60th Anniversary Korean War Group Build- extended for the duration

the_draken

Hey John,

I'd go ahead and use the one from the Pershing.  I'm looking at the kit picture you linked in and I'm wondering something.  Were there two manufacturers, two different marks of Jackson, or were they rebuilt post war?  The Armourfast kit is definitely the correct forward hull and gun for the WWII version of the M-36.  But it's lacking the hull mg and the muzzle brake of the KW version.  Id odes appear, but I'm not REALLY sure, that there's no hull MG in the glacis plate on that photo you linked in.  That's interesting...

Here's a link to someone's review of the Nitto/Fujimi kit (same one that I'd built), http://www.mondo72.com/Review-Nitto-M36.html and a link to pics of the vehicle at the Korean War Memorial Museum, http://sites.google.com/site/modelingthekoreanwarin172scale/home/ground-vehicles-of-the-korean-war/allied-armour/us-fighting-vehicles/m-36-jackson-photos-and-link-comment

I don't know what to think about this issue, as it's obvious that both versions of the tank existed and were used, but I have yet to find any information on why there's no designation change between them.  Nor can I find information as to when the guns might have been changed.  It's kinda frustrating!  The Nitto/Fujimi kit is the correct shape and armament with nice detail but the fit is horrifying.  The Armourfast is a beautiful looking kit that probably goes together great but has the wrong glacis plate and gun. 

What to do?

Not all Korean War M36s were rebuilt. with a hull MG and muzzle brake. I found this pic of one that was not.

http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/koreanwarcoloursps_1.htm

Stik , thanks for the link on the M36 . That is a great pic for sure .

The open turret top on the Armourfast M36 looks quite empty , I'll have to add some figures to fill up the space ;

These two items just arrived at the front door ;

Looking at the IDF Centurion and also Stik's finished build on page one , I probably should try and make some better smoke /grenade dischargers for the turret on my build .

Here's a couple of interesting pic's from the Bill Munro Centurion book ;

Centurion Tug in Korea ...

There were also Centurion Mk.1 ARV's using Mk.1 , 2 and 3 hulls ;

Here's a pic of a REME (Royal Electrical and Mechanical Engineers) workshop in Korea ;

Reading through the book , there were some problems with the winching mechanism on the ARV Centurion . There was no safety cut out on the winding mechanism to warn when the strain on the cable became too great . For this reason crews would prefere to operate at night . Due to the great energy created when the steel ropes were in tension , they would glow red in the dark . At that point the tension was at a safe state . When the ropes turned white they were on the point of breaking , and the crew would run for cover to aviod the might of the whiplash .

So a couple more interesting Korean War centurion possible builds , A tug and ARV ??

I'll search around for some more pic's of both types as well .

Andy , I did search around google last night for a Fujimi / Nitto M30 Cargo Carrier and I found one on-line at Michigan Toy Soldier , $15 plus shipping . So I have ordered that kit .

                        John .

I'm envious of your AFV Centurion! I am curious to see what you will do for smoke launchers in 1/72. That is some might delicate work there in that scale. In1/35 my mitts had enough difficulty....

Here are some more good shots of an M36. The breech should take up a good portion of that open turret space. Did the kit not come with that stuff?

http://afvdb.50megs.com/usa/pics/90mmgmcm36.html

The instructions on the back of the box don't show it , but there is a unidentified part on the sprue ...

I assume this part might represent the breech ?

I'll have to look closely at one of the pic's on that link you posted Stik , to figure out how the breech part fits .

                   John .

Hey John,

Looking at my Fujimi, I'd say that the breech fits on to the inside of the turret with the two pegs down.  It just looks that way from the pictures. 

Cool Cent stuff John!  I too got a new book.  The Concord "Tank Warfare in Korea" came in the mail today.  I haven't had a chance to digest it all yet.  Some cool posibilties though are:  M5 tractors pulling counter battery artillery radar equipment, profile of an IS-2M Stalin tank (said they were confirmed to be used, but not confirmed to have been used in combat),  M32 ARV with a recoiless rifle where the .50 belongs, US use of 45mm NKPA anti-tank guns, lots of Marine armor, and one I am going to do for sure, a Marine m46 with a dozer blade.  It is a really cool book!

I took some more photos of my Sherman.  The last couple I added a little "friend" I took from a Heller jeep kit.

Got some paint on the lower hull of the Amtrac, and I finished scratch building the .30 cal mounts.  Should start to move along now.

Cheers,

Greg

Greg , that Tank Warfare in Korea book sounds interesting .

Nice touch also adding the gunner on the deck of the "Easy 8"

Here is my first attempt to make some Grenade / Smoke discharges on the turret of my Centurion ...

I'm not sure if the discharges are adjustable on the real tank , I think mine may need to angle up a little more ?

I found some 24 tube rocket launches from the UH-1B Huey in the spares box , I cut them into pairs and shortened them a little ,

I then cut and filed a piece of brick wall to use as the mount ...

I think they look okay .

                          John .

Helo H-34

The instructions on the back of the box don't show it , but there is a unidentified part on the sprue ...

I assume this part might represent the breech ?

I'll have to look closely at one of the pic's on that link you posted Stik , to figure out how the breech part fits .

                   John .

Yes that is the breech. The one on the left still attached to the sprue is right side up. The two cylinders to the side are recoil buffers, the whole asembly should be mounted in a horizontal orientation with the flat part against the inner face of the gun mantlet. It appears you have two breeches there. BTW, those smoke grenade launchers for the Centurion look like they qualify you for micro surgeon on your resume'!

Well I corrected the mishap with my F9F's paint and had a new coat on the lower surface today. Used Testor's Universal Acrylic thinner and this came out perfect!

I have also been working on finishing up this 1st Gulf War LAV C2 that is almost done...

Nice to see the Panther back in the mix , Stik ;

Excellent work on the LAV as well

Thanks to you and Andy for the info on the breech for the M36 , there are two small circular indents where the two pins of the breech sit inside the turret bottom ...

Side view ...

Armourfast give you two M36 in the one box , hence the extra breech .

Here's a final pic of the Grenade / Smoke Discharges fitted on the turret prior to painting ;

They worked out okay , so I found some more of those UH-1B rocket tubes in the spares box for future Centurion Builds .

                                    John .

Nice! Two in one You can modify one to a later style and have one early style

Yes it is nice to work on the Panther again. It's getting near the finish line. I just gotta avoid getting sucked into any more potholes.

Hi All:

I'm making some progress on the Shooting Star ... here are 3 photos of WIP with captions ... the fit of the 4 part fuselage is terrible ... everything else seemed to mate up just fine though ...

pepper

Top side ready  for prime coat ...

Underside ready for prime coat ...

Jazzy model holder ... couldn't find anything else and this works perfectly well ...

Nice progress PK! On my F-86 I used a paintbrush of just the right diameter up the tailpipe for a painting handle...

The prime coat went on nicely and dried almost immediately ... of course, having the temp at 105.2 when I sprayed it,  probably helped ... it cleaned up a lot of the 'ouches' visible in the pre-prime photos ... as the prime is enamel, I'm not going to mess with it until some time tomorrow ... want to be sure that it dries completely ...

Then, I'll shoot the silver and hope it turns out as well as the primer  has ...

pepper

Great work so far Pepper and having a coat of primer on the Shooting Star , your moving along nicely .

Here's some more Korean War Armour kits that just  arrived ...

Hasegawa M3 Halftrack which I'll build as an Ambulance version ;

Hasegawa kindly provide a nice cover piece for the rear cargo/troop section

Matchbox M40 Self Propelled Gun and Centurion (Tug) ;

I'm hoping I can kit bash a M15A1 Halftrack using the Hasegawa 37mm gun and Revell M16 Halftrack ;

Scratch-building the gun shield for the M15A1 shouldn't pose too much of a problem , however mounting the 37mm gun does look quite challenging . Looking through Squadrons M3 Halftrack in action book  there appears to be 3 seats at the rear of the gun as well ? . I have seen the SHQ all metal M15A1 on ebay and have thought about buying it but it looks quite crude , so I was hoping to find some more pic's of gun mount on the net for reference .

I also ordered another Centurion Tank book , Centurion Universal Tank 1943-2003 . There is suppose to be some good pic's of the Centurion Tug .

                  John .

John, the smoke grenade tubes look good.  They look like they were made for the part.  I like your new additions to the stash.  I have been eyeing that M40 myself for a future build.

Stik, your Panther is looking good too, along with the LAV. 

Pepper, F-80 looks sharp.  Looking forward to seeing it in silver.  Hard to beat that heat to get anything done!

I am gluing little bits on the LVT now.  I will get some pictures of progress up today or tomorrow.  One more interesting picture in my new book is of a Marine M26 with wading trunks like on D-Day Shermans.  Squadron had the Academy Dragon Wagon on sale for 17.99, so I had my LHS order me one, along with my donor Sherman.  Hobby Lobby was clearancing them for that a few months ago here, but I hesitated too long.  As for LVT's, the US Army used (a)4's in Korea (Inchon and Han River).  The Dragon one still needs to be modified with two .30's instead of the single .50 though.  Quite a bit easier than modifying it into an (a)5 though.  Just FYI for those of you with the Dragon 72 in your stash.

Keep on keepin' on!

Cheers,

Greg

Thanks Greg.

Helo, nice additions there. The M-15A1 should be really cool to see!

Well, my F9F now is all Sea Blue asof this evening, as well as bombs and inner face of speed brakes painted. Exactly where I intended to be on Monday evening before my paint problems.

Here's the first coat of paint on the P-80 ...

The evocative look is due to my camera trying to decide if the subject is in natural light or incadescent light :-) ...matter of fact, it's lit by both ... more later today ...

pepper

Stik and Pepper, looking good!

I am closing in on finishing a couple of kits.  The LVT is getting there, and I just decaled my RF-51D.  The Recon Mustang is a conversion from an Academy P-51.  I just have some touching up, and adding a few little bits.  When I finish it, I will take some better photos of the Tamiya F-51D, and Monogram F-82G I finished way earlier in the GB.  I said then, that I would take some better pics for the front page, but I didn't say when!

On the LVT, everything that isn't gray, (mostly white, and some brown) are places where modifications took place.  So far, I am pretty pleased.

Next up will probably be a Skyknight or Skyraider, and a Sherman M32 Conversion.  As above, will be in 72nd.  I am tempted to try some 76 stuff though.

Cheers,

Greg

Yo, Stik!  Impressive work on the navy ride!

Heya Pepper, beauty job on the Shooting Star!  Considering the effort put forth on the fuselage, that's killer, dude!

In other news, I've successfully moved my desk and extra poopie from one school to the other, my models are still in boxes at home.  I had to move the diorama, Gooney Bird, and B-29 last.  The sad part is, I had JUST taken the two airplanes from the ceiling and laid them on the student desks when I was told to go to the office for a lunch with the principal.  Twenty minutes later I get back to the classroom, some kid had come in and 'closed' the doors to the B-29's bomb bay.  AARRGGHH!!  I had not expected ANYONE to come in the classroom, leave alone TOUCH anything while I was gone for 20 min.  Now I have some serious rework to do on the doors and openers for the Superfort.

They just can't leave #$%@ alone!!!

I guess this is the kind of goodbye I should've expected from some of the kids...  Other than that, it really was a tearful goodbye.  I've never felt more of a family at any workplace than at this school.  The all school parties, the outings, and the sports days were great for team building.  And it always helps to get drunk with your co-workers.  It's too bad that US schools and businesses have moved away from get togethers like this.  Even when there ARE outings everyone's separate and ignoring everyone else hoping that it will end soon.  This is part of why I love Korea so much.

Anyway, my new school has an office for JUST me, with a fridge and microwave.  I get two computers and printers (one printer doesn't work, that will end soon).  And a second room with a video system that has a blue screen.  I'm going to have SO much fun with that.  The smallest class has 6 kids, the biggest class has 24, and there's only 6 classes.  I'll also be teaching 'after school' but during the school's business hours, no problems there.  I'm gonna have hellah fun with the kids.  I've also got a wonderful place in my office to display my models.  I'll still hang some planes from the ceiling in the classroom and show a few tanks and my diorama there, as well.  I'm going to be doing at least one year, maybe not any more than that.  I'm  actually getting home sick and wanting to earn a masters degree.

Sorry about all the OT, but we need to keep this on the front page. 

Pepper , your going quite well on the Shooting Star , especially considering the fit issue's .

Greg , Wow , nice work on the RF-51 and the LVT is looking good as well . With the Recon Mustang is that a spercific kit or just a standard F-51 with scratch-built modifications ? You now have me wanting to add one to the stash .

Andy , sounds like your starting to settle in quite nicely at your " new digs" ; Sorry to hear about the B-29 Bomb bay doors and brackets ......ouch .

As for me , there has been not much progress these past couple of day's . I woke up wednessday morning with a stiff neck and shoulders with the soreness extending down both arms ; I must of got a chill or something , so it's been difficult trying to do anything . I had big plans for lot's of airbrushing this weekend both korean war stuff and night fighter builds as well a A6M5c Zero but sadly I've only managed to airbrush a few coats on the Centurion ...

Tamiya's XF-11 Green looks a little dark ;

Although the flash on the camera tends to make the paint finish look a little lighter ; I think I'll try and lighten the green a little more .

Anyway it's my shoulders and arms that seem to be giving me the most discomfort , hopfully tomorrow I can continue in the spraybooth .

Great work everyone .

I have no knowledge of the shade of green, but I can say for certainty that the Centurion looks good!  Your modifications look factory made, John.  Sorry that you are under the weather.  I hope you get to feeling better.

The RF-51D is the standard Academy P-51D kit.  How this build came about was that I bought the kit real cheap just for the drop tanks to use for Napalm for the upcoming Skyraider.  I kept noticing that the RF-51's in my books never have drop tanks, and hmmm?  I used MV lenses black lenses for two of the cameras.  The little one is clear rod.  The decals are a mixture of leftover Tamiya F-51's, and the numbers are Scalemaster, spares insignia.  It is a real easy mod.  You just have to drill three holes.  Make a rim around tow of them, and have lenses.  This will be my last Academy Mustang though.  The Tamiya is soooo much nicer for not much more money.  I like the dropped flaps, but there is no gunsight, the tires are awful, and the Tamiya is just better fitting and detailed.  After you add or replace the listed stuff, it costs more than the Tamiya.  Luckily, I got it for less than $5.  Oh, and the decals suck.  Sorry if that sounds pretty negative.  It is very buildable, just not as nice, that's all.  Page 44 of Squadron's Air War Over Korea (the old one) has a nice profile of the a/c I'm building.

Oh yea, plus if you get the Tamiya F-51, you get the HVAR's and bombs.  My Mom always told me, you can never have too much ordnance!

Cheer,

Greg

OK-dokey, artichokey ... another shot of the P-80 ... all taped up and ready for panel painting ... these are the panels that were a different metal or shade of aluminum from the rest of the airframe ...

I applied the first of the decals on the drop tanks and they broke apart as I was nudging them into place with my finely tipped brush loaded with distilled water ... they're Aeromaster brand and I've never had this problem before ... am hoping there are no more that will tear up or fall apart during application ...

After painting the panels, I then have to go back and paint various areas with the zinc chromate color, lightened a tad with Reefer White ...

I've a free day all this day, so hope to make some good progress and have photos to share at the end of the day ...

pepper

Ready for panel painting ... I use Tamiya tape for the most part, but do have some good auto body tape that goes around curves and corners better than anything I've ever worked with ...

Draken, thanks for the compliments on the Panther. I have been viewing clips on You Tube from "The Bridges at Toko Ri" to make sure I get the details right. Looks like Superscale erred a bit on their decal instructions. God bless the internet!!! And I do agree about the afterhours socializing with beverages for team building. Sounds like you were with a great bunch of folks there.Alwyas something to be treasured. Sorry to hear about the B-29 incident. Kids will be kids.

Helo, the green on the Centurion looks pretty darn good to my eye. After gloss coat, decals, and a lightening top coat of weathering dust it should look just right...

PK, the Shooting Star is shaping up nicely. I always thought the rounded lines had a sort of Flash Gordon/Buck Rogers look most other jet fighters never did. Keep up the great work! I hope those ofyou with weekends off fill the next few pages with lots of progress pics on this US three day holiday weekend...

stikpusher

PK, the Shooting Star is shaping up nicely. I always thought the rounded lines had a sort of Flash Gordon/Buck Rogers look most other jet fighters never did. Keep up the great work! 

Heya stik, thanks for the kind words ... I agree with you about the shape ... like a sexy woman with all those curves ... another fighter I've always liked is the Lockheed YF-90 ... that's really got that Flash Gordon look to it ...

Work has come to a halt as we're in the midst of a surprise visit by 2 of our kids ... doorbell rings and when I open it - 'Surprise !! ' ... yeah, just what I needed today ... oh well, the Shooting Star will be there later this day :-) ...

Again, to all in this GB, kudos from me to you ... there's so much going on here - so many different models and such a wide variety of things to model, that I do believe this is the bestest of 'em all ... good modeling makes good friends and vice versa ...

pk

pepper kay

... another fighter I've always liked is the Lockheed YF-90 ... that's really got that Flash Gordon look to it ......

pk

Oooops !  ... shoulda said the XF-90... take a close look at it and you'll see the F-104 there ... another oddball to look at is the XF-88 ... Google shows pictures of it with a prop and a jet ... back in those days, everything was tried ...

pk

PS ... I've found the smilies again ... seems AOL won't let me use them but I'm signed on with Internet Explorer and can see and use them - for what it's worth - and now back to the Shooting Star ...

I've had a couple more idea's floating around in my busy little head ....

There is a pic in squadrons Korea Armor book of a Searchlight Truck ;

I was thinking of using the Heller 1/72 GMC 353 truck for such a build ;

Looking through the spare's box I found a engine cowl and a base along with some clear plastic sheet which I cut out a circle for a lense and perhaps modifying one of those Hasegawa Compressor units and scratch-build a bracket to hold the light in position ;

I think it was Andy (Draken) who did some home made camouflage netting ; What did you use Andy ?

Also recently I ordered a whole bunch of FSM back issue's and one of them was the July 2000 issue , "Modeling the Korean War"  there is a small pic of a built LVT(A)4 ...

Is that build the same as the Airfix LVT 4 Buffalo ;

It looks the same to me or am I missing something ?

                                John .

Heya John:

Why not use the round doodad you have already and cover the light with camo netting ... that way, you don't need to have  a lens or any other detail parts for the light ...

Just a thought,

pepper

John, what do you think of the Heller truck?  I purchased one recently, but I haven't started on it.  It certainly is priced right.  I would buy a bunch of them if they were equiped like the box art truck!  Their jeep with trailer has some supplies at least.

That is a good issue of FSM.  For those that don't have it, it is the one I briefly posted the F-86A article from.  The Sabre with the white and black stripes looks so good, and I must at some point have one like it!  As for the caption on the LVT, as you have already surmised John, that is the LVT-4 Buffalo, not the (a)4 Amtank.  I haven't run across any -4's in Korea yet.  I don't think that the Marines used them, but it is entirely possible that the US Army or others in the coalition did.  The Army had thousands of them by the end WWII.  I have seen pictures and a color profile of the French in Vietnam using them.  I am thinking that the editors of the magazine might have mixed that up since they put little snippets of French Indochina in the article.  The Squadron Amtracs in Action book does show some cool French -4's with a 40mm Bofors gun mounted in an semi-open turret.  These were to augment their (a)4's.  If I can find more/better pictures of one, I will want to make one.  The current LVT that I am building is making me want to build an Amtrac collection.

While doing research for the M32, I have yet to find a good picture of the big hole in the top of the turret.  I would say hatch, but I haven't seen anything to indicate one, just a ring that a .50 mounts on.  Also, they made M32s on all the different versions from A1 to A4.  There seems to be a lot of variations within the type too.  A lot of the pictures I found are of the vehicles as they are currently in collections.  This doesn't give indications of what time in their life, what changes were made.  I think I am going to go with some creative license.  Regardless, I am learning more about the Sherman tank.  The more I learn, the more I like the Sherm.  Darn that armor bug that bit me!

Pepper, I readily agree with your sentiments on the asthetics of the F-80.  It is very pleasing to the eye.  Yours is looking good.  You wouldn't know about the fuse fit problems by looking at yours.

I too am really enjoying this GB.  This is a great bunch of guys, and it is always the first place I look when I get on Finescale.

Cheers,

Greg

Helo H-34

I've had a couple more idea's floating around in my busy little head ....

There is a pic in squadrons Korea Armor book of a Searchlight Truck ;

I was thinking of using the Heller 1/72 GMC 353 truck for such a build ;

Looking through the spare's box I found a engine cowl and a base along with some clear plastic sheet which I cut out a circle for a lense and perhaps modifying one of those Hasegawa Compressor units and scratch-build a bracket to hold the light in position ;

I think it was Andy (Draken) who did some home made camouflage netting ; What did you use Andy ?

Also recently I ordered a whole bunch of FSM back issue's and one of them was the July 2000 issue , "Modeling the Korean War"  there is a small pic of a built LVT(A)4 ...

Is that build the same as the Airfix LVT 4 Buffalo ;

It looks the same to me or am I missing something ?

                                John .

The searchlight truck is an awesome idea! Something way off the beaten path for any war!

As far as the LVT-4 goes, that would appear to be another historical gaffe on the part of FSM. From what I have read, the LVT-3 Bushmaster was the Amtrack troop carrier for the Marines in Korea. I have not read of Army use of Amtracks in Korea, but it is possible I suppose. But the one shown in the article is an early model -4 from 1944 in that paint and fit.  Something  along the lines of another thread here about the Midway TBF markings. Now French Indochina is a hole different ball of wax. Yup, those were there. But yes, the 1/35 Nitto LVT-4 and the Airfix 1/76 LVT-4 are the same subject.

Hey all!

Stik is right, I'm the dude with the 1/72 camo net.  I used medical gauze (could've used cheese cloth, too) and spray painted it a khaki colour.  I then used a dark green and black thread and just 'embroidered' random designs with the thread.  It came out looking awesome!  I strongly recommend doing this for anything in the 'braille scale' regime.

As far as the LVT-4 in Korea, I've seen pictures of it in the Korean War Memorial Museum where they were used for ferrying cargo across the Han before bridges were built following the Incheon landing.  That KIND OF implies that they were available for use during the Incheon landing itself, but who knows.  I have one for my collection, for what it's worth.