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Revell 1/110 Charles W Morgan

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  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Revell 1/110 Charles W Morgan
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 3, 2013 2:37 AM

I started this about three weeks ago and haven't really had much time as you can see.  I haven't glued the hull halves together yet.  I have been painting slowly and just started the white stripes along the hull which is why it is looking a bit rough.  It is a great little kit and I am having fun researching and planning.

Enjoy,

Steve

I moved another of my photos while consolidating my library which in photobucket takes away the link since it is direct.  I will try and post the photos back.....

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 3, 2013 2:40 AM

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 3, 2013 2:41 AM

 

 

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 3, 2013 2:44 AM

Still need to clean up the painting as I go.

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 3, 2013 2:45 AM

You can see where I touched up with a brush on the hull. I had originally used a rattle can to paint the hull.

Steve

However, you cannot see the touch ups without the flash.

       

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Saturday, August 3, 2013 3:15 PM

That looks great, Steve. I'm thinking about mine too, but it's a little ways down the queue.

Have you narrowed down the era you are going to build. Even the brief amount of reading I've done suggests that over the 75 or so years she was in service there's quite a few combinations of fit outs and rigs to explore.

One thing I remember from past builds of this kit is that the masts are really flexible and it's very hard to keep them straight when the rigging is installed.

I would consider replacing at least the top masts with brass tube, even if it's not tapered.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    March 2012
  • From: Marysville, WA
Posted by David_K on Saturday, August 3, 2013 6:07 PM

Hey Steve, what kind of paint did you use for the copper bottom?

        _~
     _~ )_)_~
     )_))_))_)
     _!__!__!_         
     (_D_P_K_)
   ~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    ~~~~~~~~~~~

Current Project:  Imai/ERTL Spanish Galleon #2

Recently Finished: Revell 1/96 Cutty Sark

Next Up:  ???

 

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Lacombe, LA.
Posted by Big Jake on Saturday, August 3, 2013 11:04 PM

Does anyone know what the shade of yellow is called. Floquil makes a great shade of flat yellow that is real close to what you show in the pictures.  I wonder why they decided to use this coloring?  Anyone have a backstory or history?

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Sunday, August 4, 2013 12:59 AM

Thanks GM!  It is a really interesting build and the detail is really nice.  It is an enjoyable build except for the pin marks which in some instances are huge.  The cleanup isn't too bad and the flash is actually fair to midland.

What book are you reading and what would you recommend for reference material?  I am not sure what would be the best reference material that would have all the incarnations the CWM has gone through during her working life.  There's a build on shipmodeling.net forum that a gentleman name Gerald did that is stunning.  Again, I am not sure which period he is modeling it to but it has the head along the port side opposite the fore companionway, otherwise it looks pretty much like the Revell kit.  There is another structure between the skylight and the aft companionway that is covered by the aft overhead.  He had it posted on modelshipworls's forum but with the server crash they had, a good portion of his WIP was lost.

I am trying to decide whether to use the forward overhead that covers the tryworks area. I would hate to lose all the detail work. As I progress (meaning that I will actually glue pieces together), I am going to age the copper with Floquil paints, a la Les Wilkins style, and then use artist oils as usual for me to give it just the right look.

Thanks for the heads up on the masts, I thought they felt a bit "springy".I know metal would be stronger but what about wood so that I can taper it?

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Sunday, August 4, 2013 1:07 AM

Dave,

I am using Floquil copper since the Les Wilkens' method of aging the copper plates can only be achieved using Floquil Copper, Antique White and Light Green.  Which reminds me that I need to stock up on Floquil paints before they disappear.  I am going to need to find another method for patinaing the copper bottoms down the road.

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Sunday, August 4, 2013 1:24 AM

Jake,

I used Vallejo Yellow Ochre for the interior.  I found it to be really close to the color that was painted on before and during the renovation.  It doesn't have an orange tint to it but more of a brownish cast.  You have to remember that the pure colors that we have now weren't around then.  Although I remember seeing somewhere in another CWM thread that the stripe on the boats was an Electric Blue; and you can actually look up the color on Goggle.  However, I am not sure when that color was used.

I also primed with Tamiya's fine gray primer in a rattle can since gray is a perfect primer for reds and yellows and Tamiya's primer tightens up as it dries so little if any detail is lost.  Which Floquil yellow are using?

What the history of the color is I have no idea at the moment, but I did ask GMorrison which reference book he is reading which may have the reasoning behind the choice.  Or else Tracy White might know.  It could have been the Captain's choice and the interior was painted in greens or whites at other times, it would be interesting to know.  Anybody?

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Lacombe, LA.
Posted by Big Jake on Sunday, August 4, 2013 3:00 PM

Depot buff is a really close shade based on what I can tell from the older and newer color pictures.

 

 

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Sunday, August 4, 2013 6:19 PM

If you really want to dive into the subject of nineteenth-century nautical paint colors, pick up a copy of the second volume of Ship Modeler's Shop Notes, published by the Nautical Research Guild.  It contains a long article by Eric Ronnberg on just that subject, based  on such sources as written records and catalogs from paint companies.  There are several pages of color chips.  This article almost (not quite, thank goodness) lets sailing ship modelers play the same sorts of games about color accuracy as aircraft and modern warship modelers do.  

Remember, though, that, given old-time manufacturing mentions and differences from manufacturer to manufacturer, and the fact that no agency like the U.S. Navy or the U.S. Army Air Forces was presiding over any "official" colors, the best one can hope for is a general guide.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Tuesday, August 6, 2013 12:42 AM

Ship Modeler's Shop Notes is an excellent reference unto itself.  

Next time I get my financial feet under me again, replacing my well over-read, broken-spine copy with a new one.

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Friday, August 9, 2013 2:09 AM

Thanks Prof Tilley for the recommendation.  I found a couple of copies of Ship Modeler's Shop Notes 2 that were actually affordable so I am going to order them; however, should I also pick up a copy of volume one?

Here is a shot from the bows towards the stern.  On the transom piece I painted the port and starboard interior white to match the interior of the hurricane cabins.  It will be hard to see but at least I know they're white.  I also plan on placing a ring buoy on the wall besides the helm and rig the helm.

I am dry fitting all the deck fixtures and furniture and when they have been sanded, scraped and painted, then I'll start glueing.  I also plan to use an oil wash to weather the CWM and I hope it will turn out nice.  I am testing colors on scrap to see what works best.  I am still not sure what era the Revell model portrays although I have an idea that it is a compilation of eras.  Most of the pictures I have found show the transom without the bank of windows and only the stars and eagle for decoration, but I have decided to leave the transom alone other than glazing the windows and not painting the gun stripe on the sides.

I am going to take photos this weekend with the dry fitted parts on decks so any help and comments are appreciated.

Enjoy,

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Friday, August 9, 2013 2:15 AM

The starboard side.

 

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Friday, August 9, 2013 2:16 AM

       

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Friday, August 9, 2013 6:31 PM

I love this model! There are two other ships ahead of this in the queue, the Potemkin (80%) and SSN-571 Nautilus (60%) but I may get out the CWM and start fiddling. For now I'm happy to watch you.

As far as research, so far I've read the book from the Seaport; Leavitt's "The Charles W. Morgan".From all comments I've found about that book, there's no reason to doubt any of the statements it contains. While not too detailed, it gives a good chronology of the ship, at least up to 1973.

Here's a quick overview of the basic changes I have read about therein. She was launched in 1841 as a three masted fully rigged ship, four sails per mast. There were all manner of jibs, headsails, staysails and a spanker on the mizzen mast. Studding sails were used on the fore and main mast yards.

There were four boats in davits plus spares, three on the larboard and one aft on the starboard side. The boats at that time were lapstreak construction.

The windlass was aft of the foremast, there was no hurricane house on the stern, and there was a deck capstan somewhere.

The hull was black, maybe with three or so strakes of natural planking from the deck level down. Most of that type of ship at that time had the wales painted white, but there's no clue to that in this book- it most probably was painted that way, and certainly was not soon after.

That's the rigging Revell sets up, although the boat and deck furniture arrangement is from much later.

In 1867 she was re-rigged as a bark, losing the yards from the mizzen as well as the topgallant mast. Somewhere in there she got a fifth boat starboard forward.

In 1875 she was re-rigged, with wire stays and many other improvements. In 1879 she was re-rigged and replacement masts were three feet shorter than before.

In 1881 she was rigged with double topsails on the main. An upper fore topsail was added at sea that year as well. The windlass moved forward of the foremast, switching places with the forward companionway.

Somewhere in there the stern deck houses were added.

Pictures from the turn of the last century show the simpler stern. Whether there were windows before is not explained here.

She retired in 1921. She appeared in both "Down to the Sea.." and "Java Head", being more or less fully rigged again.

After leaving service, she was refurbished and put on display from 1924 or soon after, to 1935. There's a photo in the book from that time showing her fully rigged again, with the gun port paint job. That's how she's painted in a photo showing her being towed to Mystic, although there's only two yards on the mizzen.

Now I realize that those of you who actually know something about ships are expectorating into your spittoons, but I'm offering this brief synopsis as one modeler to another without misstating anything from this one source. I think it could be useful.

I guess that the Revell model pretty closely follows the way the ship came to the Museum. Dr. Tilley no doubt may know the source of that companies information, but it appears to me that what they are selling is a sort of movie/ display version of the ship, circa 1950.

This is Docidles thread, so I'll explain my plans elsewhere, but I hope this helps, Steve.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Lacombe, LA.
Posted by Big Jake on Saturday, August 10, 2013 9:23 AM

Stopped by  LHS and stocked up on 3 bottles each of Copper, Antique White and Light Green. - 4.45 per bottle that blew my model money for the month.

Are the Vallejo Yellow can it be put in an airbrush?

 

 

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Saturday, August 10, 2013 11:15 AM

I visited the Morgan for the first time in the summer of 1966.  At that time - and for a long time after - she wore the white painted "ports" on her hull, and the full ship rig.   Generations of visitors came to take it for granted that that was what she looked like.  She sat in a bed of concrete, not actually "afloat."  In 1966, at least in the summer time, she actually set a full suit of sails.  (I remember sitting with my father watching the rigging crew, consisting of one full-time staff member and two apprentices, furl them at the end of the day.)

I think the Revell kit, which was originally released in 1968 (source - Dr. Thomas Graham's Revell Model Kits) is an accurate reproduction of what she looked like at that time.  It probably was based on the plans drawn by Walter B. Channing, which for many years were regarded as the standard source about her.

Sometime after 1968 Mystic decided to change its approach to exhibiting the ship.  I don't know just when this happened, but I think it probably was in either the late seventies or the early eighties.  The concrete "berth" was demolished, and she was hauled out of the water for extensive restoration.  The curators (I have this from one of the staff members, shortly after she went back on exhibition) decided that the best way to restore her was to "bring her back" to a configuration she had when a bunch of photographs of her were taken - I believe in the 1870s or 1880s.  That meant, among other things, changing her to the barque rig and removing the painted ports.  The latter apparently had been added for one of her movie appearances.  It's been firmly established that she never carried them during her whaling career - though many other whalers certainly did.

There's an "updated" set of plans that show her as she looks now - i.e., as she looked when those old photos were taken.  (Caveat - it's a pretty safe bet that when the current restoration is finished, she'll look different in some way.  Researchers are always coming up with new information.)  They're reproduced in the book Mystic Seaport Watercraft, which is available from the Seaport.  (It contains lots and lots of plans - including those of the whaleboats she carries.)  Using the dimensions on those drawings, it shouldn't be too difficult to convert the Revell kit to the barque rig - if that's what the modeler wants to do.  On the other hand, if the kit is built out of the box (ship-rigged, but without the painted ports), the result should be a pretty accurate reproduction of what she looked like in the 1840s and 1850s.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Sunday, August 11, 2013 1:21 AM

Thank you for the run down GM, I have found an used copy of Leavitt's book on Amazon for a little over $5.00.  I am going to wait until I get that and the Mystic Seaport Watercraft by Brey before I make a commitment on how I am going to build the CWM. Although, I know there are certain ideas that I would like to model on her.

Prof Tilley, thank you for your input, it is always appreciated.  I found two books in regards to Mystic Seaport and the CWM.  One is the Mystic Seaport Watercraft by Brey, 1970 edition and Mystic Seaport Museum Watercraft by the Seaport Museum, 1979 edition.  I am assuming that the Brey book is the one you are recommending.

Thanks again gentlemen,

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Sunday, August 11, 2013 1:36 AM

Jake,

Yes, you can airbrush Vallejo acrylics and I use the Vallejo thinner when airbrushing.  They do have an "Air" line of acrylics; however, I have never seen the Yellow Ochre color in that set.  When I am airbrushing acrylics, regardless of brand, I always use my single action Paasche and have a small container of thinner and q-tips handy to help keep the nozzle clear.

Personally, I use the Vallejo paints mainly for brush painting since they lay really nicely and I have yet to see a brush stoke in all the time I have used them, which is about two and a half years.

I pay $6.00 for Floquil Paints in my neck of the woods but they are worth it.  All the black colors were gone this last weekend when I went to stock up, but I did purchase the same colors that you did as well as Roof Brown, Rail Brown, Depot Buff and Aged Concrete.  I am going to miss them when they are gone.

Hope this helps,

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Sunday, August 11, 2013 12:45 PM

Yeah, the edition of the book edited by Maynard Brey is the one I have.  I suspect the 1979 edition contains the same plans.  If I remember right, there's yet another, larger edition that just appeared a few years ago.

[Later edit -

Yep - http://shop.mysticseaport.org/index.cfm?fuseaction=shop.museumProduct&storeNavigationID=1&productID=E1B18B9C-1857-4986-9C9F25446980B06B .]

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Monday, August 12, 2013 11:17 AM

Just bought Bray on Amazon. Thanks all for the tip.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Monday, August 12, 2013 5:48 PM

jtilley

Using the dimensions on those drawings, it shouldn't be too difficult to convert the Revell kit to the barque rig - if that's what the modeler wants to do.  On the other hand, if the kit is built out of the box (ship-rigged, but without the painted ports), the result should be a pretty accurate reproduction of what she looked like in the 1840s and 1850s.

There'd be a couple of things to do. The stern deck houses would have to go. Also the fifth boat (starboard forward). And a bunch of minor details, but a worthy project.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    December 2002
  • From: Connecticut, USA
Posted by Aurora-7 on Wednesday, August 14, 2013 8:01 PM

Just saw her today, across the Mystic River.

The Mrs and I spent the day at Mystic. We're luck we just live a little over an hour from it.

Following you thread with great interest.

 

 

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, August 15, 2013 11:14 AM

Here's a fairly straightforward quote from a rather quaint book in my collection- "The Book of Old Ships (and something of their evolution and romance)" by Henry Culver, drawings by Gordon Grant, Garden City, New York 1924. I apologize, my Turabian escapes me these days.

This is from the chapter titled "A New Bedford Whaling Bark".

"The bark rig was a favourite one with the whaler as it afforded an opportunity to keep all the main braces aloft and thus out of the way of the continually handled boats, while the fore and aft mizzen had conspicuous advantages when it came to lying-to,

Apparently the rig was evolved around the end of the 18th or the beginning of the 19th Century. Darcy Lever (1808) mentions that it was customary for vessels in the Baltic trade to substitute a flagstaff for the mizzen topmast, its top yards and gear, and to omit the cross-jack yard, retaining only the driver, a fore and aft sail, on the mizzenmast. This would leave the vessel substantially bark-rigged. Subsequent development included a more elaborate spar for the flagstaff, one capable of carrying a gaff topsail, and the type was complete".

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 24, 2013 8:14 PM

Thanks for the quote GM it is both nice and informative.  I like the part about the bark rig especially.

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 24, 2013 8:18 PM

As promised last week, here are some pictures with some of the deck furniture dry fitted.  Everything except the windlass is just dry fitted since I am still exploring which time period I can either do or my abilities will let me build.

Steve

       

 

 

  • Member since
    July 2010
  • From: Tempe AZ
Posted by docidle on Saturday, August 24, 2013 8:23 PM

Here are some close ups.  I'm thinking about scratch building a new workbench including the chicken coop underneath it as well as adding the ribbing on the inside of the skylight.  

Steve

       

 

 

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