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1st Model in 40 yrs - 1/350 Yamato

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  • Member since
    October 2008
  • From: italy
Posted by bsyamato on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 4:40 AM

abosutely great finish! Bow Down and inspirating work

i agree on the nagato! waiting for her

  • Member since
    March 2006
Posted by TD4438 on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 5:17 AM

Any praise of mine will only be an understatement.

I just don't have the words.

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 5:57 AM

LOL! (Laughing Out Loud)

Heh I met you at the contest just before you were called up for 'Best in Show' award. Well deserved indeed!

Here are some of my photographs of your Yamato:

Looking forward to more of your excellent work, hopefully see you there next year.

Jason

 

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2006
Posted by TD4438 on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 6:08 AM

If this took second in it's class,what grabbed first?

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 6:22 AM

Who won gold?

A modeler who makes 'masters' or prototypes for 'Resin Shipyard' Basically a professional. Great work, best resin ships anywhere yet I feel because his work is... work. The entries should be delegated to 'Display Only'

Funny thing is the awards are a points system with multiple 'Gold, Silver & Bronze' depending on points scored, it was NOT Olympic style IE only one of each / category... I feel the Yamato should have scored 'Gold'

Not to 'hijack' the thread, the Yamato speaks for its self. World class work, more impressive the fact he has not been building models for decades.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 6:44 AM

Firedeck,

Man, you set the standard that we should all strive for! I'm proud of you!

Bill

  • Member since
    November 2010
Posted by Firedeck on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 10:42 AM

Hi guys...and Bill and Jason! 

Yes, it was a GREAT experience my first contest...and I met some wonderful people with similiar interests and passions and saw some amazing works of art (thats what they are in my view, works of art)  and to win best of show as voted on by the other judges and entrants, was a HUGE honor for me! I went home pleased and proud... and best of all, I made a couple of new friends! Great day!

Cheers!

 

  • Member since
    March 2006
Posted by TD4438 on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 11:01 AM

As nice as it may be,there is no way that resin kit (what is it anyway?) beats your Yamato.No way!

  • Member since
    November 2008
  • From: Central Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 11:42 AM

The judges have to take into account the compexity of your build which in my book is a Gold Winner. I see this kind of thing going on at shows and it s a pitty that you were robbed of a Gold 1st place award. The deck color not right? Was this judge ever on the Yamato? We can only strive to approximate our models to the actual prototype. You did a fantastic job.Beer

 

 GIFMaker.org_jy_Ayj_O

 

 

Too many models to build, not enough time in a lifetime!!

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 11:50 AM

Avoid reprisals!

From experience it will never work out. Clubs that hold contests are like kids in a sandbox, they are comfortable with their own & their unique style of play.

What you should do:

Enter the Yamato in a different contest for your own piece of mind. You know the effort & skill involved, see if a different venue will reward the ship accordingly.

Color of the deck? That is the lamest excuse for points deductions I have ever heard! Exact shades & colors are subjective and should only be deductions if the color is completely out to lunch. Many 'Blue Hue' Panzers have won top awards, I have yet to see dark gray weather to a blue color...

I know exactly how you feel.

After putting a entire winter's modeling effort into a Marder II (bugger of a kit to boot) It never even placed at a contest out west in 2009! The winner was a ringer who had his converted LAV 8 wheeled APC featured in that months Extreme Modeling Mag. Actually he entered 2, third place went to a club` member. All good as mine made `Great Scale Modeling 2010` While the others did not.

I posted pictures here, asked for critique and was told one road wheel was off the tracks. Well I corrected the mistake & hid another in deeper snow. My Marder II at CAMS took `Best light Armour` 

The system used is flawed in that the model should earn merit on its own, not looked at for flaws. Mistakes should be points deducted, not compared to a professional model builder`s resin prototype.

The best system I have found for model contests is where each model is removed from the room to be judged. At least 5 judges assign scores for its merits compared to their ideal build of the kit in question. The highest score & lowest are discarded, the rest averaged for the final score. The metals are assigned Olympic`style  that is only 1 Gold, 1 Silver & 1 Bronze per category. Only a exact tie merits 2 awards of said level, rare as the scores are calculated to the first decimal point. I prefer this as it allows for nicer awards vrs everyone getting something. (That is fine for the Jr. entries, not adult competition)

Jason

 

 

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Rain USA, Vancouver WA
Posted by tigerman on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 12:02 PM

The people are much smarter then the judges. Wink

Absolutely stunning work. That PE is incredible. I can't believe it's been 40 years since you last built.

I hope you start Bismarck next, that would be a great follow-up to this sweet build. Cool

   http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y269/wing_nut_5o/PANZERJAGERGB.jpg

 Eric 

  • Member since
    November 2010
Posted by Firedeck on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 12:27 PM

Hi guys, thanks for your nice comments and suggestions! I appreciate the support but I wasn't upset that it didnt win in judging in ships... there was some tough competition!

I will just have to "modify my emphasis" to accomodate judging next time, thats all. No prob. :)

And I will be back next year and look forward to seeing you guys there again! I had SO much fun that day! -Tim 

  • Member since
    March 2006
Posted by TD4438 on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 3:22 PM

Tell ya what firedeck.After checking out your build yet again,I'll be upset for you!

Your Yamato makes the other entry look like a toy.I just don't see any justification for it taking first.

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 3:54 PM

Firedeck,

There really is no right or wrong color for a wood deck . . . much depends on the type of wood used and its maintenance.  Yamato was kept in a pristine manner and the deck probably was immaculate.  We know that, during the Leyte operation, it was stained black from funnel soot, but I have never read that it was stained in such a manner for the Ten-Go operation. Your deck looks terrific to me, a sailor of 24 years.  Keep up the stellar work!

Bill Morrison

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Tuesday, May 31, 2011 7:57 PM

One last point to consider:

The lighting at the venue was the terrible yellowish florescent kind, the absolute worst for taking pictures & getting the correct light for viewing scale models.

On my Marder II the base is covered in snow, there it looked like a yellow tint yet I can assure the only colors used were Flat white in enamel & acrylic with acrylic Tamiya clear blue for shadows & blue sky reflection.

All minor disappointments aside I must say the contest was a great time for all attending!Yes

I thank all who worked hard putting it on from CAMS model club & the many sponsors. It was only my second year and am looking forward to next years event.

JasonToast

 

 

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada
Posted by viper29_ca on Friday, June 3, 2011 4:29 PM

It is obvious you didn't pay attention to the awards, as Fred Bustard didn't win Best Ship for the above kit, or any other kit for that matter.

 

And as far as that goes, so what if he did. Just because he makes the masters for Resin Shipyard, doesn't make him a "professional Modeler". If he built the kit above to sell, then I would say yes he is a "professional Modeler", but he doesn't, he builds the kit so people can see what it can look like when finished, if that makes him a professional, then I guess by that same parameters, then I am also considered a professional modeler and should be banned from entering shows because I own a hobby shop. Me owning Elm City Hobbies, and Fred owning part of Resin Shipyard is no different, and by us owning the respective hobby companies doesn't automatically make our building ability any better. If Fred had nothing to do with Resin Shipyard and was only making those kits for his own enjoyment, the quality I would dare say would be as good if not better than what you see above, just because of the fact that he wouldn't be working under any deadlines to get a particular kit finished to go to sale.

 

The analogy Tim gave me was you wouldn't see a Pro Golfer in an Amateur tournament, problem is, neither Fred or myself are that Pro Golfer, we are more the kid in the Golf Shop selling clubs and balls to golfers. Just because he is selling the equipment, doesn't make him a better golfer, and just because Fred and I sell models and such, doesn't make us a better modeler.

 

As far as our judging system goes, it is a modified AMPS system, which means you can end up with multiple Golds, Silvers and Bronzes in one category. Essentially all kits start with 30pts and points are deducted for blemishes/mistakes/errors, whatever you want to call it. A bulk of the points are based upon the build and finish of the kit, with only a very few on accuracy, so for Tim to score a Silver, he would have lost points for more than just the deck color. That being said, to win Gold, it is a very narrow slice, as I believe it is only 28-30pts will get you a gold (might be 27 to 30, can't remember), so even a 27.5 will get you a Silver. Despite not being one of the judges (I did photography) Tim did point out to me that the deck was ill fitting and that there was a gap where there shouldn't be...no fault of Tim's as it was a flaw in the deck, and he used what he could work with, but he is still going to get docked probably a full point for that alone. The AMPS system takes the kit and judges it on it's own merit, and not compared to any other kit on the table, highest score at the end of the day wins, there are no 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc.

 

IMO, this is a much better, and fairest system than an IPMS 1st, 2nd, 3rd only, or a peer judged system where often the biggest and flashiest, but not necessarily the best goes home with the top prize.

 

As far as the lighting goes, it is far better than we had in the past at other locations. It would be fantastic to have a perfect place with lots of natural light, but such a place either doesn't exist, is too small for our needs, or isn't big enough. The location we have is perfect (for now) until we out grow that place, which I don't see happening any time soon, as well it is economical place to rent compared to other venues of equal or larger size.


BTW, I had a look at the picture I took of your Marder II, looks white to me

 

 

In closing, it would be lovely if people checked their facts before making statements that are untrue, it avoids alot of conflict and embarrassment.

  • Member since
    March 2006
Posted by TD4438 on Friday, June 3, 2011 5:15 PM

Would you happen to have pics of the winning entries in question?

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada
Posted by viper29_ca on Friday, June 3, 2011 7:09 PM

The winner was Ian Moore with a 1/700 HMS Repulse.

 

 

All the pics from the show can be seen here:

 

http://public.fotki.com/ScottM/hobby-shows/cams-spring-classic/

 

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Friday, June 3, 2011 9:41 PM

[quote user="SuppressionFire"

All minor disappointments aside I must say the contest was a great time for all attending!Yes

I thank all who worked hard putting it on from CAMS model club & the many sponsors. It was only my second year and am looking forward to next years event.

JasonToast

[/quote]

Indeed,

Heh like improving model building everything is a work in progress.

A line can be drawn as being paid for something is the definition of a profession or professional. Best to check with Revenue Canada on that one, I claimed last years magazine submissions as income, my chartered accountant agreed. Most model builders (non paid) can be classified as enthusiasts or in this case hobbyists.  

Nothing wrong with the venue, nobody expects all the florescent lights to be changed to 'natural light' types for a model contest.

Any critique mentioned was meant to be constructive and not criticism, its a online thing which at times the line is blurred. Thick skin & the ability to sort the 'wheat from the chaff is mandatory here.

What was said on my comment card I did not care to discuss here, the lighting annoyance or judges decisions was not mentioned on the comment card.

Truthfully I cringed at every glance at the Marder II. I hoped everyone did not think the snow was yellow. Your camera must have a function to deal with florescent lighting, the point was the yellow tint on the Yamato might have looked more so under those lights.

I took a closer look at the 1/700 scale ship. The 'smoke' did nothing for the model and in my humble opinion discouraged a second look. Hence no picture of that 1. Also why I thought the Resin Shipyard model(s) won.

Fredericton NB is a great city and look forward to visiting again & stopping by your shop. Thanks for  stopping in and voicing your side of the story, would join the club & help out yet being 3 hour drive away its rather impractical.

Jason

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada
Posted by viper29_ca on Friday, June 3, 2011 10:55 PM

 

A line can be drawn as being paid for something is the definition of a profession or professional. Best to check with Revenue Canada on that one, I claimed last years magazine submissions as income, my chartered accountant agreed. Most model builders (non paid) can be classified as enthusiasts or in this case hobbyists.

 

 

Difference is, you are making money from your magazine submissions, Fred isn't making money from the kits he builds. Yes he makes the masters, and yes he builds one of each kit to show the customer what can be made with the kit, but he doesn't make money from the built kit, it is just a tool to help the sales of the unbuilt kits they produce. More an advertising tool to create sales, rather than sales from the actual kit he builds.

Fact of it all, I think Tim's build, based on face value, IMO was probably the best ship there, and while I don't agree with the outcome of the class, neither I, or you judged the ship kits, so we don't know for what points were taken away for each kit, and based on the points that were left on the kits, the Repulse came out ahead. If I went back through the judging sheets, I am sure the difference between the kits is only a point or 2, which is all it needs to be.

As far as my camera is concerned, it was set to Auto Macro for all the pictures, I did nothing special to the camera otherwise, and whether it was fluorescent light, natural bulbs or direct sunlight, all the kits were under the same lights, and thus equal footing.

 

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Saturday, June 4, 2011 12:14 AM

YesYesYesYesYes    YesYesYesYesYes    (I'm all thumbs)    Fantastic work and congratulations on your medal.

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Saturday, June 4, 2011 1:23 AM

A true museum masterpiece,congrats

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Saturday, June 4, 2011 6:25 AM

It is what it is,

When the dust settles some will be surprised, others disappointed and the rest content.

Still believe its the best model contest in Atlantic Canada.

Hoped the club would have shown interest in changing the name of the contest to reflect a more regional status while volunteering to submit photographs of the best entries to FSM for possible publication in their annual issue 'Great Scale Modeling' Needless to say the idea spawned too late for it to happen.

Possibly next year?

License plates seen there:

Maine, Prince Edward Island, Nova Scotia and of course New Brunswick

The people spoke & the Yamato won as their favorite. Just before Tim went up to get the award I told him it was my favorite at the show, asked if I voted for it I replied:

'Cast my two votes (entered a model for GF's son) for my modelWink

 

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Fredericton, New Brunswick, Canada
Posted by viper29_ca on Saturday, June 4, 2011 7:52 AM

I would love to do the photos so they could be submitted to FSM, Scale Auto and Model Car, the problem is there really isn't any place to do it. We use all 3 rooms for the show, with the back room doubling as a place where people can sit down and eat, so there really is no place to set up a proper area to take pictures, meaning a largeish plain background, with lots of lighting, etc, etc.

As well, I can't be in 2 places at once, we would need a release form for the modeler (which isn't a big deal) and the models would have to be moved around. We tried it in the past and it is just too much work for one person to handle, and the magazines won't come to us.

Changing the name of the show isn't going to bring in the magazines just because of the fact that we are A. in Canada, I have only seen FSM show up at one show in Canada, which was Tamiya Con in Ottawa in 2005, and B, we are way to the east in Canada. If we were in Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal, Winnipeg, Calgary, Vancouver....maybe, most of them couldn't pick out Fredericton on a map if tasked to do so.

 

I would love to do it, as photography is my 2nd hobby, there just isn't enough time or space in the day to do so. There is a possibility that I might get the pictures of some of the cars in the Model Car Magazine....as their requirements are usually not as stringent, as FSM and SA won't take pictures taken at a show on the table. I am hoping I can get enough on the white table cloth without much else interfering with the picture, but then it would likely only be in their annual show, and I would have to get permission from all the entrants to give the picture to MCM, not that I think that would be a problem.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Saturday, June 4, 2011 10:27 AM

SuppressionFire

The people spoke & the Yamato won as their favorite.  

That about sums it up.  I wonder how the judges rationalized that outcome in their own minds?  

  • Member since
    September 2005
  • From: Groton, CT
Posted by warshipguy on Saturday, June 4, 2011 11:27 AM

Firedeck,

Don't model for the judges or the people; model for yourself.  Looking at both builds, there is no way to rationalize awarding a gold medal for a project that took far less effort and attention to detail that you brought to your exceptional Yamato!  While the builder of the HMS Renown model that won did an excellent job, your effort was absolutely brilliant. You have every right to feel proud of your work. I know that I am impressed.

Bill

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Saturday, June 4, 2011 11:37 AM

viper29_ca

I would love to do the photos so they could be submitted to FSM, Scale Auto and Model Car, the problem is there really isn't any place to do it. We use all 3 rooms for the show, with the back room doubling as a place where people can sit down and eat, so there really is no place to set up a proper area to take pictures, meaning a largeish plain background, with lots of lighting, etc, etc.

As well, I can't be in 2 places at once, we would need a release form for the modeler (which isn't a big deal) and the models would have to be moved around. We tried it in the past and it is just too much work for one person to handle, and the magazines won't come to us.

Changing the name of the show isn't going to bring in the magazines just because of the fact that we are A. in Canada, I have only seen FSM show up at one show in Canada, which was Tamiya Con in Ottawa in 2005, and B, we are way to the east in Canada. If we were in Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal, Winnipeg, Calgary, Vancouver....maybe, most of them couldn't pick out Fredericton on a map if tasked to do so.


I would love to do it, as photography is my 2nd hobby, there just isn't enough time or space in the day to do so. There is a possibility that I might get the pictures of some of the cars in the Model Car Magazine....as their requirements are usually not as stringent, as FSM and SA won't take pictures taken at a show on the table. I am hoping I can get enough on the white table cloth without much else interfering with the picture, but then it would likely only be in their annual show, and I would have to get permission from all the entrants to give the picture to MCM, not that I think that would be a problem.

Agreed you were busy with taking photographs for the club, contest duties and with setting up the portable shop. It would be impossible to be 3 (or in your case 4) places at once.

FSM does cover the Western Canadian Regional Model Contest in GSM hosted by RMMC or Rocky Mountain Model Club. Mike Grant of Mike Grant Decals is involved with the event, photographs are taken by another fellow (will insert his name later, issues of GSM in storage) Only the modelers handle the models to and from the photo table, wavers ask they do this so no feathers get ruffled in the handling while helping out. Its a busy day yet their level of professionalism & organization gets the job done well.

*Their old venue was at a community center that used sodium yellow industrial lights, anything white looked yellow even more so even over the extra lighting the photographer provided. The pictures made GSM 2008, everyone in the world must think I like yellow snow!

Like mentioned before I would be honored to photograph the event for possible consideration as a submission to GSM. As all submissions it would be the decision of the editorial staff (Aaron you reading this?) if the quality of the photographs & models are worthy of publication in a future issue of GSM.

I have been using colored construction paper for make shift photo studios for threads on the forums & submissions. It always turns out better with natural lighting. A 2' x 4' table would be sufficient for photography at your event. Here is a example of the difference:

Below is the kitchen lights:

This one is in the kitchen as well, just natural light instead:

 

 

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
    November 2010
Posted by Firedeck on Wednesday, September 14, 2011 4:16 PM





  • Member since
    December 2008
  • From: Northern Va
Posted by psstoff995's lbro on Wednesday, September 14, 2011 7:22 PM

Bow DownSurpriseYesWow

Is that enough? Missed this one first time around.

-Will young modeler Test fit master
  • Member since
    August 2004
  • From: Forest Hill, Maryland
Posted by cwalker3 on Monday, September 19, 2011 3:18 PM

Firedeck, I just came upon this thread and all I can say is OMG! After a 40 year hiatus what made you decide to start on such an undertaking? I can understand deciding on the ship because of an interest you had in her, but deciding to do all of that PE with no experience in working with it just blows me away. I've been back into the hobby for about 7 years and I still suck at assembling PE and usually try and avoid it at all costs.

Again, one heckuva job you did there. Bravo Zulu!

Cary

 


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