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How do you rebuild a city?

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  • Member since
    July 2008
  • From: Vancouver, the "wet coast"
How do you rebuild a city?
Posted by castelnuovo on Sunday, May 22, 2022 11:18 PM

Without going into politics, how do you rebuild an entire city, town or village? So Mariupol has been destroyed. Other cities have been leveled in WW2 like Dresden, Hiroshima, Stalingrad etc. Where do you start? What are the logistics? How do you rebuild historic buildings? Do you tear everything down and start from zero?

So you are an architect or a civil engineer and you are sent to a destroyed city of, say, 150000 people. Now what? What do you do first? Second? Third...

  • Member since
    March 2007
  • From: Northeast WA State
Posted by armornut on Sunday, May 22, 2022 11:52 PM

  I suppose an inventory of salvageable material and equipment would be the first place to start. After that large scale " safing" of unstable infrastructure,  then calling on engineers and contractors to start the heavy lifting. Time, perseverance,  and patients. Hope has to be in there too.

we're modelers it's what we do

  • Member since
    May 2011
  • From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Posted by Real G on Monday, May 23, 2022 12:59 AM

The one silver lining is that infrastructure will be improved.  Old factories will be replaced with new.  Same with housing, transportation, etc. Their government will need to skillfully juggle tasks and manage resources to ensure their ecomomy grows as they rebuild.

The cost will be staggering though.  I am not sure what Ukraine's economy was like pre-invasion, but I am hopeful they will rise to the task of making their cities new.

“Ya ya ya, unicorn papoi!”

  • Member since
    July 2008
  • From: Vancouver, the "wet coast"
Posted by castelnuovo on Monday, May 23, 2022 1:24 AM

Real G

The one silver lining is that infrastructure will be improved.  Old factories will be replaced with new.  Same with housing, transportation, etc. Their government will need to skillfully juggle tasks and manage resources to ensure their ecomomy grows as they rebuild.

The cost will be staggering though.  I am not sure what Ukraine's economy was like pre-invasion, but I am hopeful they will rise to the task of making their cities new.

 

 

This is a good question. Really, what was there? Agriculture was huge and I think coal, but what else?

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Monday, May 23, 2022 5:42 AM

I have often thought of the same thing but it has been done before and these cities were probably demolished worse.Berlin,Warsaw,,Budapest,Koningsberg,Dresden,Breslau,Hiroshima,Nagaski,Stalingrad,Leningrad,Often see films of bucket brigades cleaning up,but it had to take more then that.

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Monday, May 23, 2022 12:12 PM

I suppose that Germany is a great example of how to rebuild. Of course one huge factor was financing the rebuild. Somebody has to pay for all of the labor and materials. The age of the pharaohs and slave labor for construction is long gone. The financing came courtesy of the Marshall plan and the USA. Materials and labor are usually sourced locally. The local population has to go back to work. Some stuff can be rebuilt fairly quickly. I saw that firsthand in various towns and cities in Bosnia. Of course before any construction or demolition of destroyed structures and infrastructure can begin, the whole area has to be swept and cleared of unexplored ordnance. Depending upon multiple factors, that can be a very time consuming process. WWII aerial bombs are still being found in Germany today. WWI UXO still turns up on occasion in the former battlefields of France and Belgium. Some things will take decades to rebuild or restore. I remember visiting St Michael's cathedral in Munich in 1984, and it was still undergoing restoration to pre war condition at that time, nearly 40 years after the fact. When I returned again in 2005, it was finally restored to its' original glory. 

So what will it take? Time, effort, financing, and determination. Of course that can't even truly begin until the guns are silent.

 

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Monday, May 23, 2022 4:32 PM

The assisting parties do whats called a SAR, or Stabilitzation Assistance Review.

There needs to be a legitimate, forward looking and local authority or network of same.

Otherwise it's all just money down a hole.

The civil engineering and architecture are the easy part.

 

Bill

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Boston
Posted by mach71 on Monday, May 23, 2022 6:10 PM

When I was base at Zweibrucken AB in Germany in the mid '80s the whole town was just bulldozed flat after WW2. The locan Wienerwald restaurant was the only building I knew of that was "original". We went down 3 feet of steps to get to entrance. Local lore was the level of the town was raised 3 feet as the town rebuilt on top of the rubble.

Thats an overly simplistic explanation, but I believe it.

 

Money and hardwork will rebuild Mariupol if and when the russians are removed. Unless local coruption takes over, then its money down a rat hole.

  • Member since
    August 2019
  • From: Central Oregon
Posted by HooYah Deep Sea on Monday, May 23, 2022 7:20 PM

As with the UXO, the area must be scoured for hazardous chemical residue. There are areas of France that are still undevelopable as the levels of mustard gas contamination are still too high. We all know that the Rooskies have no compunction to using 'unapproved' munitions, they've done it for years.

"Why do I do this? Because the money's good, the scenery changes and they let me use explosives, okay?"

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Monday, May 23, 2022 7:51 PM

mach71
 

Money and hardwork will rebuild Mariupol if and when the russians are removed. Unless local coruption takes over, then its money down a rat hole.

 

Yes... and if the Russians are not removed, I dont forsee the G7, EU, or US financing a rebuild of Mariupol or any other occupied areas. Nor should they. After all the money that was wasted due to corruption on civil projects in Iraq and Afghanistan, Congess is likely gonna be real questioning on bankrolling projects in Ukraine.
Now China on the other hand may step in with one of their "belt and road" financing...

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    March 2022
  • From: Twin cities, MN
Posted by missileman2000 on Tuesday, May 24, 2022 8:42 AM

stikpusher

I suppose that Germany is a great example of how to rebuild. Of course one huge factor was financing the rebuild. Somebody has to pay for all of the labor and materials. The age of the pharaohs and slave labor for construction is long gone. The financing came courtesy of the Marshall plan and the USA. Materials and labor are usually sourced locally. The local population has to go back to work. Some stuff can be rebuilt fairly quickly. I saw that firsthand in various towns and cities in Bosnia. Of course before any construction or demolition of destroyed structures and infrastructure can begin, the whole area has to be swept and cleared of unexplored ordnance. Depending upon multiple factors, that can be a very time consuming process. WWII aerial bombs are still being found in Germany today. WWI UXO still turns up on occasion in the former battlefields of France and Belgium. Some things will take decades to rebuild or restore. I remember visiting St Michael's cathedral in Munich in 1984, and it was still undergoing restoration to pre war condition at that time, nearly 40 years after the fact. When I returned again in 2005, it was finally restored to its' original glory. 

So what will it take? Time, effort, financing, and determination. Of course that can't even truly begin until the guns are silent.

 

 

I was thinking the same thing.  In my opinion the Marshall plan was one of the most successful operations of WW2.

 

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