Testors Aztek ?

zokissima wrote:

Personally, I'm not really inclined to believe either, as my own personal experience has shown otherwise.

Actually Zoran, I think you've hit the nail on the head about the differing opinions.  If a modeller bought an Aztek at a good price and it has worrked as advertised, that modeller will have nice things to say.  On the other hand, if a modeller bought an Aztek at a higher price than a conventional airbrish and it broke, that modeller will not have nice things to say.  Of course if a modeller starts out in one camp, has his brush break and switches to the other camp and has great results the offered opinions will naturally be all the more strongly stated.

As for me I had an expensive Aztek that broke after only a  few models in spite of the fact that I followed all the Aztek cleaning and care instructions religiously.  While waiting for the warranty replacement I picked up a much cheaper Badger and it has never let me down.  You've had a good experience with an Aztek, so naturally you'll favor them while my bad experience gives me the opposite opinion

zokissima wrote:

...I.'m no professional, but I've seen what it does to my own work, and I've seen that I could do even better given enough practice.

No doubt about that.  Properly used any working airbrush will lay down a beautiful coat of paint.  Over the years, whether using an Aztek, Badger, or Paasche when I have not had good results I knew that the problem was due to my inexperience and not the airbrush.

Andy

Ah, I can't believe I missed this thread. The age old Aztek bash. So many people on these boards have many negative things to say. I'm really not sure why. Especially humorous are the posts touting its lack of results, or its inflated price. Personally, I'm not really inclined to believe either, as my own personal experience has shown otherwise. I've had an Aztek for about 2+ years now, and have not had any major problems. So far I've replaced the nozzle once, and that was about a month ago, after I just couldn't soak the original in thinner any more. Its taken me some time to really get to use the brush well. I've found that you really have to mix the paint correctly, and be very timid with the controls. But I've seen my work over the last few years, and no, I'm no professional, but I've seen what it does to my own work, and I've seen that I could do even better given enough practice. Now, as to price. Again I'm not sure. Omni, Badger, great ABs, and at least here in Canada, all MUCH more expensive then the $50 I spent on my A470.

And that is the rest of the story.... Good day

usmc1371 wrote:

Thanks for the support Greg.  So what does that make, 5 people who like Aztek airbrushes? It's interesting to me that when someone says "Aztek airbrush", most people assume they mean the A470.  Actually, there are 6 different Aztek brand airbrushes on the market. I own an A470 and A320.  The A320 is an internal single action airbrush that uses the same nozzles and cups as the A470.  I use the A320 more than the A470 because it's easier to use.  For the mass majority of the painting I do, I really only need a single action. Greg, just curious, what prompted the failure of your nozzles?  Did you take them apart to clean them or only soak them? Thanks, Jesse

 

It was my error, I took the nozzles apart like it said not to do.  Initially, I thought I was doing the right thing, mostly to save money, and to extend the nozzles' life.  As it turned out, I had buggered something up when I got to tinkering, and bingo, the nozzle was toast!  It was a domino effect at this point.  Then paint began seeping into the body, and before I knew it, the body would fail too.  Lets face it, It was tottaly my fault, and I knew I was asking for it back then when I did it.  Even so, the Azteks I owned all performed very well as mentioned before, especially when I didn't muck with the nozzles.  My old 3000S model still works like the day I purchased it..simply because I don't take it apart anymore, I soak it it the appropriate thinner and use the supplied tools to clear the works.   

Unknownpharoah wrote:

In the end the tool makes your job easier. Its much more enjoyable to learn with a tool that you dont have to fix or fiddle around with everytime you pick it up. You generally get what you pay for. Well... unless its an azteK! In that case I'd rather use my 4.99 single action from Harbor Freight!

I've been using the $4.99 single action from Harbor Freight (my 1st A/B) for about a year now & it serves it's purpose and just recently I received a badger 175 (which is dual action) & I'm in the practice-practice-practice phase with it It was recommended & is a versitle A/B from what I've read up on.

Thanks for the support Greg.  So what does that make, 5 people who like Aztek airbrushes?

It's interesting to me that when someone says "Aztek airbrush", most people assume they mean the A470.  Actually, there are 6 different Aztek brand airbrushes on the market.

I own an A470 and A320.  The A320 is an internal single action airbrush that uses the same nozzles and cups as the A470.  I use the A320 more than the A470 because it's easier to use.  For the mass majority of the painting I do, I really only need a single action.

Greg, just curious, what prompted the failure of your nozzles?  Did you take them apart to clean them or only soak them?

Thanks,

Jesse

I have to agree with USMC1371 for the most part, after all, I've owned and used an Aztek for years and won awards for the finish they helped produce on my models.  It's true that the results of it's use depend largely on the modeler, not the tool.  When I purchased my first "traditional airbrush", I balked at it, but it being a tool, over time I mastered it, like I did the Aztek.  I've used the Aztek, not only models, but airbrushed art as well, years back.  I swore by them and recommended them to others back when when I was a regular on rec.models.scale.  However; I did experienced problems with them, like others have mentioned, but I learned to work around them.  Heck, I still secretly use my Aztek every blue moon, but very infrequently.  The only factor that precipitated the airbrush change for me was long-term repeated cost of nozzles, and repeated shipment back to Testors to replace a failed airbrush body.  In all fairness, Aztek airbrushes have received a bad rap over the years.  Still a good airbrush, for some.  Dispite my fondness for Iwatas, I still have my Aztek after 11 years!

Tankmaster7 wrote:

Holy smokes!!! I coulda sworn that was a picture!!!! It's an airbrush painting you say? Good god, that makes me feel like what i use my airbrush for is like dragging it through mud....

 Well in all reality 3d model painting is pretty basic and not a very complex task. When put in the hands of a true airbrush artist the airbrush can do some amazing things. With the hours of masking, cutting and remasking yet again you can produce some amazing effects. The invent of the vinyl printer has helped this a great deal. Being able to create exact copies of the "positive/Negative" of a paticular image only helps your cause on your quest to become an airbrush artist.
       With enough practice you can achieve some amazing things. I would suggest to anyone who wants to learn more about the airbrush to attend any local "clinics" or "workshops" at your local college/tech school. The best way to learn I have found is to watch a pro and have the time and money to practice as much as you can.
        In the end the tool makes your job easier. Its much more enjoyable to learn with a tool that you dont have to fix or fiddle around with everytime you pick it up. You generally get what you pay for. Well... unless its an azteK! In that case I'd rather use my 4.99 single action from Harbor Freight!

Holy smokes!!! I coulda sworn that was a picture!!!! It's an airbrush painting you say? Good god, that makes me feel like what i use my airbrush for is like dragging it through mud....

gjek wrote:

An Iwata revolution is sixty something dollars from Dixie art with shipping, hint hint...   Greg

Stop supporting the enemy Marine!
Do you not remember Iwo Jima? Saipan? The Mariana's?

An Iwata revolution is sixty something dollars from Dixie art with shipping, hint hint...   Greg

Point is: Why getting a crappy Aztek when you can get a much better tool for the same price ?

I mean, those Aztek kit with 25 nozzle (that you will never use all, unless your nozzle are killed one after the other) cost about the same price as a Good Badger 155 or even an Iwata Revolution !

The Aztek aren't for professional, but are priced just like professional tools. My Aztek costs me $60 when I got it. Then my Badger 155 was $65 ! Can't even compare both airbrush. Finally, my Iwata HP-CP was $140, but I was ready to get something better for more professional use. For hobby, a nice Badger 155 will do the trick, for the same money the Aztek will cost you. It will last longer and be more fun.

Some of my friend tried airbrushing. they got a small crappy Aztek at $40 on Walmart and after 2 weeks they stopped. They didn't liked airbrushing. When they come here, I sit them in front of a model and give them my Iwata. Then it cost me a lot of money on pizza because they don't want to leave :p

You will not have fun with something you will have to fight with to work. It's such a charm to work with good tool. Lot of people say the airbrush don't make a good painter. I not fully agree. My Iwata have such a fine atomisation that it's basically fool proof (even me don't make mistake with it) It's hard to have problem when the paint flow easily at 10psi with a preset handle, while the badger needed 25psi and aztek 40 to get the paint flow. Anyway that's my point. Aztek are a ripoff.

hkshooter wrote:

I just love these Aztek vs ______ Pi$$in matches I just have to grin

Apparently, you haven't been reading this post in full.  The arguement is not about the Aztek airbrush vs some other airbrush.  The arguement is about the quality of the Aztek airbrush.

Jesse

I just love these Aztek vs ______ Pi$$in matches

I just have to grin

usmc1371 wrote:

When it says "All quick-color-change no disassembly"  I believe it means you can quickly change from one color to another with disassembling the airbrush or nozzles for cleaning.  If fact, the video that comes with A470 shows how to do just that and talks about that feature.  That statement says nothing about not disasembling it for cleaning.  I, personally, wish they would make the aztek A470 capable of being disassembled easily and that they would give instructions for disassembling the nozzles. In regards to cleaning the nozzles, the only time I have problems with paint clogging the nozzles is when I used Model Master Acryl line paints.  MikeV spoke of this in another posting.  The Acryl paints just bond too well.  Generally, when spraying Acryl paints, after I spray the Acryl Cleaning Solution through the brush I will follow up with Testors Dried Paint Solvent.  Works great, smells funny. Jesse

You may very well be correct in regards to MM. I also used the Acryl Cleaning solution as well as followed up with another Acrylic AB cleaner then flushed the whole thing out with water. Flushed it until it sprayed clean. Still clogged. As for disassembling the nozzles the instructions show a diagram of the nozzle being taken apart and has a big circle with a slash through it. I interpret that as "do not take the nozzle apart". As for the AB itself I do not see any easy way of taking the body apart. Remember I am not saying that the Aztek sucks. I just take umbrage with the fact that it is sold as an easy to maintain AB. It was the reason I chose the Aztek over other AB's. However since then the 2 Badgers I bought after the Aztek are far more easier to maintain. At least IMHO.

Oh, don't tell me your son went to San Diego for Boot Camp.  Not another Hollywood Marine.  Now, interms of being a POG - I also carried the MOS of Infantry but spent most of my time as a Combat Engineer.  And for my time as a Combat Engineer, I worked mostly with landmines, boobytraps and demolition charges.  Hardly POG stuff.  Just playing with you.  Tell your son to get on a MEU(SOC) ASAP.  It's the best training out there but of course he will be deployed for at least 6 months.  But as the old World War II poster said "Wanna Fight... Join the Marines". 

I think it's funny your son is with a Light Armor Recon unit but carries a 60lb mortar.  I was with a Light Infantry unit but heck we carried alot more than the regular infantry. 

Jesse

usmc1371 wrote:

Mike, Just curious, are you still in the Corps?  If so, what's your MOS and duty station?  I was a 1371 Combat Engineer from 1991-1999.  Spent most of my time at Camp Pendleton with a year in the 15 MEU(SOC).  Semper Fi, brother. Jesse

Jesse,

No, I was never in the military, my son is the Marine right.
So you were a POG huh?
My son joined in September of 2005 and just completed his SOI training at Pendleton.
He is stationed at Camp Pendleton and is a 0341 Morter Man with a 1st Marines LAR unit.
My dad was also a Marine in WWII and was a Crew Chief of Curtis SB2C's at El Toro until he got shipped to the south pacific.

Mike,

Just curious, are you still in the Corps?  If so, what's your MOS and duty station?  I was a 1371 Combat Engineer from 1991-1999.  Spent most of my time at Camp Pendleton with a year in the 15 MEU(SOC).  Semper Fi, brother.

Jesse

When it says "All quick-color-change no disassembly"  I believe it means you can quickly change from one color to another with disassembling the airbrush or nozzles for cleaning.  If fact, the video that comes with A470 shows how to do just that and talks about that feature.  That statement says nothing about not disasembling it for cleaning.  I, personally, wish they would make the aztek A470 capable of being disassembled easily and that they would give instructions for disassembling the nozzles.

In regards to cleaning the nozzles, the only time I have problems with paint clogging the nozzles is when I used Model Master Acryl line paints.  MikeV spoke of this in another posting.  The Acryl paints just bond too well.  Generally, when spraying Acryl paints, after I spray the Acryl Cleaning Solution through the brush I will follow up with Testors Dried Paint Solvent.  Works great, smells funny.

Jesse

usmc1371 wrote:

Apparently some people just can't read.  The Aztek airbrush is NOT marketed as a 'professional' airbrush such as one used by photo retouching specialists, airbrush artists or the like.  Look here (again): http://www.testors.com/brand_profile.asp?brandNbr=1 It is clearly marketed for the "EXPERIENCED HOBBYIST".  Also, please understand, I have never said the Aztek A470 was superior to any other airbrush mentioned so far.  But I firmly believe, for most modelers, the A470 is a exceptional airbrush able to perform all the requirements for model building.  Remember, this is a modeling forum, not a forum for T-Shirt artist or people who make paintings and the such.  I've looked at Mike's website and his work is outstanding.  If I was using my airbrush for more then making models I won't use an A470 either.  You know, use the right tool for the right job.  The point is, this is a forum about making models.  The Aztek line of airbrushes are excellent for that.  These are airbrushes designed and sold by a company who specializes in models and that is what the airbrush is marketed for.

From your link to the Testors site:

Aztek Airbrushes are the world's most advanced painting instruments. The broad range includes easy-to-use entry-level sprayers, affordable mid-level tools, and sophisticated brushes for experienced hobbyists. All quick-color-change no disassembly.

I stand by what I said earlier. Professional or Hobbyist. This brush is not as advertised. One must disassemble the nozzled to completely clean the brush or it will clog. Period.

Look. This like many arguments can go on forever with no one able to change the others opinions. Everyone's opinions are unique and for me that is what makes the world and each individual interesting. Lets all just agree to disagree, use whatever tools make us happiest, and get back to making models.

Sorry dude, gonna call BS on that one. I read the instructions as well as watched the video. I followed all instructions to the letter and ya know what? It still clogged up on me after a couple of uses. I even went extra lengths in flushing the brush out using various solutions. Still clogged. It wasn't until several folks here helped me out and suggested I disassemble the nozzles and clean them out. Which a person is told not to do by the instructions and video. I'm not gonna fight about whether the brush is crap or not. I simply do not have enough experience with AB's to make that call and I will admit that since I've started disassembling the nozzles and cleaning them I have not had as much issues. But I will state and stand by that the product is not as advertised/marketed.

The instructions do in fact tell you not to disassemble the nozzles, but yet to get the nozzles clean that is exactly what you have to do.  I've owned three of these airbrushes and have always cleaned them as thoroughly as I could, typically with the solvent necessary to clean the particular medium I was spraying (earlier it was mostly enamels, now mostly acrylics).  Yet each of my Azteks pooped out on me.  Nozzles became unusable.  I got sick of expending roughly $8-10 each on a new nozzle, and occasionally the freaking thing wouldn't spray properly thinned paint even though it would spray air.

I finally threw my hands up in frustration and acquired a Badger 360 from DixieArt () and have been using it ever since.  I've had absolutely no complaints with this airbrush, and I really like the control I have over cleaning it.  Everything can be disassembled without any instructions advising against that process, and I can visually ensure that all of the parts are clean immediately after using.

I did manage some very good paint jobs with all of my Azteks, so I have no complaints over its performance.  My primary complaints with it was the difficulty in cleaning and the expenditure of funds to replace clogged/non-functioning nozzles.

usmc1371 wrote:

Apparently some people just can't read.  The Aztek airbrush is NOT marketed as a 'professional' airbrush such as one used by photo retouching specialists, airbrush artists or the like.  Look here (again): http://www.testors.com/brand_profile.asp?brandNbr=1 It is clearly marketed for the "EXPERIENCED HOBBYIST".  Also, please understand, I have never said the Aztek A470 was superior to any other airbrush mentioned so far.  But I firmly believe, for most modelers, the A470 is a exceptional airbrush able to perform all the requirements for model building.  Remember, this is a modeling forum, not a forum for T-Shirt artist or people who make paintings and the such.  I've looked at Mike's website and his work is outstanding.  If I was using my airbrush for more then making models I won't use an A470 either.  You know, use the right tool for the right job.  The point is, this is a forum about making models.  The Aztek line of airbrushes are excellent for that.  These are airbrushes designed and sold by a company who specializes in models and that is what the airbrush is marketed for.

Thanks for the compliments Marine.
Actually there are a few artists who use Aztek airbrushes and do incredible work, so it is capable of doing anything any other airbrush can do in the proper hands. One artist that comes to mind that sometimes uses the Aztek is Paul Corfield. I have posted this picture in the past when the subject came up of this airbrush being "junk" and I think it is worth posting again.
This was painted with acrylics and an Aztek airbrush I was told.
This type of illustration involves frisket work and a lot of time consuming masking but I couldn't do it with my Sotar or a Micron if my life depended on it. It is the hand that wields the airbrush that makes the output great.

Apparently some people just can't read.  The Aztek airbrush is NOT marketed as a 'professional' airbrush such as one used by photo retouching specialists, airbrush artists or the like.  Look here (again): http://www.testors.com/brand_profile.asp?brandNbr=1

It is clearly marketed for the "EXPERIENCED HOBBYIST". 

Also, please understand, I have never said the Aztek A470 was superior to any other airbrush mentioned so far.  But I firmly believe, for most modelers, the A470 is a exceptional airbrush able to perform all the requirements for model building.  Remember, this is a modeling forum, not a forum for T-Shirt artist or people who make paintings and the such.  I've looked at Mike's website and his work is outstanding.  If I was using my airbrush for more then making models I won't use an A470 either.  You know, use the right tool for the right job. 

The point is, this is a forum about making models.  The Aztek line of airbrushes are excellent for that.  These are airbrushes designed and sold by a company who specializes in models and that is what the airbrush is marketed for.

Ahhh the perpetual Aztek discussion, alright then here's my .

I was a happy enough owner of an A470 for a couple of years and got some pretty good results out of it.  I went through a few nozzles (yes I did break them down completely for cleaning) over that time but apart from that it was OK to work with.  Unfortunately over time paint had seeped into the back of the a/b which eventually caused it to stop working.  I tried breaking down the body of the a/b to clean it but the innards were just too far gone.

I have since bought an Iwata HP-CS (from Dixie Art ) and the difference is chalk and cheese, the Iwata feels right and is a far more precision instrument than the Aztek, it easily breaks down for maintenance and is happy with lacquers, acrylics and enamels.  So do yourself a big favour and get either a Badger, Iwata or Paashe, you won't be sorry.

Happy modeling

Scott, The debate continues. Lets look at this from the other side of the fence. Find an airbrush you like then look to see if there are many complaints. If there are, move on to another model. I am not versed on the Omni so I can offer little help with that option. I don't understand why you didn't want to look at an Iwata. There are few if any complaints. They work great and are quite reliable. If I have to invest in a tool and plan on continously using it, then I want a sure thing. I had a Badger 200 for years and wore it out. Had it rebuilt and wore it out again. Like you I decided to make a change, wanted a good reliable double action. I looked around, did my research and went with an Iwata. Now I have an Iwata HP-C and a Revolution and have had NO problems. I would recommend an Iwata Eclipse CS. What ever you choose, Dixie Art Supply should be one of the sites you check out.   Greg.

MikeV wrote:

usmc1371 wrote:   Fifth, if Aztek airbrushes are such a piece of junk, why would a major model company like Testors, invest in them and still sell them.  Personally, I think alot of people who hate Aztek airbrushes are people who are too lazy to read the directions and practice on how to use it.  Enough said. Jesse   How many airbrush artists use them? I think that speaks volumes. If you like them and have good results with them then more power to you. Some of us have been airbrushing since before Azteks were even invented and that is why we see them as a gimmick.

Semper Fi fellas. I have to agree with Mike. As somebody who paints much more than just models and has had the pleasure of learning from some of the great airbrush artists in country. I have traveled thousands of miles to learn the art of airbrushing and I must say... the next time I see a famous, magazine quality pro using a azteK will be the first.
      I have said many times on this forum that its not the brush.. its the user. Practice will make you better not the tool. If the tool stinks to start with your only working against the grain.
      In my opinion the azteK is a childs toy that is marketed as proffesional tool. Frankly it simply is not.

medic5555 wrote:

All I know is that I have an Aztek and a Paasche and I can't get the Paasche to work nearly as well, way more expensive to boot. So if someone wants to trade an Aztec for a Paasche, throw a message my way, I'd sooner have something that I can use

Can't trade. Already have 2 other AB's but I would be willing to sell my 4709 set in the wooden box if your interested.

All I know is that I have an Aztek and a Paasche and I can't get the Paasche to work nearly as well, way more expensive to boot. So if someone wants to trade an Aztec for a Paasche, throw a message my way, I'd sooner have something that I can use

usmc1371 wrote:

Personally, I think alot of people who hate Aztek airbrushes are people who are too lazy to read the directions and practice on how to use it.  Enough said. Jesse

Sorry dude, gonna call BS on that one. I read the instructions as well as watched the video. I followed all instructions to the letter and ya know what? It still clogged up on me after a couple of uses. I even went extra lengths in flushing the brush out using various solutions. Still clogged.

It wasn't until several folks here helped me out and suggested I disassemble the nozzles and clean them out. Which a person is told not to do by the instructions and video. I'm not gonna fight about whether the brush is crap or not. I simply do not have enough experience with AB's to make that call and I will admit that since I've started disassembling the nozzles and cleaning them I have not had as much issues. But I will state and stand by that the product is not as advertised/marketed.