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Wooden ship modeling is fun!

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  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Lacombe, LA.
Posted by Big Jake on Sunday, January 12, 2014 8:21 PM

Yes they are well out of scale.  I'm hoping to replace them if I can remove them with out damage to the deck. I hope to replace them with a thinner material.

 

 

  • Member since
    June 2012
Posted by arnie60 on Sunday, January 12, 2014 7:40 PM

Beautiful subject. Can't wait to see it renewed. BTW... are those gun swivel tracks in the bow? They seem really out of scale if they are.

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Lacombe, LA.
Posted by Big Jake on Sunday, January 12, 2014 9:45 AM

Yes, I just got the signed contract in the mail Saturday and will start the documenting process today.  I  do extensive pre-restoration photo work up (helps me remember item placement. I've learned the hard way NEVER to touch a model UNTIL I get the signed contract and deposit - got burned one time after a guy ordered something and his wife had a fit he was spend money on this "foolishness" as she told me.  I ate a $50 kit over that.

This model will be a bit of a bear as I'll need to leave the shrouds and ratlines intact and work around them as they are in good condition, but the lower foreyard is snapped and when I remove the yards for cleaning and putting them back on I'll need to use parrel rollers (correct add on) so the shrouds will be in the way.

Removing 60 years worth of dust, grease and grime is always the fun process.

We're also attempting to make corrections to the bow for the ship pas the original modeler did not build her correctly and skipped the "drop bulwarks" for the larger "Paixhens Guns" think Dahlgren type.  IF I can cut into the bulwarks and create the proper effect, we'll be charged with doing this.  This model is going to be on display in a museum BTW.

I might start a thread if allowed by the owners.

Jake

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2005
Posted by philo426 on Saturday, January 11, 2014 10:13 AM

Coming along.   

  • Member since
    March 2005
Posted by philo426 on Tuesday, January 7, 2014 4:25 PM

Jake,can you post a pick of the ship you are about to restore?

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Lacombe, LA.
Posted by Big Jake on Monday, January 6, 2014 9:47 PM

Well, the one thing wood model has over the plastic model is that I can restore a wood model, not so with an old plastic one.  I just received a commission to clean and re-rig the USS Mississippi of 1841, it seemed to be nicely built but them THEN poorly restored by a previous modeler.

I've got to take her down to the shrouds,  clean, re-rig and attempt to make many, many corrections, including the bow drop sides for the Paixhens Guns (from solid bulwarks) :0

 

 

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Monday, January 6, 2014 2:26 PM

I've got a similarly sympathetic wife - at least as far as sailing ships are concerned.  She's not so enamored of twentieth-century warships ("those ugly grey things that are made to kill people.")

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    March 2005
Posted by philo426 on Sunday, January 5, 2014 10:45 PM

Yep!My wife suggested i display both my Sark and my Swift in the living room on shelves!

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Sunday, January 5, 2014 10:48 AM

I have plastic kits that are as large as any of my wood models.  However, my wife considers ships artistic enough that I can display ships upstairs in the family room.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    February 2008
  • From: San Bernardino, CA
Posted by enemeink on Saturday, January 4, 2014 3:37 PM

my only real issue with Wood models is finding a place to put them when complete. my plastic kits haven't been an issue but this Wood kit i'm working on now, i have no idea where to put it once it's complete.

"The race for quality has no finish line, so technically it's more like a death march."
  • Member since
    December 2010
  • From: Salem, Oregon
Posted by 1943Mike on Saturday, January 4, 2014 12:18 AM

I won't get into wood ship modeling for several reasons. Two of the several are: 1) The learning curve (at my age that's important! Big Smile. 2) I don't have the room to do both plastic and wood nor the funds to buy the tools I'd need for wood.

The real reason I'm chiming in is because I remember, as a very, very young boy, 78 rpm records Smile. I DO NOT remember wax cylinders Whistling.

Mike

Mike

"Le temps est un grand maître, mais malheureusement, il tue tous ses élèves."

Hector Berlioz

  • Member since
    September 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Friday, January 3, 2014 11:33 PM

jtilley

Heck - I can even remember 45 rpm records (the ones with the big holes).  Also 10-cent Testor's paint, 29-cent models, nickel cokes, manual typewriters, reel-to-reel tapes, rotary phone dials, and brand new VW Beetles for $2,000 apiece!

Dad took me with him to the VW dealer and he bought a brand new 1963 bug with a fabric sunroof for $ 775.00.

Imagine that.

 Modeling is an excuse to buy books.

 

  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: Formerly Bryan, now Arlington, Texas
Posted by CapnMac82 on Friday, January 3, 2014 11:17 PM

LoL.  After my move, I found an adapter for stacking 45 rpm records on a 33rpm changer spindle.

Not that I own a turntable anymore.  Do have some vinyl LPs, though.

Used both ruling pen and rapidiograph pens as a professional drafter centuries ago (the '80s).

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Friday, January 3, 2014 3:08 PM

Heck - I can even remember 45 rpm records (the ones with the big holes).  Also 10-cent Testor's paint, 29-cent models, nickel cokes, manual typewriters, reel-to-reel tapes, rotary phone dials, and brand new VW Beetles for $2,000 apiece!

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    January 2006
  • From: Sarasota, FL
Posted by RedCorvette on Thursday, January 2, 2014 1:20 PM

jtilley

 

I refuse to categorize one material generally as "better" than another.  Anybody who's seen one of the great (wood) "board room" models from the seventeenth or eighteenth century surely has been blown away.  And the detail on some of the plastic and resin kits available today certainly blows me away. I've made the following point before, and I'll stand by it:  as a practical matter the mold making and casting processes today are capable of producing far finer detail than any modeler can achieve by hand.  (If you don't believe it, take a close look at an LP record.)

 

LOL.  I think you dated both yourself and those of us old enough to know what you're referring to!

Mark

FSM Charter Subscriber

  • Member since
    February 2008
  • From: San Bernardino, CA
Posted by enemeink on Tuesday, December 31, 2013 7:29 PM

jtilley

On second thought it looks more like the Prince de Neufchâtel.  Seems to me MS used to make such a kit.

jtilley, You are correct. This is the Prince de NeufchateI from MS. I think it's been out of production for about the same amount of years I've owned this kit. I think i picked this up the same year they stopped producing it.I used that credit you get for building the Phantom within 6 months and sending in pictures.

And the rake is 10 degrees so it's pretty laid back. I checked it to the plans and about a half dozen times before mounting since it seemed steep.

"The race for quality has no finish line, so technically it's more like a death march."
  • Member since
    February 2003
Posted by Jim Barton on Tuesday, December 31, 2013 12:00 PM

My late father used to build beautiful wooden ship models.

"Whaddya mean 'Who's flying the plane?!' Nobody's flying the plane!"

  • Member since
    June 2004
  • From: 29° 58' N 95° 21' W
Posted by seasick on Monday, December 30, 2013 11:57 PM

I'm interested. Wood is a nice material to work with.

Chasing the ultimate build.

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Monday, December 30, 2013 7:24 PM

On second thought it looks more like the Prince de Neufchâtel.  Seems to me MS used to make such a kit.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Monday, December 30, 2013 7:17 PM

Is it by any chance the Model Shipways Niagara?

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

  • Member since
    June 2012
Posted by arnie60 on Monday, December 30, 2013 7:10 PM

I am curious as to which ship that is. That is one heck of a rake on that foremast!

  • Member since
    February 2008
  • From: San Bernardino, CA
Posted by enemeink on Monday, December 30, 2013 2:26 PM

I actually just enjoy modeling ships wood or plastic. plastic models I feel i spend more time in the details in painting. where as a wood ship it's detailed as I build. So maybe it's all relative. a typical plastic kit will take me around 3 months or so to finish. my wooden Plank on Bulkhead kit's been going for well over 4 years now. mainly because I get overwhelmed and take breaks and work on other things to get away.

So anyway for me, my take away from a plastic kit is the satisfaction in painting and details of the finished product. for my wood kits it's been just the fact that i built this thing out of wood strips and 1:1 prints. But my favorite build has still got to be the Airfix Wasa kit i did about 5 years or so ago.

Here is the ship that is currently hogging the workbench :)

"The race for quality has no finish line, so technically it's more like a death march."
  • Member since
    March 2005
Posted by philo426 on Monday, December 30, 2013 12:31 PM

Yes!Use the material to fit the application.

  • Member since
    December 2012
Posted by rwiederrich on Monday, December 30, 2013 11:59 AM

Interesting discussion.  Personally I use any media at my disposal and regularly in conjunction.

Generally in everyone of my models there will be found....basswood, oak, mahogany, acrylic, polystyrene, steal, copper, brass, stainless-steal, wax, aluminum, paper, fabric, maple, cherry, handmade and pre-fabricated, gypsum, and every kind of adhesives alcohols and paints.

I'll use anything if it can be re-engineered for my purpose.

Rob

  • Member since
    November 2009
  • From: Twin Cities of Minnesota
Posted by Don Stauffer on Monday, December 30, 2013 9:08 AM

jtilley

My own personal approach is to use whatever material I think is best for the particular job at hand.  That little Hancock model contains basswood, boxwood, pearwood, holly, styrene, britannia metal, brass, steel, silk, silkspan tissue, silver/tin solder, nichrome wire, copper wire, and probably a dozen or so other substances that I can't think of - plus walnut, plywood, velvet, and plexiglas for the case.   My personal list of no-no's consists of two materials:  lead (because it's one of the least stable substances on earth) and balsa wood (because I hate it).

Personally, I've always had a little trouble with the idea of building a model of a modern, iron or steel ship out of the wood.  It just doesn't seem quite logical.  But we've all seen magnificent wood models of battleships, liners, and destroyers.  Please don't try to tell me that wood is the "only legitimate" material for a modern steel hull, though.

Amen!  I think  of the wooden plank on frame model of the titanic!.  I did buildt a few balsa kits, because that was the material the kitmaker chose, but I have never built a scratch ship model from balsa.

And I am not locked in on wood, though it has a lot of merit, including cheapness.  I am a multi-media builder when I scratch build, and use plastic and metal (usually brass and/or aluminum) when it is called for (oh, yeah, and I cast resin when I need a bunch of identical parts or fittings).

As far as the expensive foreign plank on bulkhead models, I typically recommend for someone who wants a wood kit to go with Model Shipways, or Midwest, which I find far superior to just about any of the import stuff.

Don Stauffer in Minnesota

  • Member since
    March 2005
Posted by philo426 on Sunday, December 29, 2013 10:51 PM

Please don't misunderstand me,When I started this thread,I extolled the virtues of building wooden ship models.I never denigrated plastic models  and think that wooden ship models are a fun adjunct to not a replacement of plastic as a modeling material.One of the most attractive aspects of scale modeling is the wide variety of subjects techniques and materials,It is never boring and always interesting!.

  • Member since
    March 2012
  • From: Marysville, WA
Posted by David_K on Sunday, December 29, 2013 10:05 PM

Well put, JTilley...

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     )_))_))_)
     _!__!__!_         
     (_D_P_K_)
   ~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    ~~~~~~~~~~~

Current Project:  Imai/ERTL Spanish Galleon #2

Recently Finished: Revell 1/96 Cutty Sark

Next Up:  ???

 

  • Member since
    June 2012
Posted by arnie60 on Sunday, December 29, 2013 9:09 PM

I think, for me at least, the mystique of wood models is that unlike plastic models, practically every single piece has to be constructed out of stock material. To attain the level of detail that I have seen on some wood models is quite a stunning accomplishment and a result of countless hours of work that I can not even begin to imagine doing. One of the reasons I like plastic so much is that I can finish a model relatively quickly. There's just too many ships that I want to build to spend two or three years on one alone.

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Greenville, NC
Posted by jtilley on Sunday, December 29, 2013 5:35 PM

This is, of course, one of the most hotly argued topics in the modeling world.  To my notion there's no definitive answer - except my favorite answer to most modeling questions:  to each his/her own.

Surely the biggest reason for the popularity of wood for models is obvious:  wood's been around longer.  People were building ship models out of wood for (literally) thousands of years before anybody built models of anything out of plastic.  People whose knowledge of model building consists of having seen a few models in a museum naturally take it for granted that ship models are "supposed" to be made out of wood.

I refuse to categorize one material generally as "better" than another.  Anybody who's seen one of the great (wood) "board room" models from the seventeenth or eighteenth century surely has been blown away.  And the detail on some of the plastic and resin kits available today certainly blows me away. I've made the following point before, and I'll stand by it:  as a practical matter the mold making and casting processes today are capable of producing far finer detail than any modeler can achieve by hand.  (If you don't believe it, take a close look at an LP record.)

And I think anybody who's worked much with wood will confirm that it produces a type of satisfaction that's different (notice I didn't say "greater") than a plastic kit can give.  But the same can be said about working from scratch in styrene - or, for that matter, metal.  (I've never scratchbuilt a working steam locomotive, but I imagine the guy who does gets at least as much of a high out of watching it chug around the track as I got when I finished my scratchbuilt Hancock.

What bother me are the people who do contend that "real ship models are made of wood, and plastic ones are fakes."  Those people just don't know much about plastic models.  I'm particularly galled by the people who build those awful HECEPOB (Hideously Expensive Continental European Plank-On-Bulkhead) kits, and think the grossly inaccurate finished products are "better" than a genuine scale model that's made out of plastic.   I once dropped out of a ship modeling web discussion group because it literally banned plastic models.  That strikes me as a great way to shoot oneself in the foot.

My own personal approach is to use whatever material I think is best for the particular job at hand.  That little Hancock model contains basswood, boxwood, pearwood, holly, styrene, britannia metal, brass, steel, silk, silkspan tissue, silver/tin solder, nichrome wire, copper wire, and probably a dozen or so other substances that I can't think of - plus walnut, plywood, velvet, and plexiglas for the case.   My personal list of no-no's consists of two materials:  lead (because it's one of the least stable substances on earth) and balsa wood (because I hate it).

Personally, I've always had a little trouble with the idea of building a model of a modern, iron or steel ship out of the wood.  It just doesn't seem quite logical.  But we've all seen magnificent wood models of battleships, liners, and destroyers.  Please don't try to tell me that wood is the "only legitimate" material for a modern steel hull, though.

It's a great hobby - and, to my notion, more than that:  some ship models rise to the level of art.  But I don't think modeling in general benefits from trying to impose universal value judgments or rules on it.  I repeat - to each his/her own.

Youth, talent, hard work, and enthusiasm are no match for old age and treachery.

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