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Kiowa Warriors... not Apaches?

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  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Aaaaah.... Alpha Apaches... A beautiful thing!
Kiowa Warriors... not Apaches?
Posted by Cobrahistorian on Thursday, July 24, 2003 1:06 AM
Anyone find it interesting that the Apaches were held in reserve while Kiowa Warriors fired Hellfires at Saddam's bad little boys? My only thought for this is that the Apache elements of the 101st Aviation Regiment have been so overly used within the past two years that they simply said "let someone else do it". Can't really blame em either. Afghanistan and then Iraq, those men and women have more than earned a well deserved rest!

Still, I would love to see the markings and tail numbers for the OH-58D's that participated. Should be interesting to see if they get any publicity!

"1-6 is in hot"
  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Piedmont Triad, NC (USA)
Posted by oldhooker on Thursday, July 24, 2003 11:52 PM
Interesting observation, Jon.

My thoughts were, the Army wanted to test the Warriors abilities as a stand alone gun platform, and did so in the crucible of the Iraqi desert.

We always used the Scout/Gunship teams, and woe be unto anyone who fires on the Scout! Sometimes the Scout took a couple hits, then 5 minutes later there's nothing left standing in the area the fire came from.... I've always invisioned some NVA 1st Sgt down in the tunnels, smacking this grunt in the head for shooting!!

The aircrews were stretched pretty thin, most flying quite long sorties early on, my hats off to ALL of them!

"Ramp up, good in the rear, Sir"

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Aaaaah.... Alpha Apaches... A beautiful thing!
Posted by Cobrahistorian on Friday, July 25, 2003 12:29 AM
Oldhooker,

Well, initially I wrote an entire essay about hunter-killer teams being a thing of the past, etc. That's what I get for misreading your post! LOL

So, yes, I could definitely see the Army wanting to test the Kiowa as a stand-alone gun platform in a real-world situation. The amount of National Guard units using the OH-58D have grown significantly over the past few years since the Cobra was retired. The Kiowa is smaller, lighter and much more easily transportable. That's why the 82nd Airborne's 82nd Aviation Regiment uses them instead of Apaches... deployability.

Still, if you want, need or just gotta have somethin killed... go with the Apache!
"1-6 is in hot"
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, July 26, 2003 7:41 PM
I thought the Mississippi Guard was the only user of the -58D?
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, July 26, 2003 8:13 PM
what it was is that some big army officer in charge is a modeler and had just bought the MRC kiowa. all he wanted was some action shots of them??????
or maybe there trying everything out
maybe next week there use mustangs from the AAF musium
  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Aaaaah.... Alpha Apaches... A beautiful thing!
Posted by Cobrahistorian on Saturday, July 26, 2003 8:21 PM
According to the current US Army ORBAT, there are 39 units between the active, reserve and guard components now operating the OH-58. Of that, 18 units operate the OH-58A+/C (these are mainly Guard units). The active Army is all OH-58D.
This information is available in the March 2003 issue of "Combat Aircraft" magazine. Those earlier A and C models will be modernized to the D standard over the next few years. I was just at the Bell plant last week and saw about a dozen being converted. Neat little airplane.

"1-6 is in hot"
  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: Piedmont Triad, NC (USA)
Posted by oldhooker on Monday, July 28, 2003 12:57 AM
The last time I was by Simmons AAF at Bragg, there were D Models operating and parked on the ramp. Don't know what unit they were associated with, but they were definately present.

I was stationed there between 78-81, and the 82nd Aviation Battalion and 1/17th Cav flew guns, then, but don't know the unit structure now.

Remember seeing the first "S" Model Cobra I'd ever seen, sitting under a shelter at Guthrie Stagefield at Rucker in late August 1978... considering it now, that was probably the prototype as "flat window panels" hadn't been seen up to that point. Remember the first Black Hawk landing at the Airfield, attracted about 80% of the personnel within the perimeter, but had already got out before the AH-64's showed up.

I built models that "Al" would hang in "The Hobbit" hobby shop over on Yadkin Road in Fayetteville... Al's still there and always glad to see you! (sorry, couldn't mention Ft. Bragg without mentioning The Hobbit.

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Aaaaah.... Alpha Apaches... A beautiful thing!
Posted by Cobrahistorian on Monday, July 28, 2003 1:24 AM
Oldhooker,

Yup, both the 82nd Avn and 1/17th Cav are flying Kiowa Warriors now. Must have been something being at Rucker when the first Blackhawks came in!

I never did like the S (redesignated F) model Cobras. That flat plate canopy took all the sexiness out of the bird! Sure, it may have reduced radar reflectivity, but with that big fan going over your head, your RCS is about as big as ya can get!

The Apache on the other hand... just looks menacing. Gotta love that!

"1-6 is in hot"
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