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Variable Geometry: the Swing Wing GB

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  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Thursday, August 5, 2010 4:24 PM

I did a little research on the early style Lancer and discovered that the vortex generators were in different positions.  Plus the early Bones had 9 generators not 11 like the modern Bones.  So.....I moved them around a little bit.  I took Pordoi's advice and used the instructions to the Eduard photoetch set as a guide.  This is what I was able to come up with.

 

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The more I look at them they seem a little thick.  I used .020 Evergreen.  I was thinking about replacing them with .010.   What do y'all think?  Should I replace them?

Hey Don, when you go to attach the main gear bay and the bombays to the lower fuselage don't use superglue like I did.  I figured it would hold strong but it didn't because I had to really manipulate the plastic to try and get the bays into position using the locater tabs provided.  I was tempted to just remove one side of the tabs to make it easier.  They kept snapping off.  I ended up using some ProWeld and it solved that issue.  Just an FYI.

Kevin

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  • Member since
    October 2008
Posted by eatthis on Thursday, August 5, 2010 4:44 PM

STFD637

Eatthis: I think you nailed the color on the Cat! I grew up around Navy planes on Pt. Mugu. I don't think I saw 1 Tomcat that actually matched another when it came to the color. They were similar but each faded and weathered at different rates. I noticed that once all the planes went to the "Low-Vis" the paint would vary alot. Keep up the good work. I look forward to seeing more.

Travis

 

so basically if it looks right it probably is right? thats good enough for me lol

 

snow + 4wd + escessive hp = :)  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7egUIS70YM

  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Thursday, August 5, 2010 7:29 PM

Hey all,

 

I've been struggling with a cranky DSL modem and haven't been able to keep current.  Thanks for keeping the GB lively in my short absence.

 

eatthis:  the F-14 looks fine to me; a nice weathered gray.  Keep on going; you're off to a great start and may be the first to claim the F-14 badge who actually built an F-14.

 

oddmanrush:  Well, now that Bish has shown you the secret handshake, you're part of our crew.  I would have shown it to you personally, but then I would have had to kill you... Big Smile  Top secret, you know...  Zip it! but you catch on quickly.. mums the word.

 

macattack:  Looks like you and I are tacking the same components of the B1.  Nice painting of the SRAMs, although I wonder why the fins were painted orange.  Can't see any purpose and its not like someone on the receiving end would notice or care...  The 0,020 card looks fine for the vortex generators from your photos but I'm sure that the 0.010 would be fine also.  Whether it's accurate???  The 0.02 in 1/50 scale (well almost) would be 1" on the 1:1 aircraft.  From my photos, that may be a bit generous but certainly not something that warrants a re-do.  Your call.

 

And thanks for the advice on mounting the bays.  I've made some progress there as well.

 

I've gotten the rear landing gear bay and aft bomb bay assembled and glued into the fuselage.  The landing bay required some sanding of the support posts in the fuselage to fit but overall it was a relatively minor issue.  The aft gear bay fit with some small seams that were filled with thick CA. I then painted all of the joints black to highlight any areas that still needed work.  From the inside, here's what it looks like:

 

 

 

The fit of the bays was impressive; I guess that I was expecting to deal with gaps betwen the side walls and the fuselage, but nope...   Some pics from the outside showing the gear bay and aft bomb bay with an empty TMD mounted.  It will stay that way.  Another TMD in the center bomb bay will carry a full cohort of ten CBUs.

 

 

 

... and a closer shot of each of the bays showing some of the plumbing and scratch work that was added:

 

 

 

The other two bomb bays are still works in progress.  At the start, I purchased a set of 4 resin CBUs from shull24.com.  After receiving them, I made the decision to fill one bay completely with 10 CBUs and leave the other empty.  However, the resin bombs were a bit on the expensive side so I purchased the Hasegawa IDF weapons kit which supplies 6 CBUs.  Perfect eh?  Wrong!!   The Hasegawa CBUs are about 0.25" longer and greater in diameter than the shull24 resin bombs.  They wouldn't fit in the bomb bays...   Super Angry  So I bit the bullet and bought another 2 sets of the resin CBUs.  So that bay is on hold until they arrive and get painted.  The fore bomb bay will carry 4 2000 lb JDAMS mounted on a rotary dispenser.  I started modifying the kit rotary last night..

 

 

... to look a bit like the real thing...

 

 

Here's what I've gotten so far:

 

 

left side:

 

 

right side:

 

 

bottom:

 

 

The front end of the 1:1  rotary doesn't bevel like the kit part, so a short piece of 0.5" plastic tube was filed to fit over the kit rotary and glued into place.  The large circular end piece was scribed from plastic sheet usign a quarter as a template.  Two pieces were glued together, a center hole drilled out by successively larger drill bits until it fit over the flange in the kit part.  The edges of this were beveled by filing and "bolts" were added by punching holes with a sharp pointed dissecting tool.  Boxes and plates were constructed from rectangular plastic tubing or sheet, respectively.  The holes represent anchoring points for the spaghetti wiring that is present on the real thing.  We'll see how that goes. 

 

Overall, it's been a productive week; things have gone together and I felt like I moved towards completion of this beast, although clearly there's still alot to go.  BTW, the fit of the center fuselage to the fore cockpit looks horrendous.  I anticipate some real fun when these parts get joined.  Hint:  buy stock in anyone who manufactures sand paper....  Smile

 

Don

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Thursday, August 5, 2010 9:50 PM

Pordoi, thanks for your input.  I will probably just keep the .020 styrene on there I guess.  Nice work so far on your Bone.   The rotary launcher is looking quite the part.  You are very ambitious.   As for the SRAM color....I am not too sure why they painted the tail fins orange either.  Maybe higher visibility for loaders/handlers?  Either way they look kinda cool.  After seeing more and more of you actual model kit, I know that my kit is all boogered up.  The warping is kinda bad.  Oh well.  I am learning a lot and having fun and that is the point.  Rant over. 

Kevin

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  • Member since
    October 2009
  • From: Houston, Texas
Posted by Medicman71 on Thursday, August 5, 2010 10:17 PM

Great work on the Cat and the Bones. They look great. Hope to start work on my cat in the next few weeks. Need to order some stuff for it.

Building- (All 1/48) F-14A Tomcat, F-16C Blk 30, He 129

 

  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Friday, August 6, 2010 8:20 AM

macattack80

.... I know that my kit is all boogered up.  The warping is kinda bad.  Oh well.  I am learning a lot and having fun and that is the point.  Rant over. 

 

Kevin,

Well to be honest, it's hard to see the problems that you're having from the photos that you've posted, so you must be dealing with them pretty well Yes Yes.  It can get frustrating spending so much time and effort and perceiving to accomplish only a little. This is when I give it a rest for a few days and come back fresh.  If you're going through one of these phases, hang in there. What you've shown us so far looks really nice.

 

Don

 

  • Member since
    October 2008
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by oddmanrush on Friday, August 6, 2010 9:28 AM

pordoi

 

This is when I give it a rest for a few days and come back fresh.

Yeah, I can second that! I just finished up one of Italeri's older 1/48 scale P-47s. It was a frustrating build, warped, poor fit, lots of seams, you know, the usual things that make you wanna pull your hair out. So I'm kinda sittin' back for a couple days before starting something fresh. Its kind of a detox period. This way, I don't carry the same frustration or mistakes into my next build. So I haven't started the Tornado yet, but I hope to soon!

There are a lot of fine builds goin' on here so far. A couple of really nice looking Lancers. I've never built one myself, or seen one being built so this is a very cool treat for me. And there is some excellent scratch work to go with it!

Jon

My Blog: The Combat Workshop 

  • Member since
    June 2009
  • From: Florida
Posted by STFD637 on Friday, August 6, 2010 1:27 PM

Hey all,

 

Well I finally got some time back on the kit and took some update pics. I guess par for the course on this build I somehow ruined one of the better decals I put on while remasking the the canopy. I am going to try and fix it with a fine point red pen.......we'll see!Black Eye

I got the decals on, did the wash using acrylic craft paint thinned in soapy water. I mixed burnt umber, midnight black, and white to get the good dirty grey.

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After a couple of "wash" cycles I went back over some of the lines with a sharp pencil to vary the colors.

 

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The kit has decals from the Super Scale Set, AMT, and Monogram. I took the ones that looked best and added to the look and finish.

 

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I went with some heavy wash in some areas to give depth. I plan on hitting the plane with another overcoat of Testot All purpose Dull Coat to knock everything down in sheen!

 

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What suprised me in my research for this build was how dirty the rear lower fusilage was. Most of the pics showed oily sooty streaks with lots of buidlup. I am guessing this is due to the fuel dump mechanism on the tail. I used Gunze Oil and Tamiya Smoke to get this effect. Agian it is a little heavy in an attempt not to lose too much when the Dull Coat is applied.

Thanks for looking. Hope to have some more pics soon. I need to clean the clear parts up and attach the canopy doors next.

Travis

"If a lie is told often, and long enough, it becomes reality!"

Travis/STFD637

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  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Friday, August 6, 2010 7:06 PM

Travis, your F-111 is quite the dirty girl Stick out tongue   Looks good.  I have messed up a good decal job masking myself.  It can be a little frustrating. 

Don, Looks like i am past the bomb bay frustration!!!  Time to keep building and find some more!!!  Geeked  Thanks for the encouragement.  I am very motivated with this build as it is my first GB and I am indeed learning a lot.

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I guess I will finish up those engines then move to the forward fuselage.

Kevin

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  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Saturday, August 7, 2010 7:22 AM

[quote user="macattack80"]

Travis, your F-111 is quite the dirty girl Stick out tongue   Looks good.  I have messed up a good decal job masking myself.  It can be a little frustrating. 

[\quote]

 

Ditto  That one f-111 that looks like she's been around the block a few times.  Looks like you're almost ready to claim a badge.

 

macattack80

Don, Looks like i am past the bomb bay frustration!!!  Time to keep building and find some more!!!  Geeked  Thanks for the encouragement.  I am very motivated with this build as it is my first GB and I am indeed learning a lot.

[View:/themes/fsm/utility/http://i961.photobucket.com/albums/ae98/macattack80/Finescale/fueslage.jpg:550:0]

 

I guess I will finish up those engines then move to the forward fuselage.

 

Now that's a real doomsday machine.   Really, if you had issues with warped pieces, it doesn't show.  Have you dry fitted the top half of teh fuselage yet?  If so, how was the fit after all of the bays are installed?

 

Don

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Saturday, August 7, 2010 3:46 PM

Pordoi, I did dry fit the top half this morning.  The fit isn't too bad, relative to the fit of the kit thus far.  It looks like you can get a pretty good join on one side but will be a little overlap on the other.  Not a huge step but enough of one where it will require a bit of sanding.   Get some advil and prepare for "tennis elbow" Crying   The aft area of the center section will require some putty....no real surprise there though.  All in all...nothing we can't handle or haven't handled yet.

Kevin

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  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Saturday, August 7, 2010 6:11 PM

A quick update on detailing the rotary dispenser; although it was 2 hours of work...  what can I say,.. I'm getting into it...  

 

 

 

 

Next up,  the wiring...

 

Don

 

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Saturday, August 7, 2010 7:00 PM

WOW!!!  That looks fantastic Don!!   It can be a model kit in itself.   Bow Down Bow Down  What do you plan to use for the wiring?  Might I sugest some 1/24 scale spark plug wire?

Kevin

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  • Member since
    October 2009
  • From: Houston, Texas
Posted by Medicman71 on Saturday, August 7, 2010 7:33 PM

Travis- Awsome looking Spark Vark! Really cool weathering.

Pordoi- Nice looking Bone. The bays look really good.

Macattack- I'm in awe of your scratch building. I hope I can get that good.

Building- (All 1/48) F-14A Tomcat, F-16C Blk 30, He 129

 

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Virginia
Posted by Wingman_kz on Sunday, August 8, 2010 2:23 AM

Everything is looking good fellas! Fantastic! Can't wait to see the plumbing on the launcher Don, that's gonna be cool.

No pics tonite but I'm still plugging along. Shot some Future and have about half the decals on. Only thing left to paint is the main gear and tires. Had to do a  little drilling and wiring to make sure the gear stays together. I'll get an update soon.

Tony

            

  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Monday, August 9, 2010 7:50 PM

macattack80

What do you plan to use for the wiring?  Might I suggest some 1/24 scale spark plug wire?

 

Hey Kevin, I'm probably showing my ignorance here, but what is 1/24 spark plug wire?  I ended up using lead fly tying leader wire that I got from Cabela's.  Comes in a pack with 6 spools of wire from 0.01 to 0.04 diam.  I like it because it is soft and flexible; easy to form, but care must be taken not to manipulate too much or it simply breaks.  For most of the wiring, I used 0.02 diam. and in hindsight I should have used smaller.  Nonetheless, I think that the launcher is a reasonable facsimile of the medusa-haired 1:1 version.

 

 

 

You can see a couple of places where I was a bit heavy handed with the CA.  But then again, these photos show the launcher at about 3-4X life size.  It's not really as bad as it looks here. Not to say that I can't work on my fine gluing skills... Whistling

The actuator wires coming from the rear are 0.01 diam wire. 

 

 

Finally, did some additional detail work on the attachment points themselves. 

 

 

Now I need a drink and then it's ready for some paint and washes.  This for me was a complex piece of scratch building, although none of the steps by themselves seemed that technically demanding.  Devil is in the detail and I still admire the guys who can do something like this cleanly, and get all the wiring taut and straight without glue balls.  That's all for tonight.

 

Don

 

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Monday, August 9, 2010 11:20 PM

Holy Guacamole!!!!!!  Thats pretty sweet Don!!!.

1/24 scale spark plug wire is detail wire used for "wiring up" a model car engine.   What you ended up using is probably a lot cheaper and looks probably better anyway.  Once again, nice work.

 

 

Kevin

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  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Virginia
Posted by Wingman_kz on Tuesday, August 10, 2010 12:21 AM

Very nice work Don! That looks great.

Let me ask you guys a question. Or two. Suppose you destroyed the wingwalk and fuselage walk outline decals to one side of your build, what would you do? Would you a) try to mask and spray  b) freehand it with a brush  c) omit said decals? Or, another possiblity, can you order replacement parts from Revell Germany as you can from Revell?

These are narrow little lines in 1/72 and a couple sections of the fuselage outlines will be next to impossible to mask. I am terrible with a hairy brush so that's pretty iffy. I do have the same decals in red that I could attempt to apply again and use as a guide.

Most of the decals to this kit layed down well but I didn't trust these to do the same so I cut them into sections and trimmed away as much of the carrier as I could. To their credit I suppose, they are pretty delicate and once I trimmed to nothing but the stripes they just broke apart when applying. Oh well, live and learn and apply to the next one.

Tony

PS...Oh yeh, this was the first side so these decals aren't on the other side. Yet. Embarrassed

            

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Tuesday, August 10, 2010 4:11 AM

Wingman, If it was in 1/48 I would get new decals, as for 1/72 I would leave them all off unless they really added a killer look to the model.  I definetly would not attempt to mask and paint a line that narrow and I am not that steady with a liner brush to attempt to free hand it. 

If the decals provided broke apart on you I might consider getting aftermarket decals.  I would be a little worried if I replaced them with another set of the kit decals. 

These are just my opinions I am providing as you asked so nicely Big Smile  I am sure it will look good either way judging by your progress pics. Yes

Kevin

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  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Tuesday, August 10, 2010 4:19 AM

I did get the engines assembled.  As you can expect the fit wasn't that great.  I wasn't expecting it to be.  From the reviews I have read this was supposed to be the worst fit area of the entire kit. 

The fit wasn't as bad as I was expecting.....nothing a little putty and Zap-a-Gap couldn't fix.

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The seams down the sides of the engine bays went together without too much trouble.  No putty needed.

I painted the flameholders Testors Burnt Iron Metalizer then dry brushed aluminum.  I think they look OK.  The photos aren't that good.  Sorry.  The first pic is before the dry brushing and the second after the dry brushing.

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Kevin

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  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Tuesday, August 10, 2010 4:54 PM

macattack80

I did get the engines assembled.  As you can expect the fit wasn't that great.  I wasn't expecting it to be.  From the reviews I have read this was supposed to be the worst fit area of the entire kit. 

The fit wasn't as bad as I was expecting.....nothing a little putty and Zap-a-Gap couldn't fix.

 

Well now, that doesn't look too bad for fit.  Hope my set goes together as nicely.  Should get to them soon.

 

Wingman:  given your situation, first choice would be not to put on the decals.  Second choice would be to look for other decal sets that may have lines that you could use.  Masking or freehand painting would be more effort than its worth and stands a likely chance of not looking to your satisfaction when completed.

About time we see some recent photos, no?   ...  Wink

 

Don

 

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Virginia
Posted by Wingman_kz on Wednesday, August 11, 2010 12:38 AM

Sorry Don, I couldn't help but laugh. Remember the last time you said that? But yeh, it is time. I've taken some just haven't done the editing and uploading. If they don't get done tonite, tomorrow for sure. I've been a little distracted the last couple weeks, turns out I'm going back to school this fall. It's been a long time...

Kevin and Don, thanks for your opinions on the decals. See, the whole wingwalk outline was joined by clear film. I didn't figure there was any way that was going to lay down without silvering. There were several big blocks of clear film in the fuselage outline too. What threw me was the little outlines on top of the intakes. Just about all the other decals layed down fine but the carrier around those intake outlines didn't. And the paint was pretty smooth there. So, since the other outlines were on that same part of the sheet I figured they'd do the same. Kinda wish I'd tried them without cutting them up. Oh well. Unless I come up with something else I'll probably just leave them off and promise to do better next time. Cool

Kevin, I think those engines look good. I like the burnt iron and drybrushing. I need to come up with something just a little more brown than the burnt iron for the nozzles on the Tornado.

Tony

 

            

  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Wednesday, August 11, 2010 7:13 AM

Wingman_kz

Sorry Don, I couldn't help but laugh. Remember the last time you said that?

 

Ah yes, I remember... Smile  But having alot of photos is a luxury in Group Builds, so post away my friend.  You won't see me complaining about bandwidth...

 

Don

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Wednesday, August 11, 2010 8:58 PM

Wingman,  I don't think anyone will complain if you post a bunch of pics.  From what photos you have shared with us thus far, I am sure they will be great. Yes   Your work thus far has been fantastic.

Kevin

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  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Virginia
Posted by Wingman_kz on Thursday, August 12, 2010 4:48 AM

No joy tonite fellas. Spent most of the nite working on my daughter's computer. Darn virus'. I don't have many pics this time. Honest. Was going to shoot some more Future tonite so I could get on with weathering but that didn't happen either. Daughter comes first. Big Smile Hopefully I can work on it this evening and get a few more pics.

Thanks for the compliment Kevin.

Tony

            

  • Member since
    December 2009
Posted by Harshman II on Thursday, August 12, 2010 8:51 AM

Bish

 Harshman II:

 

 

Maybe I am interested in building a Mig-23 and will join later... Thanks pal!

 

Be nice if you can. And if you do i will switch my MiG 23 for a 27, we can have the pair then.

Hi pal, I finally got a Academy 1/72 MIg-27 swing wing plane...  Maybe is time, I got to join this group build.

But I decide to have a crazy load for the Mig-27, making it into a multi-role fighter. Laser guided bomb, R-77 BVRAAM and Vympel AA missiles.. Is it possible for this group build?

  • Member since
    October 2007
  • From: Louisville, KY
Posted by pordoi on Thursday, August 12, 2010 9:58 AM

Harshman II

I finally got a Academy 1/72 MIg-27 swing wing plane...  Maybe is time, I got to join this group build.

But I decide to have a crazy load for the Mig-27, making it into a multi-role fighter. Laser guided bomb, R-77 BVRAAM and Vympel AA missiles.. Is it possible for this group build?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v353/akagi/IMG_2896.jpg

 

Welcome to the party, Harshman.  A fine addition; we were lacking in Soviet swing wingers.  I've added your kit to the build list on page 1 and I'm sure we're all looking forward to following your build. 

Don

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
  • From: Buffalo, NY
Posted by macattack80 on Thursday, August 12, 2010 4:36 PM

BalloonsWelcome SignBalloons Harshman!!!!!! 

Kevin

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  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Virginia
Posted by Wingman_kz on Friday, August 13, 2010 12:08 AM

Welcome Harshman! Looking forward to your build.

Here we go. A few more pics...

First, I wasn't sure about the main landing gear. The main strut never touches the bay and the way the retraction arm works it attaches at the rear of the bay on an angle. There's only two butt joints holding everything together and supporting the plane. I doubted it would hold so I drilled the joints and added some .018 wire.

Got that done week before last. Then it was on to decaling. May be 1/72 but it still comes with a bunch of stencils and other decals. Took quite a while. As you can see, I did put the walk outlines on the stabilators and they didn't silver at all. Took my time, poked a few holes and applied solvent a couple times. Wish now I had trusted the other outlines. Oh well, next time.

Still have a few parts to finish painting. Wanted to prime the gear tonite but ran out of time. Still have to make a final decision on what colors to use on the exhaust nozzles.

Got the final coats of Future on this evening so first of the week it's on to weathering and detailing.

Took a little time last week to start trimming out parts for the next Tornado. A British GR.1.  It will be wraparound dark sea gray and dark green. The top sections of the wing are going to be a real pain, there's major sink marks all the way across about a third of the wing. Stabilators have big sink marks on the underside and the front fuselage sections have some good ones too. I may just buy another kit off ebay to replace the wing sections. Extra parts would be good anyway.

That's all for now...

Tony

            

  • Member since
    December 2009
Posted by Harshman II on Friday, August 13, 2010 10:19 AM

some of my progress..

 

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