Are dios a dying art?

I don't think they are, especially when you see the work that people post here and elsewhere in the Internet.  But I think the percentage of modelers who build a diorama, out of all modelers, is probably about the same as it ever was.

We probably need to define the terms, too.  Do you include someone who makes a tarmac display base, without adding any figures, or any hardware?  Or is it a spectrum, from that tarmac runway base, or an ocean base for a ship, all the way up to the Normandy dio going on elsewhere in this thread?

Also, as a toy soldier collector, I can say that there is a healthy group of guys who collect finished figures, like King & Country, or Frontline, and build scenes to display them, that would fall somewhere on that spectrum of complexity and effort required.  But their displays are often temporary, intended for a display just long enough to take pictures and post them, or until the collector chooses another subject.  Some guys make diodramas, a running story using their dioramas, but changing the scene for each new part of the story.

Examples can be found at this site:  http://www.treefrogtreasures.com/forum/

Regards,

Brad

I describe a diorama as follows:

"Any scene executed in three dimensions, enclosed in a shadow box or not, that depicts a vehicle(s), ship(s), aircraft, figure()s, structure(s), or other such object(s) or a combination of such in a realistic setting that shows the object(s) in context as to its intended purpose or function, and also includes a storyline or lines, with or without action." 

How's that for one?

It's not meant to be all encompassing, there are exceptions to every rule, and in no way reflects or dimisses other viewpoints, and are completely my own rules and guidelines...

There are certain exceptions to some that could be argued as displays vs. dioramas, some grey areas, as it were where the lines get fuzzy... But overall, a diorama requires an apparent storyline with some kind of interaction going on between the subject and the rest of the objects on the base... A display is a model on a plain or landscaped base that shows only what the real thing looked like... I'll say again, these are my views, and not meant to be any sort of "commandent"...

Now I know this could quickly turn into a p*ssin' contest (like another thread in here did not too long ago), but let's not argue the fine points... Suffice to say that if you don't know if your project is a diorama or a display, it's probably NOT a diorama...

Fair enough?

Hans von Hammer wrote:

I describe a diorama as follows: "Any scene executed in three dimensions, enclosed in a shadow box or not, that depicts a vehicle(s), ship(s), aircraft, figure()s, structure(s), or other such object(s) or a combination of such in a realistic setting that shows the object(s) in context as to its intended purpose or function, and also includes a storyline or lines, with or without action."  How's that for one?

 That is a good start HVH. I would be a bit broader in my defnition and say that a diorama is a three-dimensional representation of a scene or view.

Hans von Hammer wrote:

I describe a diorama as follows: "Any scene executed in three dimensions, enclosed in a shadow box or not, that depicts a vehicle(s), ship(s), aircraft, figure()s, structure(s), or other such object(s) or a combination of such in a realistic setting that shows the object(s) in context as to its intended purpose or function, and also includes a storyline or lines, with or without action."  How's that for one? It's not meant to be all encompassing, there are exceptions to every rule, and in no way reflects or dimisses other viewpoints, and are completely my own rules and guidelines... There are certain exceptions to some that could be argued as displays vs. dioramas, some grey areas, as it were where the lines get fuzzy... But overall, a diorama requires an apparent storyline with some kind of interaction going on between the subject and the rest of the objects on the base... A display is a model on a plain or landscaped base that shows only what the real thing looked like... I'll say again, these are my views, and not meant to be any sort of "commandent"...

Agreed, and so, I stand by my opinion from before, I don't think they're dying out.

Viva la diorama!

By definition, a diorama tells a story, doesn't it?  Bad dioramas don't tell one very well, but they still tell one.  Compare a diorama to a photograph.  Even a shot of an empty lot, describes an empty lot.

Regards,

Brad

the Baron wrote:

Even a shot of an empty lot, describes an empty lot.

If you made a model of that empty lot with exacting attention to detail, what would you call it? Does it have a narrative?

All I know was I started this hobby after seeing dioramas.

David

If you made a model of that empty lot with exacting attention to detail, what would you call it?

A model... Until someone places an abandoned car there, then it becomes groundwork & scenery...

For the lot to be the subject of a diorama, it would need to be placed in context, otherwise it's scenery/terrain., IMHO...

Seems like you're just wanting to splt hairs, VB.. Got some kinda chick & egg thing goin' on...

You trying to resurrect that p*ssin' contest that your airliner window/tarmac scene turned into last Summer?

At any rate, a good diorama has a story it's tryin' to tell.  The subject of the dio and what's going on should be apparent to the viewer immediately.  Failing these two things, it may still be a diorama, but it's not an effective diorama...  You model unique subjects, VB and do them well...  But your work falls outside the general consensus and into a genre of it's own, as I see it...

Let's not go off splitting hairs though, on what constitutes a diorama in here.. It's another discussion entirely and rates a thread of its own.....

HVH, I'm not trying to win any contests here at all. I don't want to get into any kind of p'ing match, it doesn't achieve anything, and I actually regret having done so before. I appreciate yours and Baron's very clear answers to my questions, thank you.

I think its just a 3 dimensional snapshot of a scene. Whether it tells a story or not has no relavence of whether or not its a diorama. Now only the viewer can determine if its good or not if it happens to appeal to their individual aesthetic. There are socially or group accepted "themes" i.e. does it tell a story? Does it make the viewer make up his own story? Is it a recording of a moment in time? By no means is their a set definition of a diorama outside of what in the relavence of this discussion would be from an IPMS definition of what a diorama is. Vespa Boys "scenes" in themselves can be considered diorama as they are comprised of elements that themselves are the subject of the scene. Manhole covers, rocks, painted lines, curbs etc are rendered three dimensionaly (in the case of the painted lines they are painted over ground effects or materials and making them integral to the scene itself.)

Diorama are no where near dying. In this genre or others. Architectural firms, engineering firms, logistical firms (I built a model of the Titan IV Launch Vehicle assembly building and maquettes of equipment so that we could figure out ways to move large test equipment and launch vehicles more efficiently. That could be considered a diorama), theatre companies (stage shows) use them all the time to work out stage changes and prop movement. Museums, tradeshows, marketing agencies, film companies, educational institutions, etc all incorporate dioramas into their everyday workings.

I guess if you look at it in a simpler aspect, kids playing with their toys in the dirt, little girls playing with their doll houses, nativity scenes, the arrangement of ones toys in the room or even the decoration of that room, mobiles placed over the crib, all have given us exposure and experience with dioramas from our earliest memories. Its only natural that we now, as model builders, use that early learned experience as a creative outlet and a means to display our handy work, So actually we are, or at least should be, predisposed to think of dioramas as only natural. Thus the dying part comes from those that "don't want to" rather than any form of "can't".

Now if we are talking the original 19th c. dioramas....then yes, they are dying if not already dead. Originally they were cleverly lit paintings on canvas and linen that would move or the stage would move to give the viewers a sense of moving through scenes or time. Season changes, fantastic worlds, landscapes, recreated battles or mythological plays were all the subjects of these dioramas cleverly lit and allowing the viewer to pass through or view the change and be left with a sense of being there. Sort of like a more modern stage scrim or prosceneum that if lit from one side looks solid and when lit from behind can reveal what is behind it and change the scene all together. Louis Daguerre was the best known and considered the inventor of these dioramas and was the inventor of his name sake the Daguerretype (early photography).

Lufttiger wrote:

Thats all i do is dio's, models just don't look right to me just sitting there, they need to be in their natural setting to make'em look real to me.

I'm the same way! However... I'm only halfway through my first dio WIP

And really... I've only ever fully completed... one armor model? And that was a while ago... I move at a glacier pase. But I'm a firm believer in fully scratch build bases/buildings/brickwork- all that stuff, but when combined with my pase... my class load... and the scale at which this one particular WIP is (way too big to be taken seriously, because it's my first one, I just wanted to throw a lot into it so I could practice everything at once... lots of scratch figures, urban/rual setting with a water feacher... two vehicles... too crazy)

I just work for my own enjoyment. I've noticed that the dio forums move slower than the armor, that's for sure, but I also post in figures and autos quite frequently, and the dio forum at least feels more active? Not really sure though. It'd be a shame if it was a dying art, but I'm going to stick with my love for it regardless

I disagree with Vespa and agree w/ HvH and others, that a diorama should tell a story, and that story should be clearly discernable without more explaination than a title.  The story can be simple, open to interpretation.  However, I also think that a diorama can be defined more simply: " 3-D scale model elements that interact to tell a story." 

Check out my diorama web pages:  www.geocities.com/dioramas48/

and www.geocities.com/stevescalemodels/Diorama-1-48.htm

These pages show my older dioramas that I now know were way too ambitious.  On a lot of them, I put too much stuff and cluttered it up. Also I skimped on the groundwork and other details.

Here's one other useful site: www.geocities.com/quarterscalemodeler/index.htm

It has all kinds of information about 1/48 scale vehicles, figures and accessories for dioramas.

I am now being more careful about that, as seen in my more recent dioramas. Here are a couple. I think they're are pretty good! Now I am opening myself up to constructive criticism: Let 'er rip!

1. The Eyes of the Russian Front:

2.  Remote revetment (more of a display than a diorama)

3. www.geocities.com/horsadio

Steve

It was interesting to read all the comments.

I don't think dios are dying. I think we don't see a lot of them because people are scared of the work involved and also because of the storage problem. I have friends that have made 100 cars so far. Imagine the storage problem if all of them were set in a diorama!!

I usually build Sci-Fi models and it is very difficult to imagine an interesting dio with a flying spaceship in it. I built my first dio 2 years ago, and now I am addicted. My goal is to build at least one per year. I just finished my third one and I am now in search mode for the subject of my next diorama.

I build the occasional car as well... I just checked with a few I have in the junkyard, and I can fir 4 into an 11 x 14 space with room to spare... Then, an idea sprang into mind... I build a used car lot!

As for space dios, shadow boxes are the way to go so you can suspend them in "space"... I've also built a couple of "Hangar Bays" for fighters from Battlestar Galactica and Star Wars...  Doing Sci-fi fighters and such is no different than doing an aircraft dio, except you get to do a LOT more fun stuff with fiber optics and LEDs..

Good afternoon all,

To me, a self-standing model is just the beginning of a well-visualized story.  It is much more interesting to me, personally, to marvel at the craftsmanship of the entire scene.  I have learned so much in here about the little nuances of making that happen. 

I agree that there are so many pre-fabricated dio accessories, bases, etc. to choose from. but the real challenge and the fun is in creating these items from scratch.  Sometimes I feel like a weirdo when I get lost in a Michael's craft store or some such place for much more time than I need to, examining various pieces of wood, plastic, decorative florals and thinking of the possibilities.  Every time I open a package, I am drawn to the vacuum-shape of the protective plastic/styrofoam.  How can this be used or re-shaped? 

I am much more fascinated by the scratchbuilding processes and creative thinking seen by modelers here.  Sure, pre-fab items have their place for some.  For me though, the artistic value is in the re-creation.  Guys, keep up the superb work.  I always look forward to seeing those pics...