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MM enamel problems---HELP! PLEASE!

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  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
MM enamel problems---HELP! PLEASE!
Posted by wing_nut on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 7:33 PM

I have been using MM enamels since starting to build models again.  Everything has been go great with paint.  Nice smooth finishes and so on... well beyond my expectations.  Now all of a sudden I can't figure out what is happening.  The paint that used to go down with barely a need for a second coat is giving me major problems.

 

The paint looks as though the first coat is being put down on an oily surface... no coverage and the paint sort of spreads or blisters... can't really describe it any better than that.  Anyone ever had a hard time getting a smooth coat of Future?  It looks like that, sort of beading up.  And what used to be touch dry and matte finish in 30 minutes is now semi-gloss and tacky after the same amount of time. 

 

 

 

 

I tried saving money by using a good brand of mineral sprits from Home Depot with mixes of 4-1, 3-1, 2-1 paint-thinner and bad results.  Today I went back to the expensive MM thinner and the same results.  Model was swabbed with alcohol and dried before painting so it’s clean.   I even took the temperature of the paint 71 degrees.  Room where the AB and compressor are located is a little chilly though but the furnace is in that room so it is not freezing.  There is a little moisture in the moisture trap but isn’t that where it is supposed to be?

 

 

Marc  

  • Member since
    May 2005
  • From: Left forever
Posted by Bgrigg on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 7:50 PM
Does the trap have a release valve that lets out the moisture? Or is it the kind that uses an absorbent filter?
If it's the latter, and there is water in the moisture trap then the life of that moisture trap is probably past it's prime and should be replaced.

The pic you show appears to be water in the paint.

So long folks!

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: SETX. USA
Posted by tho9900 on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 8:02 PM

Marc - that looks a lot like it was caused by an oily surface.  I have had the same thing happen, ironically on another Trumpeter kit, the HH-65 Dauphin.  I ended up buying another one and using Simple Green on it (kind of like Castrol Super Clean) and got decent results, but it seemed if I left it for more than two or so days the surface looked oily again, maybe its the plastic itself and not the mold lube that is causing it?  I seem to remember someone commenting on some asian and eastern european companies using cheaper plastic and it 'sweating' oils after time...  (oils would seep from the plastic I guess and make the model greasy again.)

On the same note though, I have also bought bad MM paint before too... mainly at one LHS that I vow to buy bothing but kits from again (Ok maybe alclad, but thats it!  no enamel paints!), I think he doesn't rotate stock.    One bottle while not exactly like your results, really didn't cover good and left an uneven surface to the paint, almost like bubbling.  Another bottle clogged my airbrush and ended up flowing back into the body of it... Is this the first time you have used out of this bottle?  I have heard other people here have mixed results due to batch variations in MM as well...

Hope you have better results... I've been enjoying your build in the Germany BG...

-=edit=-

On the mineral spirits subject, I had somewhat similar (poor) results with different mixtures.  At $5.00 a bottle at Hobby Lobby I'm sticking to the MM thinner for painting and mineral spirits for cleaning.  As little as I spray enamel nowadays it's worth it!

---Tom--- O' brave new world, That has such people in it!
  • Member since
    April 2005
  • From: Piscataway, NJ!
Posted by wing_nut on Thursday, January 12, 2006 11:02 AM

Bill – I thought maybe water too...at first.  The trap has a clear body and there is just a tiny bit of fogging inside and that’s all… there has never been enough to drain out the bottom.  When I look at the other wing “B” side that I sprayed I noted the paint was pulling away from a series of test rivets I had punched, leaving the same type of spot in the paint with the rivet dead center.

 

Tom – One wing interior test swabbed with alcohol the other not, 2 different bottles of paint… same thing.  Thought it was the Trumpeter plastic at first since this is the 1st of their kits I have built.  The Evergreen styrene on the flaps did the same thing so I am at loss.  Never need a primer before but I guess I need to try one.  Glad you are enjoying build.  As I get closer and closer to painting I am getting nervous of messing it up.

 

Thanks for help guys...it is appreciated.

Marc  

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Southern California, USA
Posted by ABARNE on Thursday, January 12, 2006 2:15 PM

What is temperature difference between the room in which you are painting and the room tha holds the compressor?  I am wondering if your airbrush is shooting a stream of cold air into a warm room and causing some kind of moisture condensing effect in the wet paint.  I vaguely remember once having something that painting very similar to your photo, and my memory is dim enough that I think it may be from my pre-compressor days when I used cans of Propel which got quite cold during use.

  • Member since
    August 2005
  • From: Greencastle, IN
Posted by eizzle on Thursday, January 12, 2006 4:04 PM
From what you are saying, I would almost say take your airbrush apart and clean it REALLY good! Scrub everything down with lacquer thinner cause it sounds like, and don't ask me how, but it sounds like you have some sort of oil in your A/B that is getting in the paint when its sprayed through it! Good luck Wing_Nut!

Colin

 Homer Simpson for president!!!

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: SETX. USA
Posted by tho9900 on Thursday, January 12, 2006 7:05 PM

That's just so odd Marc... to me it looks, walks, talks and smells like a duck.  That looks like poor adhesion due to oiliness.  The odd thing is though that the evergreen is doing it.  I'm really at a loss on this as the evergreen part throws a wrench in everything I have been thinking about it... especially the part about two different bottles of paint doing it. 

Was the other bottle one you have used before with good results?  That would be a good test, to use some paint you've used before.  If it still does it, then there IS a conundrum for us, isn't there!

Well good luck, if I think of anything else I'll jot it down here.

---Tom--- O' brave new world, That has such people in it!
  • Member since
    June 2005
  • From: San Tan Valley,AZ
Posted by smokinguns3 on Friday, January 13, 2006 12:31 AM
THose are what we call in the paint and body, Fish eye's coused from contaminated surface, oils,grease and anything the model industry use's for a release agent. as said clean the parts vary well and dry them.
Rob I think i can I think i can
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