Someone Must Build This P-40E in Crazy Markings!

ya,, me to.. think I'll give it a shot.. humm... now.. to the stash... !! 

Wow, what an offer!  I don't think that I could do the paint job though

I will just have to sit back and see what y'all come up with.

ya,, me to.. think I'll give it a shot.. humm... now.. to the stash... !! 

Well, seeing this thread come alive again make me dig out my old Arii boxing of the P-40E. Now that I've finished my other builds, I may have to give this a try. That's sure an interesting scheme to replicate.

O.K., I think I understand it enough to get my hed out of the box for now....

Any approaching aircraft that did not had the id of the day was fired upon immediately as it approached, even if it was an Allied aircraft, such as a B-17 or B-24.

Yeah, also one of the reasons that those super-bright recognition lights were in the tail... And it especially went for the escorts as they joined up...  Dad told me that the First Rule of Escort was, "Don't point your stupid nose at the bombers...".  You just flat did NOT chase an enemy fighter through the bomber box... Especially if you were in a Mustang, lol...  Heh, reminds me... He told me about some P-38 pilots that weren't all that good at telling 109s apart from P-51s either...    He always got a little "nervous in the service"  whenever they were supposed to link up with P-38s...

Hans von Hammer

Railfan 233:

Alright, it makes sence now. The Germans would use captured B-17s to get an accurate reading on speed and heading, since the Americans were using the same aircraft, to get AA fire even more accurate.

 

 

Actually, it's a little more than that... Using the captured Forts allowed the German aircrews an extra measure of passive defense in that, even if they were marked with German insignia (as most were), the shape of the aircraft was easily recognizable as a "Friendly" to both the American bomber crews and any escorting fighters and allowed them a longer time to "shadow" the formation than say, an FW-200 would... 

You, as a aerial gunner or fighter pilot,  can spot and ID a hostile from a far greater distance by its shape before you ever see what markings it has...  

That is why the 8th AF adopted special colors and markings, and flares of the day for that specific mission.  Any approaching aircraft that did not had the id of the day was fired upon immediately as it approached, even if it was an Allied aircraft, such as a B-17 or B-24.

Railfan 233

Huh, the Germans captured B-17s too? B really need to hit the history books hard, if I missed stuff like that

And don't forget the Soviets... there were several incidents in which B-17s and later B-29s were forced to land at Soviet airfields.  The aircrews often had a heck of a time getting back, and the aircraft were kept by the Soviets for much the same reason the Germans and Japanese did (to evaluate and copy).

Railfan 233

Alright, it makes sence now. The Germans would use captured B-17s to get an accurate reading on speed and heading, since the Americans were using the same aircraft, to get AA fire even more accurate.

 

Actually, it's a little more than that... Using the captured Forts allowed the German aircrews an extra measure of passive defense in that, even if they were marked with German insignia (as most were), the shape of the aircraft was easily recognizable as a "Friendly" to both the American bomber crews and any escorting fighters and allowed them a longer time to "shadow" the formation than say, an FW-200 would... 

You, as a aerial gunner or fighter pilot,  can spot and ID a hostile from a far greater distance by its shape before you ever see what markings it has...  

Alright, it makes sence now. The Germans would use captured B-17s to get an accurate reading on speed and heading, since the Americans were using the same aircraft, to get AA fire even more accurate.

Hearing about the B-17s in Japanese service is a first for me.

You forgot that some were used by KG 200 to drop German agents around Europe and the Middle East.  For the Japanese B-17's, Aviation History magazine has a nice article on them for this month.

Yes they repaired a few that had been damaged and force landed in good condition. Some were used to help develop tactics for defending Luftwaffe fighters. Others were used to shadow incoming bombing raids broadcasting accurate heading and altitude to German defenses then breaking away. Shortly after accurate flak would would hit the incoming US bomber stream.

Huh, the Germans captured B-17s too? B really need to hit the history books hard, if I missed stuff like that

Check out this 1/72 decal sheet I found...

http://www.risingdecals.com/ZOO/K_ZOO_A.htm

The types that Japan captured would not have been of much use in 1945. The B-17 could not have been used against the B-29s in the same manner as the Germans used captured B-17s against the 8th Air Force. And as for any fighters.. against the latest Mustangs, Hellcats, Corsairs, and Thunderbolts being flown against the home islands they would have not had a chance. Even a superb pilot such as Saburo Sakai would have been hard pressed to simply survive.

Very interesting, Stik.

Well, I know more about WWII than I did a few days ago. Interesting, how the Japanese captured some American aircraft, and didn't use them for defence of the Japanese mainland.

Well considering they overran a huge swath of South East Asia, the South West Pacific, with lots and lots of Allied airfields with unserviceable or derelict aircraft, and more than likely enough aircraft parts to cobble together more than a few flying examples.... B-17, P40, P-36, Hurricane, Buffalo...

Take a look at this link for more information

http://www.j-aircraft.com/captured/capturedby/b-17/captured_b17.htm

richs26

The Japanese captured quite a few P-40's.  They captured some very wornout B/C's and E's in the Philippines.  I have read a story from Air Classics from the late '80's or early '90's about 4 US pilots ferrying 4 wornout P-40's around the Philippines to Clark were they were patched up by the Japanese, and evaluated.  The Japanese collected many brand new E's in crates on the docks in Java, that they were even considering using them for home land defense purposes but abandoned the idea.  Use Google Images, as there is a color picture of an abandoned E sitting on a Japanese home airfield taken after the Americans had moved in.  There is an SBD, I think, next to it with it's distinctive tail. I believe that this colored E was one of three on a freighter that ran the naval blockade of the PI, and were assembled in March, 1942 at Del Monte, Mindanao.  They were used until the US quit using Del Monte as a staging base from Australia.   As an aside, the Japanese captured 1 B-17D in the PI, and 2 B-17E's from Java, and flew them in Japan evaluating them.  In 1945, US intelligence noted from recon photos what looked like a new 4-engined bomber for the Japanese.  They scaled out the wingspan to be 104 ft, which is that of the B-17.  They never thought that they were captured B-17's at the time. 

I never knew that about the Japanese capturing any of our aircraft. This is all new to me, with this info.

By any chance, does any one know the fate of the P-40 this thred was about?

I'm stealing this subject for our club's theme build next month:  "Horse of a Different Color".  One of the interpretations of the theme is a subject in livery other than its home country's colors.  And I have a stash of 1/72 P-40 kits, it'll be good to put one of them together.

Hey I forgot about this post.

~Hans~ Can't wait to see more pictures.

Grab a mailing tube, Ron... I'm firing this one back up...

Hey, guys!

I'm the fellow who began this thread some time ago.  Yes, I'll still send a print of my P-40 piece, 19 x 13 inches - signed and numbered - to everyone who builds this bird!  

- Ron Cole

http://www.ColesAircraft.com

The Japanese captured quite a few P-40's.  They captured some very wornout B/C's and E's in the Philippines.  I have read a story from Air Classics from the late '80's or early '90's about 4 US pilots ferrying 4 wornout P-40's around the Philippines to Clark were they were patched up by the Japanese, and evaluated.  The Japanese collected many brand new E's in crates on the docks in Java, that they were even considering using them for home land defense purposes but abandoned the idea.  Use Google Images, as there is a color picture of an abandoned E sitting on a Japanese home airfield taken after the Americans had moved in.  There is an SBD, I think, next to it with it's distinctive tail. I believe that this colored E was one of three on a freighter that ran the naval blockade of the PI, and were assembled in March, 1942 at Del Monte, Mindanao.  They were used until the US quit using Del Monte as a staging base from Australia.   As an aside, the Japanese captured 1 B-17D in the PI, and 2 B-17E's from Java, and flew them in Japan evaluating them.  In 1945, US intelligence noted from recon photos what looked like a new 4-engined bomber for the Japanese.  They scaled out the wingspan to be 104 ft, which is that of the B-17.  They never thought that they were captured B-17's at the time. 

Interesting. I've never seen a P-40 like that.

I also never knew that P-40's were captured by the Japanese.

Was this bird ever shot down or distroied, or did it survive the war intact?

Yeah, I'm still pluggin' away at it, but it's not on the front burner by any means...

Hey Ron

What a great paint scheme and a great motivation for a build.  It looks like Hans has the best chance of bringing this one home, but if you have any other cool schemes you want to see put to plastic, I hope you won't hesitate to post a similar offer in the future!

Neet thread !! any new updates from anyone??

does the offer still stand at this Date ? Hummm...

I believe that this aircraft probably came from a New Guinea P-40 squadron as the markings don't fit the timeline for the Philippines.  Aircraft staged to Mindanao from Australia for attacks on Luzon until about mid-April 1942.  Gen. Wainwright surrendered the Philippines on May 6.  Note the one photo showing the US markings.  The white star has the red center painted out but it faintly shows through.  The AAF directed that the red center be removed on May 12.  The Navy followed suit on May 15.  It was done very quickly as evidenced by photos of the Battle of Midway show.  So this P-40 was captured after May 12, 1942.

I've actually painted the nose about half a dozen times with oils & a brush, Yellow Ochre being the base color with a mix of that and Burnt Umber for the feathery parts...  The long looonnnggg drying time of the oils (coupled with repated dissatisfaction of results) is what took me so long to get to this point...    The topside is painted in Tamiya Japanese Army Green (I used the panting for color refs) and the bottom is Testor's MM Camouflage Grey. 

I'm not really happy with the shark-mouth decal, but it's the one I had closest to the shape depicted, although I'll have to remove the blue area from between the "teeth" (either by painting over with red or cutting it out) and hand-paint the "eyes"...  The hinomarus are from an old Arii decal sheet that I've had since the early 90s.  The sheet hadn't been stored properly, being left in a desk drawer that was in a humid basement for years.  The paper had curled into a U-shape and had this "crystalized" look around the decals, but luckily I was able to save them by spraying them with Testor's Decal Bonder (I love that stuff!).  It's saved many an old decal sheet for me and works (IMHO) much better than just spraying a clear gloss over them to keep them from slivering and breaking into a bazillion pieces...

Anyway, that's the story so far and I'll be working on it more during the upcoming week..