Improve the forum experience - Ditch the post count!

Thinkin of goin to the Austin show, to pick up Manny's awards.

Like I need more models.

Don't get all the good stuff before I can get there, Doogs.

Yeah, and we all know what happens when you don't win...

Reasoned

Need to work on that modesty problem Manny.

Need to work on that modesty problem Manny.

Vendors are the ONLY reason I go to model shows/contests...that, and to pick up all of my first-place awards...

I will be at the Austin show pretty much all day. Planning on bringing a kit or two of my own to collect dust in a new locale for a few hours, even.

If it's like last year, it's a solid little show, but I do feel the SATX show was on a larger scale, at least on the vendor side.

jdice1980

And your work is appreciated. I just find the selection of vendors slightly disappointing. You have a couple of vendors with nice selections in all subjects which are enough for anyone to fill up on kits and that means it is worth going to. However, the other 90% of the tables are guys with ancient kits for ridiculous prices. They have maybe 20 kits or fewer. Then there are all the other tables: posters, photographs, books (which are nice); but very little breadth as far as vendors. But the turnout is nice and the contest draws some nice work.  

I agree with you there. Like I said though, due to the economy and lack of decent LHS (Only two that I find "Decent") we had a hard time getting vendors. We're working harder to get a better show next year.

jdice1980

The Houston model show rather sucks. Only one good vendor and he is my LHS. But it's in town so I go. I really hope the one in Austin is nicer.

If you don't like it then don't come please. As a member of IPMS Houston, we work very hard on the show. But due to the economy and not a lot of LHS here it was rather sparse on the vendors. We do our best to put out a good show.

EdGrune

Wow, how ironic to play the facist card,  coming from someone with your moniker.

It goes to support my position.  When bullies cannot argue the facts they resort to name calling.   Same as eight year olds on the playground.

Just sayin'

FSM,  put an end to this pattern of cyber bullying!

Ummm, Hey... Ed?

Manny didn't call you ANYTHING... He told ya the name of a thread...

So "resorting to name-calling" didn't HAPPEN...

Now, for the LAST TIME..

KNOCK IT OFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Monday could get ugly when Aaron returns.

After all the BS on the forum right now, I say the best way to improve the forum experience is keep the counts and ditch the posts!

This is pathetic! You are all acting like spoiled brat kids. I'm hoping the upcoming bans will be as wide spread as they should be swift and unmerciful.

jdice1980

EdGrune:

What wer'e seeing here is cyber bullying in action.

Someone dared to speak up against the legend in their own mind clique.   Now the sycophantic lackies are demanding the poster come forward so they can harrass and ridicule him.   The OP's argument was self explanatory.    He doesn't need to present himself and justify himself

Stop cyber bullying.   

FSM has lost control of the playground.  This vile pollution is spreading across the whole of their site.  Its time that they step in and reassert themselves.   Establish and enforce rules of behavior, swift and effective!.   FSM's reputation is being further diminished  with each of these bully attacks.

 

They want me they can have me. I am right here in Houston area every day. I will be at the Austin model show for anyone who wants a face to face chat, or you can email me at jdice19800@hotmail.com to set up an appointment.

EdGrune

Wow, how ironic to play the facist card,  coming from someone with your moniker.

It goes to support my position.  When bullies cannot argue the facts they resort to name calling.   Same as eight year olds on the playground.

Just sayin'

FSM,  put an end to this pattern of cyber bullying!

 

 

First they came for the Communists but I was not a Communist so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Socialists and the Trade Unionists but I was not one of them, so I did not speak out. Then they came for the Jews but I was not Jewish so I did not speak out. And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak out for me.   

Martin Niemoeller

 

Name calling???  Huh---where?  Fascist is in the NAME of his thread....wow...FSM, I think I'm being bullied by EdGrune here...put an end to it...

Wow, how ironic to play the facist card,  coming from someone with your moniker.

It goes to support my position.  When bullies cannot argue the facts they resort to name calling.   Same as eight year olds on the playground.

Just sayin'

FSM,  put an end to this pattern of cyber bullying!

EdGrune

Stop cyber bullying.   

Yep, I agree.  Look no further than the "END FORUM FASCISM" thread for proof...An admitted troll goes on a rampage...I notice you didn't drop your "copy and paste" remark in that thread, yet... 

Stop cyber bullying.   

EdGrune

Stop cyber bullying.   

FSM has lost control of the playground.  

Yep, I agree.  Look no further than the "END FORUM FASCISM" thread for proof...An admitted troll goes on a rampage...

What wer'e seeing here is cyber bullying in action.

Someone dared to speak up against the legend in their own mind clique.   Now the sycophantic lackies are demanding the poster come forward so they can harrass and ridicule him.   The OP's argument was self explanatory.    He doesn't need to present himself and justify himself

Stop cyber bullying.   

FSM has lost control of the playground.  This vile pollution is spreading across the whole of their site.  Its time that they step in and reassert themselves.   Establish and enforce rules of behavior, swift and effective!.   FSM's reputation is being further diminished  with each of these bully attacks.

Manstein's revenge

 

the doog:

 

 

On the last point, Manny--fair enough; I have edited my previous post. I didn't think of it at the time, and my frustration with this whole issue has compelled me to reference some things that should remain unspoken, as I myself have spoken out against people who have divulged PMs in public. I regret my error and vow to never cross that line again. Thank you for pointing it out.

 

 

Water under the bridge, doog...thanks.

 

As far as where the "voting" stands on the question at hand, this is how I talley it thus far:

23 keep the post counts...

4 get rid of...

and...

10 indifferent to lukewarm in keeping em...

And I still stand on keeping them.

the doog

On the last point, Manny--fair enough; I have edited my previous post. I didn't think of it at the time, and my frustration with this whole issue has compelled me to reference some things that should remain unspoken, as I myself have spoken out against people who have divulged PMs in public. I regret my error and vow to never cross that line again. Thank you for pointing it out.

As far as where the "voting" stands on the question at hand, this is how I talley it thus far:

23 keep the post counts...

4 get rid of...

and...

10 indifferent to lukewarm in keeping em...

Manstein's revenge

 

There you go again trying to read my mind...not a tactic at all to divert, but actually the heart of this whole debate...the "drivel" is taking place is threads that EVERYONE knows are "drivel"...if someone doesn't like "drivel" they can avoid those threads (wow, that was simple)...this thread implies that the entire Forum and serious threads are being destroyed by "drivel" hijacking and that simply isn't true...period. And you know it. 

Do I think that sometimes it gets a little over the top?  Sometimes.  What do I do when that happens?  I ignore it or call someone out on it.  Simple.  I don't make an entire week's worth of debate and several threads out of it...

...last point, your frequent habit of referring to PM's in your posts is in poor taste...if I receive or send a PM it remains private because I respect and understand what "private" means...I've seen you reference many PM's in many of your posts with numerous members and while you have never (as far as I know) outright divulged the content, you are skirting a fine line by your veiled implications...not  cool...

What was referencing here about "diverting" the thread was addressing the question of "banning non-serious threads"; honestly, I can't even consider that as a question. Never have I EVER said that we should be an "Ebenezer Scrooge"-like forum. But there is a bullying, clique-like mentality that is starting to take place here, and a sneering indifference to what has been called out by SEVERAL members as being an annoyance in other threads. There are posts being made in "serious" threads that are like a class clown calling out something stupid just to get a laugh and then quoted and commented on by the rest of the clique. It's sincerely annoying already. Manny, do you think I"m making it up? I'm not the only one noticing it, nor mentioning it, or getting annoyed by having to muck through post after post of quoted stupidity compounded by more stupidity. Why is it so hard for some people here to just knock it off already?And if you're not "making an entire weeks' post" out of it, maybe its because you're part of the problem that refuses to recognize it?

I don't post in your "Three word posts" or "one word posts" thread or any one that your "crowd" clearly has set up for that kind of play. But it says a lot about some people that this issue has been discussed and beaten to death, and they won't just grow up a little and let it go. Just look at some of the ridiculing that's going on--like, "It's not OUR fault?!?" Sheesh. Come on already!

the doog

Manny, I"m sorry, but you're good at diverting the thread and skirting the issue. I'm also keen to that tactic of asking for specific examples and then trying to debate the merit of ONE isolated example and while avoiding the larger, glaring issue. Sorry, but I"m not going to play that game.

Your previous history here as a witty poster was always balanced by the depth of respect that your modeling skills and posts commanded. You should think about that.

The issue is not "banning non-modeling threads". The issue here is the issue of posts being inundated with inane drivel, and the way that its been getting out of hand. Several people have commented on it, it was brought to a boil, the issue was discussed, even the moderator agreed upon it, and tentative, if vague, solutions were proffered and accepted. Now, you and several others here have made it your agenda to keep the issue alive by ridiculing the core issue, which was the loading of posts with pointless repetitive drivel. I mean, seriously--do we have any one out there willing to show a little maturity and step up and say "OK, I agree; it's gotten out of hand, and I will at least try to keep that in mind when posting"?

I don't remember who it was, but there was also this one poster who, when I PM'ed them to discretely discuss the matter in private (rather then start a flame war), even he admitted that it had gotten out of hand and kinda annoyed HIM when he was trying to get a serious answer, I wish I could remember who that was? I probably wouldn't even recognize him at this point?

Do I think that sometimes it gets a little over the top?  Sometimes.  What do I do when that happens?  I ignore it or call someone out on it.  Simple.  I don't make an entire week's worth of debate and several threads out of it...

...last point, your frequent habit of referring to PM's in your posts is in poor taste...if I receive or send a PM it remains private because I respect and understand what "private" means...I've seen you reference many PM's in many of your posts with numerous members and while you have never (as far as I know) outright divulged the content, you are skirting a fine line by your veiled implications...not  cool...  

Manny, I"m sorry, but you're good at diverting the thread and skirting the issue. I'm also keen to that tactic of asking for specific examples and then trying to debate the merit of ONE isolated example and while avoiding the larger, glaring issue. Sorry, but I"m not going to play that game.

Your previous history here as a witty poster was always balanced by the depth of respect that your modeling skills and posts commanded. You should think about that.

The issue is not "banning non-modeling threads". The issue here is the issue of posts being inundated with inane drivel, and the way that its been getting out of hand. Several people have commented on it, it was brought to a boil, the issue was discussed, even the moderator agreed upon it, and tentative, if vague, solutions were proffered and accepted. Now, you and several others here have made it your agenda to keep the issue alive by ridiculing the core issue, which was the loading of posts with pointless repetitive drivel. I mean, seriously--do we have any one out there willing to show a little maturity and step up and say "OK, I agree; it's gotten out of hand, and I will at least try to keep that in mind when posting"?

I think DoogsATX nailed pretty well. Going to have to agree with Manny for the most part on the "it just doesn't happen" part as well. I won't say it's never happened but the instances where it might have are way few and far between. Honestly I can't say I've seen any abuse in the WIPs GB or "serious model threads. Of course, I've not read the tens of thousands of posts either. WIPs and or "serious" model threads or any thread for that matter, belong to the original poster. If they take offense with whats going on in their thread it's for them to say something in the thread or take it to Aaron. If the thread is a discussion type topic where someone asks for opinions, kinda like this one, it's for not only the original poster to speak up or for Aaron to as well if he feels it's going south. It's his house after all. Just my .

DoogsATX

the doog:

The sad thing is that on this forum, there seems to be a genuine "rush" to boost post counts by some members who post the most trivial, useless material--whether intentionally or not, in the spirit of "socializing" or not.. Honestly, sometimes it seems as if they just can't help themselves, even after being made aware of it.  In this case, the potential and possibility of post counts meaning anything at all is greatly diminished by "one word posts" or "three word posts". It's quality over quantity, period.

 

Okay, serious question.

Do you think those members are posting that material to boost their post counts? Or out of socializing and enthusiasm for an inside joke?

I see them as two completely different things. One is that there are actually members out there thinking "need to get to 2,000, need to get to 2,000, need to get to 2,000" and letting that drive their posting behavior. 

The other is that the frequency of those quick-fire joke thread posts is clouding the post count. Kind of the way a batter can gin up a .400 batting average, but 75% of his on-bases are bunts.

The first, I think, is misattributing motives and is honestly something I have not witnessed anywhere on this forum. The second is more of a statistics debate about the "purity" of those numbers. To which I would say "so?" - it's not like the numbers actually mean anything beyond just a very broad indicator anyway. Broad enough that the two main use cases - identifying new members and identifying veterans - aren't really impacted at all.

I would also add that I was a prodigious poster when I was a newbie...nothings changed...in fact I probably posted even more back then and many of those posts were "controversial" to say the least...

I once asked someone to point out a WIP or "serious" model thread that was taken over by a bunch of one-word/three-word/inside joke posts and that member could not/would not cite one.  That's because it just doesn't happen...So IMO this arguemnt is really about "non-serious" threads, not modeling threads being taken over or hijacked by other people.  So is the question really is this:  Should we ban non-modeling threads?

Manstein's revenge

You know, if I wanted to give someone the middle finger, I'd just do it...or cuss them if I felt inclined...I get a little tired of some folks who feel that they can get in my head and assign a specific motive to everything I post.  If you want to play Dr. Phil, why don't you call out a certain female member who seems to have a problem with men and climb into her head...is she giving all the males in here the finger? 

I find some humor in this whole proposition of removing the post count.  If you don't see the lighter side of this whole debate then fine. There are many more than just me who feel this issue is a lot to do about nothing and have said as much, and I'm not talking about those some would term as "229'rs"...

 

tt should be obvious that there are ALSO many in these forums who don't share your..."unique" sense of humor about posting gratuitous, nonsensical crap in threads, and--lacking a clear understanding of any reasonable motive at all have attributed this annoying behavior to simply wanting to increase the post count---a reasonable enough assumption in light of your incessant, nonstop, repetitive actions. Maybe you feel that some things should be above criticism?

THIS was and IS the issue--not some drive-by, whimsical comment from a woman.

I fail to see the humor in NOT being considerate of other people's concerns and legitimate complaints. Your near-continual references now to "increasing your post count" seems to me to infer that you feel you're above criticism or self-correction. Knock it off already.

T remind you that this has been brought up by several members, and agree upon by the moderator here. It has been handled in a mostly respectful manner with opinions being sincerely offered. What more do you want? Seriously?

You know, if I wanted to give someone the middle finger, I'd just do it...or cuss them if I felt inclined...I get a little tired of some folks who feel that they can get in my head and assign a specific motive to everything I post.  If you want to play Dr. Phil, why don't you call out a certain female member who seems to have a problem with men and climb into her head...is she giving all the males in here the finger? 

I find some humor in this whole proposition of removing the post count.  If you don't see the lighter side of this whole debate then fine. There are many more than just me who feel this issue is a lot to do about nothing and have said as much, and I'm not talking about those some would term as "229'rs"...

Hans von Hammer

 

I wonder how much of an issue it really was,the original poster still has not replied since the initial post.

 

It's one form of a "Troll Post"... However, it has nothing to do with the mythical creature that lives under bridges, devouring billy-goats, or the furry-headed things found on some co-worker's desks..

It's "trolling" as in the fishing venue... One starts a thread that is of a controversial, inflammatory, or devisive nature, one that one thinks may cause the other members to "take the bait" and then he or she sits back and watches the "fun"...  This doesn't make the OP a "troll" in the classic sense, sometimes it's even accidental...   Sometimes, it's simply that the OP hasn't returned yet, but will show up on the next day...  Other times, it's so controversial that the OP genuinely wishes he hadn't done it, and simply pops smoke and skies out.. 

But my experience leads me to believe that this one was deliberate and intended to stir up some trouble, with what was a rather useless (IMNSHO) gripe about something that actually causes no harm to the forum or its membership..

If there's any "trolling" behavior, it's the bullying, baiting garbage that's being posted by Spruce-ce Goose and Manny. In fact, what you've described is exactly what Spruce-ce is doing. It's been a long time since I've seen such blatantly juvenile behavior from someone who had agreed in a previous looooong-winded thread to agree to have some discretion and restraint in posting.

mfsob had a legitimate issue that was shared by myself, Jester, Ed Grune, usmx71, and other who have wished to not be named precisely because of the immature bullying that they have come to expect from this crowd here.It's plain to see that apparently there are people here who feel only a sneering contempt for any self-correction and are hypocritical about wanting to promote any forum unity or harmony. All of the "increasing my post count" comments are just like the rhetorical equivalent of throwing up the middle finger and sneering at the whole issue. I REMIND YOU that the moderator here, Aaron, even agreed that it was getting out of hand and out of control. Some set of cajones you guys have, to be rubbing it in his face?

It's a dam'ned shame that someone can make a legitimate complaint and seek a behavior that was annoying to MANY forum members, and when they try to resolve it by making a thread about it, they are bullied and ridiculed. Nice, guys. Nice to see such adult attitudes and maturity from you.

Any of you guys building models? Here's a suggestion- go start some "Facebook" page where you can yuk-yuk it up and increase your post counts with inane, pointless crap in your echo chamber. Either that or how about growing up and respecting the right of others' opinions about YOUR behavior--ESPECIALLY when it is shared by MANY?

Jester75

And when he is ready to reply to the thread, he will.

Fine.

Forum members can wait.

Happy to read from your post that mfsob has not lost interest.

BTW.....if you re-read my posts, I merely commented on mfsob's lack of replies.