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Looking to upgrade to a double action

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  • Member since
    November 2005
Looking to upgrade to a double action
Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, November 20, 2005 4:20 PM
Hi,
   It looks like today's posting will be about upgrading from single action to double action. I will try to give you as much info about  the type of modeling I will be doing  and the equipment I use. If I lefted out anything please mention it and I will respond. I just started to airbrush and I am using a Badger 200 with a Thomas Sprayit compressor model 600-13. The compressor still puts out about 40 psi even though it is used and I mostly spray acrylic paints.
  I have been away from the hobby for about 35yrs and I am starting to do model ships in the 1/700 to 1/426 scale range, which the Badger will have no problem with. A few of the ship models will be done in camo and since I want to also start modeling a few aircraft (1/72 and 1/48) and armor (1/35 and 1/48) those will require learning to do camo and more detail. I would like to upgrade to a double action airbrush. I have been going back through this forum and looking at other postings. There are alot of different suggestions. I am leaning toward a Badger airbrush and have chosen the 100LG, 155, 175. I am also considering the Omni 4000G. Now the hard part, picking one. Each paints a fine line, some finer then others.  My questions to you all is:

1) For the type of modeling I am looking to do, I am guessing that any of the above will do the job. Am I correct with my thinking? If not,

2) How fine of detail is needed for armor and aircraft and which of the above would be the better at achieving that? Or,

3) Don't worry and just pick one.

Money really isn't the problem. I really don't want to purchase something now only to realize I should chosen another. I have been practicing on a sacrificial model (1/64 PT 109) and know that practice is needed to improve my technique and results. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks
Mickey

  • Member since
    February 2004
  • From: Canada
Posted by RichardI on Sunday, November 20, 2005 5:14 PM

Mick: going from single action to double action is quite a change. It is a better way of airbrushing IMO, and it will take some practice, but it's worth it. I started out airbrushing with the exact same Badger you have (200NH) and have successfully (I think) made the switch to double action. Much more control once you get onto it.

Now, for you choice of airbrush, I think all those you mention will do the trick. For finer lines I think the 100LG is the best choice, however almost any with a gravity feed will produce a fine line - it's just easier with a finer head assembly. I use Iwata's now and I've never used any of the brushes you list - keep that in mind too.Smile [:)]

Rich Cool [8D]

On the bench: 1/48 Revell PBY Catalina 0A-10A. Next up: Moebius 1/24 Chariot from Lost in Space.

  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, November 20, 2005 8:02 PM
Rich,
  Thanks for the feedback. I have considered an Iwata and see that everyone on the forums are quite satisfied with their performance. With all the different models available (if you consider all the brand names) it was getting confusing and I wanted to try and limit my choices. But, nothing is set in stone yet. I wont make a purchase until I am sure it's the airbrush I want. What model are you using? Thanks.
Mickey

  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: USA
Posted by MusicCity on Sunday, November 20, 2005 8:34 PM
Fine lines are as much in the hand holding the airbrush as they are in the tool itself.

I have a Badger 200, Badger 100G (with all three heads and needles), an Omni 4000 (gravity feed), and an Omni 3000 (siphon feed).  With the same paint thinned exactly the same way the Badger 100 with a medium tip will paint a slightly finer line than the Omnis.  Most of the time I use my Omni 4000 but when I do camouflage I switch to the Badger 100.

Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, November 20, 2005 9:02 PM
 MusicCity wrote:
Fine lines are as much in the hand holding the airbrush as they are in the tool itself.

I have a Badger 200, Badger 100G (with all three heads and needles), an Omni 4000 (gravity feed), and an Omni 3000 (siphon feed).  With the same paint thinned exactly the same way the Badger 100 with a medium tip will paint a slightly finer line than the Omnis.  Most of the time I use my Omni 4000 but when I do camouflage I switch to the Badger 100.


Thanks Scott, I have visited your website and seen your work. Both are excellent. I don't remember if it was you who suggested practicing on milk containers, but I have colored a few of them before trying a practice model. I enjoy the challenge of learning to master the technique. Thanks again.
Mickey
  • Member since
    January 2004
  • From: USA
Posted by MusicCity on Sunday, November 20, 2005 9:34 PM
Thanks Scott, I have visited your website and seen your work. Both are excellent. I don't remember if it was you who suggested practicing on milk containers, but I have colored a few of them before trying a practice model. I enjoy the challenge of learning to master the technique.


I do recommend that technique from time to time, but I didn't invent the idea.  I don't know who came up with it but it is good practice, and better than spraying paper in my opinion.  Plastic just behaves differently from paper and 3-dimensional objects are more difficult to paint on than flat paper.

Glad you liked the web site and models.  Did you happen to notice this image (I don't remember what page it's linked from):


This isn't really indicative of the "Best" that either brush can do but it does compare the Omni 4000 and 100G.  The paint was some dark gray I was spraying on an A-10 the day I got my 100G.  I decided to compare the line widths but the paint was pretty thick to be spraying at low pressure so it is a bit "Fuzzy" on the edges.  You can see that the 100G with exactly the same paint will paint a slightly finer line than the Omni.

Both are great brushes, and either would be a good choice in my opinion.
Scott Craig -- Nashville, TN -- My Website -- My Models Page
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Sunday, November 20, 2005 9:53 PM
 MusicCity wrote:
Thanks Scott, I have visited your website and seen your work. Both are excellent. I don't remember if it was you who suggested practicing on milk containers, but I have colored a few of them before trying a practice model. I enjoy the challenge of learning to master the technique.


I do recommend that technique from time to time, but I didn't invent the idea.  I don't know who came up with it but it is good practice, and better than spraying paper in my opinion.  Plastic just behaves differently from paper and 3-dimensional objects are more difficult to paint on than flat paper.

Glad you liked the web site and models.  Did you happen to notice this image (I don't remember what page it's linked from):


This isn't really indicative of the "Best" that either brush can do but it does compare the Omni 4000 and 100G.  The paint was some dark gray I was spraying on an A-10 the day I got my 100G.  I decided to compare the line widths but the paint was pretty thick to be spraying at low pressure so it is a bit "Fuzzy" on the edges.  You can see that the 100G with exactly the same paint will paint a slightly finer line than the Omni.

Both are great brushes, and either would be a good choice in my opinion.

 Scott, I saw that picture on your site. It was a helpful reference to see how both of those models performed.When I was searching the forums for suggestions, I looked to see if others members might have someting similar to your picture. It helps seeing how the product performs.
Mickey
  • Member since
    November 2005
  • From: NYC
Posted by kp80 on Thursday, November 24, 2005 11:21 AM
I'm a first time airbrush buyer, and bought the IWATA Eclipse BCS, which is a bottom siphon feed double action.  It works really well...great atomization, control, feel, and cleaning is pretty easy.  I don't have much to compare to, but can only relay my experience.  The guy who sold it to me at the store was an airbrush artist who happened to be using an IWATA at the time...he was actually doing an illustration when I approached the counter.  He swore by the IWATA, said he used all the otheres out there as well.  I've gotten great results.  I got the bottom siphon feed because I needed something my wife could use for her craft projects, which require sometimes an ounce or two of paint, and the gravity cup just didn't cut it.
  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: SETX. USA
Posted by tho9900 on Thursday, November 24, 2005 7:36 PM
congrats!  hope you enjoy your new brush and I look forward to pics of some models painted by it!!!
---Tom--- O' brave new world, That has such people in it!
  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: The Hoosier State
Posted by plasticmod992 on Tuesday, November 29, 2005 10:45 PM

Sounds soo familiar..thats how I came to be introduced to Iwatas.  Having owned the BCS, CS, BS and HP-C, I have settled on, and I am having excellent "over-all" results with the Revolution HP-CR.  It is Iwata's very inexpensive, gravity-feed airbrush, introduced a few years ago, marketed towards first-time airbrushers to the experienced artist.  For modeling, the .5mm nozzle/ needle design is VERY friendly to our hobby/ modeling paints, ie..acrylics, laquers, enamels..etc.  This has resulted in excellent atomization, paint flow, and smooth finishes.  I'm still very shoked at what this airbrush can help me achieve for my 1/72nd scale camouflage schemes at it's price point.  Soo far its achieving wide, fine-line, detail, and weathering as good, if not better than any other airbrush I've ever owend.  

Both 1/72nd scale F-15C and F-16C were airbrushed entirely with the Revolution HP-CR.  The camouflage was applied freehand.

 

Greg Williams Owner/ Manager Modern Hobbies LLC Indianapolis, IN. IPMS #44084
  • Member since
    November 2005
Posted by Anonymous on Tuesday, November 29, 2005 11:29 PM
Hey Greg (Plasticmod), I had to chime in and say that's a great pic of your F-15 and F-16.  Is that a backdrop or photoshopped?  Sorry to get OT.

To Mikeyskins many double action brushes have the trigger stopper thing.  This makes the trigger stop where you set it.  This comes in really handy and basically mixes the benefits of both double and single action in one brush.  On the Badgers that have the preset screw it "sets" the trigger already pulled back before spray.  On the iwatas with the preset handle you pull the trigger back before it stops at the "set" point.  I think the iwata design is better than the Badger design because the floway isn't stuck open but they both work.

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: The Hoosier State
Posted by plasticmod992 on Wednesday, November 30, 2005 10:09 PM

Thanks I-beam.  The backdrop is a stock photograph, enlarged.  The only thing photoshoped were adding the sun and erasing the display stands.  Thanks again for the comment!  And just to stay on topic...I concur with I-beam on the "pre-set handle" assessories.  I have one of these and sometimes attach it to my Revolution during critical camo work.  Because I use enamels and tip clogging is not often an issue.  The pre-set handle just serves as insurance against pulling back on the trigger for too much paint volume at such close proximity to the model. 

Italeri's 1/72nd scale A-7E Corsair, VA-46 "Clansmen", Desert Storm 1991

*Painted and weathered entirely with the Iwata Revolution HP-CR

Greg Williams Owner/ Manager Modern Hobbies LLC Indianapolis, IN. IPMS #44084
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