I'll have to tuck this away in my mind in case the problem should come up for me or any other member of the forum. Wonder if I can recycle the oil and run it in my lawn mower? Mischief [:-,]

Berny

Phormer Phantom Phixer

On the bench

TF-102A Delta Dagger, 32nd FIS, 54-1370, 1/48 scale. Monogram Pro Modeler with C&H conversion.

Revell F-4E Phantom II 33rd TFW, 58th TFS, 69-260, 1/32 scale.

Tamiya F-4D Phantom II, 13th TFS, 66-8711, 1/32 scale. F-4 Phantom Group Build.

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Tankmaster7

Member since
August 2004
From: Nowhere. (Long Island)

Posted by Tankmaster7 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 7:38 PM

wow. i think there is a product by gunze sangyo that is made specifcally for this kind of problem. it's called mr resin cleaner or something or the other. (not mr. resin primer, that's different.)

-Tanky

Welcome to the United States of America, a subsidiary of Exxon Mobil Corporation, in partnership with Halliburton. Security for your constitutional rights provided by Blackwater International.

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MusicCity

Member since
January 2004
From: USA

Posted by MusicCity on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:25 PM

That's really weird, Berny. I've never had resin act that way, and I'm guessing you haven't either Cool [8D]

Heat is always good for drying paint, and I'm wondering whether in this case the heat made the resin a bit more porous so that the paint had a better chance to bite into it. I have no clue what would have boiled out and left a ring around the tub. Really strange, but I'm glad you figured out a fix.

Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page

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eizzle

Member since
August 2005
From: Greencastle, IN

Posted by eizzle on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 9:10 PM

it is a mold release agent so the resin piece will slide out of the mold easier. you can use a cleaner with bleach to get rid of it. Soak it in the cleaner for a day or so and clean with warm water and dawn.

Colin

Homer Simpson for president!!!

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berny13

Member since
February 2003
From: Panama City, Florida, Hurricane Alley

Posted by berny13 on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 10:47 PM

Here are pictures of the intakes. The darker gray was depainted. You can see the quality of the right intake is better.

Left Intake

Left Intake

Right Intake

Berny

Phormer Phantom Phixer

On the bench

TF-102A Delta Dagger, 32nd FIS, 54-1370, 1/48 scale. Monogram Pro Modeler with C&H conversion.

Revell F-4E Phantom II 33rd TFW, 58th TFS, 69-260, 1/32 scale.

Tamiya F-4D Phantom II, 13th TFS, 66-8711, 1/32 scale. F-4 Phantom Group Build.

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MusicCity

Member since
January 2004
From: USA

Posted by MusicCity on Thursday, September 29, 2005 10:05 AM

Berny that left intake is just plain ugly compared to the right. Just makes me wonder if there wasn't something wrong with their mix when they did that one. It's just nowhere nearly as clean looking as the one for the right side.

Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page

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berny13

Member since
February 2003
From: Panama City, Florida, Hurricane Alley

Posted by berny13 on Thursday, September 29, 2005 3:21 PM

Scott. The left intake seems a little softer than the right intake. You are right though, it is plain ugly compared to the right intake

The intake I primed yesterday, the primer is starting to flake and peel off. I stripped it down and am going to let it soak overnight in bleach. The second intake, I am going to let it soak overnight in Windex. The third I am soaking overnight in vinegar. I'll try tomorrow and see which method was effective. If they fall apart, I will take the kit intake and fill it in with Milliput. I'll have to sand down the over size patches they have on it.

Berny

Phormer Phantom Phixer

On the bench

TF-102A Delta Dagger, 32nd FIS, 54-1370, 1/48 scale. Monogram Pro Modeler with C&H conversion.

Revell F-4E Phantom II 33rd TFW, 58th TFS, 69-260, 1/32 scale.

Tamiya F-4D Phantom II, 13th TFS, 66-8711, 1/32 scale. F-4 Phantom Group Build.

Reply

MusicCity

Member since
January 2004
From: USA

Posted by MusicCity on Thursday, September 29, 2005 6:27 PM

Have you considered trying to get a replacement? I've used a good bit of Cutting Edge resin and it's usually very good quality. The material they use is quite strong compared to other resin pieces I've dealt with and if you are seeing pieces that are soft I just think something is wrong with them. My concern would be that even if you do get paint to adhere now that somewhere down the line it's going to start to flake again. It would really be annoying to get everything assembled and ready to paint and find your primer popping off again.

Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page

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berny13

Member since
February 2003
From: Panama City, Florida, Hurricane Alley

Posted by berny13 on Friday, September 30, 2005 3:12 PM

Here are the results of my test. After soaking overnight, I cleaned each with warm water and Dawn. I let then dry and sprayed primer on all three.

The one soaked over night in vinegar, the primer got a lot of air bubbles under it. I can take my finger and rub off the primer.

The intake soaked in Windex, the primer took a while to dry but it is sticking. The gloss white is taking a long time to dry.

The intake soaked in bleach, the primer is sticking. The only way to remove it is with a sanding stick or sandpaper ( I tried this in an area that will not be seen). The gloss white went on and dried quick. It has fully cured and has a very smooth surface.

I am going to let all three set over the weekend and see what happens.

Berny

Phormer Phantom Phixer

On the bench

TF-102A Delta Dagger, 32nd FIS, 54-1370, 1/48 scale. Monogram Pro Modeler with C&H conversion.

Revell F-4E Phantom II 33rd TFW, 58th TFS, 69-260, 1/32 scale.

Tamiya F-4D Phantom II, 13th TFS, 66-8711, 1/32 scale. F-4 Phantom Group Build.

Reply

berny13

Member since
February 2003
From: Panama City, Florida, Hurricane Alley

Posted by berny13 on Friday, September 30, 2005 8:20 PM

Update. The one soaked in vinegar is starting to fall apart. Large flakes are falling off of the intake. The only way I can describe it is, it is starting to delaminate. I am going to contact Cutting Edge Monday and see what they suggest. I am going to request a replacement.

The other two are good. Both have the paint sticking with no problem. The left intakes fit is very bad with large gaps which will have to be filled. The right intake fits fair. I'll know not to buy any more though.

Berny

Phormer Phantom Phixer

On the bench

TF-102A Delta Dagger, 32nd FIS, 54-1370, 1/48 scale. Monogram Pro Modeler with C&H conversion.

Revell F-4E Phantom II 33rd TFW, 58th TFS, 69-260, 1/32 scale.

Tamiya F-4D Phantom II, 13th TFS, 66-8711, 1/32 scale. F-4 Phantom Group Build.

Reply

MusicCity

Member since
January 2004
From: USA

Posted by MusicCity on Friday, September 30, 2005 10:00 PM

Man, what an ordeal. Sometimes going the extra distance just isn't worth it. Cutting Edge usually does a good job, but everyone messes up sometimes. Sorry about your problems with them.

Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page

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plasticmod992

Member since
January 2003
From: The Hoosier State

Posted by plasticmod992 on Sunday, October 2, 2005 10:23 PM

I've had that same problem when I cast a resin part at home for a model. What I did wrong was the mixing porportions for the resin was off, as a result, the surface of the cast was an oily residue. Same thing...I cleaned, primed and whammmo!..pooling, and /or beeding of the paint and primer. I ended up trashing the casts and made new ones. Maybe you should put together an article in FSM or something!

Greg Williams Owner/ Manager Modern Hobbies LLC Indianapolis, IN. IPMS #44084

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