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What to use, what to use. . . ?

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  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: down South
What to use, what to use. . . ?
Posted by ga.retread on Sunday, November 9, 2003 12:13 AM
I notice in reading thru FSM (no I don't just look at the pictures) that quite a lot of you guys , and gals, use acrylics rather than enamels or other types of paint. Being a real rookie with an airbrush I was wondering which gives the best result in terms of ease of useand clean-up. Question [?]

Also, can you mix different paint types on the same model, or should you stay with one type at a time?Cool [8D]

"Always remember, your weapon was made by the lowest bidder."








"Shoot low boys, they're riding Shetland Ponies!" - Lewis Grizzard, revered Southern humorist
  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Sandusky Ohio, USA
Posted by Swanny on Sunday, November 9, 2003 10:16 AM
I use all sorts of paints. You can mix them on the model but you should follow this order to avoid trouble.
1. Any Lacquers first.
2. Now you can put down your enamels.
3. And finally apply any acrylics you want.
4. Future the painted model.
5. Decals
6. Future again
7. Weathering and washes.
8. Dullcoat.
9. Pastel chalk highlights.
  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: down South
Posted by ga.retread on Sunday, November 9, 2003 7:32 PM
Thanks for the info. I'm still re-learning the modeling game after a really long lay-off, andI'm learning to use an airbrush for the 1st time. All help and advice is greatly appreciated.
"Shoot low boys, they're riding Shetland Ponies!" - Lewis Grizzard, revered Southern humorist
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 10, 2003 5:03 PM
In terms of ease of use and clean-up acrylics are far superior to enamels. Acrylics wash up with water or alcohol. They don't create nasty fumes and can be wiped clean off the model if you make a mistake with a alcohol-soaked q-tip.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 10, 2003 5:04 PM
In terms of ease of use and clean-up acrylics are far superior to enamels. Acrylics wash up with water or alcohol. They don't create nasty fumes and can be wiped clean off the model if you make a mistake with a alcohol-soaked q-tip.Smile [:)]

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Monday, November 10, 2003 5:06 PM
Oops, don't know for sure how I did that. Sorry.Sign - With Stupid [#wstupid]
  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Sandusky Ohio, USA
Posted by Swanny on Monday, November 10, 2003 5:33 PM
Learning to airbrush? I spent my first day (oh so many years ago) with a sheet of poster board drawing circles and squiggly lines before working on some plastic.
  • Member since
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  • From: Hayward, CA
Posted by MikeV on Monday, November 10, 2003 7:44 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by nwilliams

They don't create nasty fumes and can be wiped clean off the model if you make a mistake with a alcohol-soaked q-tip.Smile [:)]


Remember though that acrylics are more dangerous to breathe than are enamels, so don't let the "nasty fumes" fool you. Wink [;)]

Mike

Wisdom is the right use of knowledge. To know is not to be wise. Many men know a great deal, and are all the greater fools for it. There is no fool so great a fool as a knowing fool. But to know how to use knowledge is to have wisdom. " Charles Spurgeon
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, November 11, 2003 6:57 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by MikeV


Remember though that acrylics are more dangerous to breathe than are enamels, so don't let the "nasty fumes" fool you. Wink [;)]

Mike


I didn't know that!.....and here I thought I was doing myself a favor by trying to convert to acrylics....Maybe I'll just go back to my trusty old nasty smellin' enamels.

Mike, you continue to be a wealth of information!
  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: Hayward, CA
Posted by MikeV on Tuesday, November 11, 2003 7:05 AM
QUOTE: Originally posted by merlin V1650

I didn't know that!.....and here I thought I was doing myself a favor by trying to convert to acrylics....Maybe I'll just go back to my trusty old nasty smellin' enamels.



Let me reiterate that none of these paints are healthy to breathe, but acrylics are plastic based and as such they can coat your lungs if you are exposed to them over the years. With the amount of paint we use for models there is probably not much chance of harm but it is always best to ventilate as much as possible with any paint mediums.

Mike

Wisdom is the right use of knowledge. To know is not to be wise. Many men know a great deal, and are all the greater fools for it. There is no fool so great a fool as a knowing fool. But to know how to use knowledge is to have wisdom. " Charles Spurgeon
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, November 11, 2003 11:46 AM
Additionally acrylics can be toxic free and odourless, a strong point for you health.
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, November 11, 2003 4:14 PM
............alllllllllllllrighty then.......................I'm so confused..........Smile [:)]
  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: Hayward, CA
Posted by MikeV on Tuesday, November 11, 2003 9:15 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by thyamis

Additionally acrylics can be toxic free and odourless, a strong point for you health.


What do you mean by toxic free? Any plastic based paint that is inhaled would not be considered toxic free.
Where is our resident chemist on this forum? Big Smile [:D]

Mike

Wisdom is the right use of knowledge. To know is not to be wise. Many men know a great deal, and are all the greater fools for it. There is no fool so great a fool as a knowing fool. But to know how to use knowledge is to have wisdom. " Charles Spurgeon
  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: The flat lands of the Southeast
Posted by styrene on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 7:02 AM
ALL materials are toxic, it just depends on the dose received.

From what I can tell, acrylics should be relatively safer than enamels, considering the kinds, types and characteristics (e.g.,volatility, concentrations, etc.) of the base solvents. Regardless of the type of paints used, precautions such as respirators, opening windows, turning on fans, and using a spray booth should be employed during painting sessions.

Based on what little I know about particle dynamics, I don't think that there should be any concern about acrylics coating the lungs over time. Solvent vapor inhalation is the primary concern, IMHO.

I think there are some "non-toxic" acrylic craft paints, but that is based upon the primary intent of use (i.e. brushing, where the primary hazard would be skin contact and ingestion--important considerations for childrens' paints). In addition, the removal of heavy metals like cadmium, chromium and lead also lend a hand toward a reduced toxicity paint, but I think any time you start spraying, you increase the risk of potential toxicity through solvent vapor inhalation by a couple orders of magnitude.

Gip Winecoff

1882: "God is dead"--F. Nietzsche

1900: "Nietzsche is dead"--God

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: Hayward, CA
Posted by MikeV on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 7:13 AM
Thanks for the answer Gip. It was you I was alluding to when I said, "resident chemist" by the way. Wink [;)]
Are you a chemist?
I will have to shoot an email off to my friend who would know the answer to this question of toxicity. He has been in the airbrush game a long time and has even helped design airbrushes such as the Vega 2000.

Mike

Wisdom is the right use of knowledge. To know is not to be wise. Many men know a great deal, and are all the greater fools for it. There is no fool so great a fool as a knowing fool. But to know how to use knowledge is to have wisdom. " Charles Spurgeon
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 11:54 AM
If it doesn't smell and make you woozy-I don't use it!!
  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: The flat lands of the Southeast
Posted by styrene on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 3:36 PM
HUH?!

Gip Winecoff

1882: "God is dead"--F. Nietzsche

1900: "Nietzsche is dead"--God

  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: Hayward, CA
Posted by MikeV on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 7:31 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by styrene

HUH?!


I guess he means he only likes solvent-based paints. Wink [;)]
One thing that is an advantage about both acrylics and Model Master paints is the extremely fast drying times. When a paint dries that fast it is not as toxic if inhaled from what I have been told, because the paint is dry and is similar to inhaling dust.

Mike

Wisdom is the right use of knowledge. To know is not to be wise. Many men know a great deal, and are all the greater fools for it. There is no fool so great a fool as a knowing fool. But to know how to use knowledge is to have wisdom. " Charles Spurgeon
  • Member since
    April 2003
  • From: Hayward, CA
Posted by MikeV on Wednesday, November 12, 2003 7:36 PM
QUOTE: Originally posted by styrene



I think there are some "non-toxic" acrylic craft paints, but that is based upon the primary intent of use (i.e. brushing, where the primary hazard would be skin contact and ingestion--important considerations for childrens' paints). In addition, the removal of heavy metals like cadmium, chromium and lead also lend a hand toward a reduced toxicity paint, but I think any time you start spraying, you increase the risk of potential toxicity through solvent vapor inhalation by a couple orders of magnitude.


The paints that are really bad are urethane toners like they use to airbrush automotive murals, etc. These paints are Isocyanates and not only enter the body through the lungs and skin, but also through the eyes! [:0]
That is why they use fresh air helmets and full-body suits in the paint booths for these.
At least we don't use them for modelling, or at least most of us don't. Wink [;)]

Mike

Wisdom is the right use of knowledge. To know is not to be wise. Many men know a great deal, and are all the greater fools for it. There is no fool so great a fool as a knowing fool. But to know how to use knowledge is to have wisdom. " Charles Spurgeon
  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: The flat lands of the Southeast
Posted by styrene on Thursday, November 13, 2003 6:06 AM
The reason full body suits and airline respirators are worn when working with paints containing isocyanate monomers is the fact that these paints are sensitizers. Once sensitized to the product, the next exposure can produce a severe sensitization reaction in the body similar to the symptoms associated with asthma. Skin and eye contact, as well as inhalation, can trigger a response to the product. Over the years, manufacturers have made improvements in their polyurethanes by reducing the amount of free airborne isocyanate monomer, but the overall sensitization hazard still remains and warrants continued protection, including medical monitoring.
Gip Winecoff

1882: "God is dead"--F. Nietzsche

1900: "Nietzsche is dead"--God

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Central USA
Posted by qmiester on Thursday, November 13, 2003 8:13 PM
When I'm airbrushing anything, I use a paint booth and a resperator - no matter what I'm shooting - If I'm mixing or brushing paint I do it in the paint booth - To you young guys, you need to take precautions now so you won't pay later - I know, after 30 years of working around operating aircraft engines (especially radials) without any kind of protection (thats how it was done in those days) my high frequency hearing is nearly gone and my right ear rings all the time,
Quincy
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