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HALLOWED PLACES

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  • Member since
    August 2008
HALLOWED PLACES
Posted by tankerbuilder on Sunday, January 20, 2013 6:39 AM

Hello ;

  What do you think of when you go to ,say GETTYSBURG , Or the ARIZONA ?  I went to the ALAMO yesterday .Although living in ARKANSAS (my home for many years ) and TEXAS too . I never got to go there .Till yesterday as I've said .Yes , there is commercialism around this HALLOWED ground , but , it seemed to be subdued and polite .Now walk in .

     The history and meaning ,hit you , if you have any real feeling about AMERICAN history , like a ton of bricks .Here's a place ,where the few were defeated by the many . Why ? their belief in freedom and self determination . This is one of the AMERICAN icons to the fight for the right to be free .

   Oh, you might say , How does this relate to model building ? It does . When you build that plane , tank or ship , you are  ,in a way , participating in history. The miniaturist who chooses figures could tell you probably better than me .This hobby , to us , makes part of history come alive .I suggest ,if there is a museum or HALLOWED ground you can get to, do visit .

     The experience , if you are serious , will definitely move you and increase your value of history and the part your models take in telling the story . This is something we should ALL remember. Ther are many who have gone before, some in battle , some peacefully , but their aim was simple . FREEDOM for this great land of ours . Sure we do and still are making mistakes , but , I am guaranteed the right to sit down , fire up the stereo and build models . A thank you is in order , once in a while . Have you said yours lately ?       Tanker-builder

  • Member since
    November 2003
  • From: Nashville, TN area
Posted by bobbaily on Sunday, January 20, 2013 6:09 PM

Well said Tanker-builder.

I had the good fortune to tour the Alamo a many years ago and it is a unique feeling being there.  And I have to say that I've had similar feelings when touring the USS North Carolina and a couple of B-17's & a B-24....you just feel the history all around you.

bob

 

  • Member since
    July 2011
  • From: Pittsfield, IL USA
Posted by novembergray on Sunday, January 20, 2013 9:04 PM

I don't think we have any of those around here. We're too far west for the Revolution, too far north for the Civil War and too far east for the Indian Wars. The best we can do is the boyhood home of Mark Twain and they even put that on the other side of the river.

Joe

It's not about how fast you get there or even where you're going. It's whether you enjoy the ride.

  • Member since
    March 2009
  • From: Yorkville, IL
Posted by wolfhammer1 on Sunday, February 10, 2013 11:37 PM

There are  a surprising number of historical museums around, if you just look for them.  For example, there is a little museum in the town next to mine that has some memorabilia from all of the wars since the Civil War.  Its not much, but there is a connection to the history.  One of the native sons turns out was killed ove rthe Med in a B-26.  A small town called Bolingbrook IL has a fairly extensive air museum, and hosts a small airshow every summer.  While none of this stuff is of the caliber of the Arizona, lets say, it can still be very educational, moving and inspiring.  The other thing is to watch your local library or other public place.  A few years ago, I got to meet a Tuskeegee airman at the local library during Black History Month.  That was an incredible experince to hear him speak and shake his hand.  I am guessing you live in Illinois.  Have you visited Chanute, near Champaign?  Turns out, the Tuskeegee Airmen were based there for a short while.  St. Louis has its Science Center, which has a dispaly from McDonnell Douglas in it.  A few hours west is the SAC museum in Nebraska.  A few hours east is the Air Force Museum in Dayton.  If you can get creative, there are plenty of opportunities to get `in touch with history.  Give it a shot

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Copley, Ohio
Posted by wayne baker on Tuesday, February 12, 2013 11:09 PM

Been to Pearl Harbor a couple of times, and am going again in two weeks.  It gives you pause to stand on the monument, see all of the names and watch that little bit of oil rise to the surface as the Navy did after the attack.  I've been to several of the battlefields also.

 I may get so drunk, I have to crawl home. But dammit, I'll crawl like a Marine.

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Thursday, February 14, 2013 6:42 PM

Well, I can tell you that, having been around the world,  know what you're saying, tankerbuilder about being somewhere and feeling that evocative feeling of standing on "hallowed ground". I've been to some of the great battlefields of Europe, and the feeling of standing, say, between the Brandenburg Gate and the old Reichstag building was humbling, to say the least.

The same feeling of awe hit me when I stood on Red Square in Moscow, and imagined it during the 1940's. I've been to Cologne, numerous times, and there's still a church there which is left burned out and bombed out, and of course, the Dom itself was in the very heart of the fight. I've stood where that Panther was burned out and reflected on the death around me more than half a century ago.

I've walked on numerous German and Dutch battlefields and ruminated heavily on the conflict, the death, the ideology and the legacies of those times.

I've been to many, many castles where evidence of the battles was still evident, and I've walked the Walls of Constantinople and saw the hole in the dungeon floor which emptied out into the Sea of Bosphorus in Istanbul where they threw the head of Sultan Osman II after he was taken prisoner and tortured. I've also stood on the battlefield where the "300" resisted the Persians in the Battle of Thermopylae in Greece.

The ironic thing is, I have been to very few American battlefields or areas of conflict. The only thing that I can think of that really hit me hard was the Vietnam Veteran's memorial in Washington DC, and I"m not ashamed to say that I cried. SO many names, so many young kids who gave their lives. I built my M48 Patton here and dedicated it to the veterans--many of whom helped me with details of that build here on the forums.

  • Member since
    November 2003
  • From: State of Mississippi. State motto: Virtute et armis (By valor and arms)
Posted by mississippivol on Thursday, February 14, 2013 9:38 PM

I live some ways from the Shiloh Civil War battlefield, and have gone there a couple of times, especially for the 150th anniversary, where we took a guided tour. It really made what I read about it make sense, there's nothing like being at the point where the battle began and visualizing what it might have looked like on that morning.

There's also the World War II museum in Halls, TN, just south of Dyersburg, where there was a Flying Fortress training base during the war. I didn't know that Nathan Bedford Forrest III was the commanding general there at one point. Just as quickly as that base sprung up in the middle of cotton fields, it was gone. It was ignored until the 1990's, as a matter of fact, it was used as an impromptu drag strip in the 60s.

Then there's downtown Jackson, TN where Davey Crockett told them that they could go...well, now...,  but he was going to Texas...and the Alamo.

South of Jackson, in Pinson are the old indian burial grounds from way before the colonization of North America.

Fort Donelson and Fort Henry up on the Tennessee and Cumberland rivers, Casey Jones' home, Parker's crossroads in Lexington are a few more places.

History is closer sometimes than we think.

Glenn

  • Member since
    July 2008
  • From: Vancouver, the "wet coast"
Posted by castelnuovo on Thursday, February 14, 2013 10:15 PM

I have traveled a lot in ex Yugoslavia and visited quite a few battlefields there. The monument at Sutjeska river is very impressive, the distroyed bridge at Neretva river is still there, the Kozara mountain, the city of Kragujevac where the Germans shot thousands of schoolchildren, the Jasenovac concentration camp and numerous other battle sites.

In many of the museums, I saw guns and leftover uniforms. I couldn't help but wander how many people were killed by this or that gun and what happened to its owner.

I also met quite a few old partisans. It was almost surreal to listen to them and stand on the hills and fields while they were telling me that they were here and Germans were advancing from there...Who was killed at the very place where I was standing?

I also went scuba diving to see a Spitfire shot down by German AA crew. The pilot baild safely and was taken POW.

Several years ago I traveled through Croatia and visited some battlefields from the war for independence. I was speachless...especially as I was there during the war, just 20 years younger...

  • Member since
    September 2004
  • From: Denver
Posted by tankboy51 on Friday, February 15, 2013 5:21 PM

"In great deeds, something abides.   On great fields something stays.  Forms change and pass: bodies disappear: but spirits linger, to consecrate ground for the vision place of souls and reverent men and women from afar, and generations who know us not. and that we know not of, heart drawn to see where and by whom great things were suffered and done for them, shall come to this deathless field, to ponder and dream: and lo! the shadow of a mighty presence shall wrap them in it's bosom and the power of the vision pass into their souls".

General Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain. Gettysburg. Oct. 3 1889

  • Member since
    August 2008
Posted by tankerbuilder on Wednesday, February 27, 2013 8:08 AM

TANKBOY 51

That is a thought that about covers what I was saying .I went to the HORNET as she  began her career as a museum .You could sit in the pilot's " ready room " and feel the tension palpably .Then in pri-fly you could feel the excitement of plane-ops .There is history where we find it .I had a friend that stopped and read every roadside plaque he found .

 Now , I belong to the docent staff of the NEW BRAUNFELS ,TEXAS, RAILROAD MUSEUM . Even there , you can feel the spirit of those who rode and worked the rails. It is indeed humbling .       Tanker-builder

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Washington, DC
Posted by TomZ2 on Monday, March 4, 2013 2:09 PM


I thought you said "hollowed"?

Occasional factual, grammatical, or spelling variations are inherent to this thesis and should not be considered as defects, as they enhance the individuality and character of this document.

  • Member since
    June 2007
  • From: Germantown, Wisc.
Posted by Hartmann352 on Monday, March 4, 2013 4:48 PM

Good topic.

Was fortunate to visit the Alamo last year. Was unable to enjoy it properly and take it all in, had family in tow. (Wife, a 14y.o. and an 8 y.o.)

Few days later though was on the USS Lexington down in Corpus Christie.  I think they got more out of that, but not the same as I. Being a Navy vet and served on a CV and a CVN....standing and reading about where a japanses Long Lance torpedo hit the ship, and looking at Long Lance that they have on display right there.

I can only do so much with my minds eye....there will always be just some stuff that we will never truly know.

(Want to get to the Udvar-Hazy Museum and the USAF musem in Dayton...and God willing, out to Pearl.)

Cheers,

Dave

"Yesterday is history, Tomorrow a mystery, but Today is a gift. That is why it is called the "present".

 

 

  • Member since
    June 2007
  • From: Germantown, Wisc.
Posted by Hartmann352 on Monday, March 4, 2013 4:51 PM

Oh, and have been to Gettysburg twice -- once for 8th grade graduation trip, and the second time for OCS....much better appreciation for it the second time around.

Took the family up to the USS Cobia in Manitowoc, WI too. (Cramped!)

"Yesterday is history, Tomorrow a mystery, but Today is a gift. That is why it is called the "present".

 

 

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Monday, March 4, 2013 4:56 PM

Hartmann352

Good topic.

 

Few days later though was on the USS Lexington down in Corpus Christie.  I think they got more out of that, but not the same as I. Being a Navy vet and served on a CV and a CVN....standing and reading about where a japanses Long Lance torpedo hit the ship, and looking at Long Lance that they have on display right there.

Cheers,

Dave

I would like to get down to Corpus Christi to see the ol' Lexington. She was my last ship before getting out of the Navy. I used to drive her, hence my avatar.

Lee

p.s.  There is a brass plate located on the overhead in the flag bridge that is inscribed "On this spot, on June 19, 1944, Admiral Marc Mitscher gave the order to 'Turn on the lights'." Lex was his flagship during the Battle of the Philippine Sea, or the "Great Marianas Turkey Shoot" as it is also known.

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
    March 2009
  • From: Yorkville, IL
Posted by wolfhammer1 on Monday, March 4, 2013 10:29 PM

Another place to go is the PIMA museum in Arizona, and if you get down to Tuscon, check out the Titan missile museum.  You actually go down into a bunker where the crew sat with their fingers on the trigger.  When I was there, a young boy about 12 sat in the commander's seat and turned the key to 'launch' the missile.  Very interesting.  

  • Member since
    January 2009
Posted by F-8fanatic on Tuesday, March 5, 2013 12:11 AM

I always seem to end up in one of two places when it comes to things like this--air museums/air shows, and US Navy ship museums.  Grew up in CT, so of course I've been on the Nautilus.  Battlehip Cove in MA, USS Alabama, USS Lexington, USS Kidd(WWII destroyer in Louisiana, where I live now).  Been on USS Razorback--a Balao-class sub in Arkansas.  Been on USS Drum, a Gato-class sub, in Mobile Bay.

I know the feeling that some of you mentioned....the Kidd was struck by a Kamikaze and several of her crew died.  Today, you can stand at the exact spot where she was hit.  But one of the most amazing experiences for me was a flight in a B-17.....there's something about sitting behind those guns that just seems so surreal.  At the time I took the flight, I was 20...about the same age as many gunners from WWII.  

Wright Patterson is an awesome museum, as is the USN museum in Pensacola, FL.  Well worth the trip.  You will see things at both of these museums that you simply will not see anywhere else in the world.  Looking forward to my next trip to DC, as I have never yet made it to the Smithsonian.  

  • Member since
    January 2009
Posted by F-8fanatic on Tuesday, March 5, 2013 12:22 AM

Also, want to mention this--if any of you get the chance, the National WWII Museum in New Orleans is 100% first rate.  Something really cool is going on over there-they are restoring an actual PT boat, PT-305.  305 is an actual combat veteran, having sunk two German ships in the Med.  Really looking forward to seeing this one finished.  

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Tuesday, March 5, 2013 12:09 PM

I've been to a lot of historical sites and museums around the world in my lifetime, but the National Air and Space Museum in Washington D.C. and its annex at Dulles never fail to blow me away. The Milestones of Flight Gallery alone contains the Spirit of St Louis, Glamorous Glennis, Apollo 11, Friendship Seven, Gemini IV, and the original Wright Flyer among others. That is just in one room. Well worth a visit at least once in your lifetime.

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Green Bay, WI USA
Posted by echolmberg on Tuesday, March 5, 2013 2:02 PM

I loved it when I lived in Alexandria, VA.  I was just moments away from a nearly endless list of hallowed locations.  You couldn't step out of your house without running into one.

I live in Green Bay now.  Not too many hallowed and sacred locations here except for one.  Everyone say it with me....

LAMBEAU FIELD!!!!  It's humbling to walk on the same field where the Ice Bowl was played and where Vince Lombardi walked.

Eric

  • Member since
    March 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Tuesday, March 5, 2013 2:59 PM

I have been to Gettysburg,The New Jersey,The Intrepid,not too many spots,but would really love to go to Normandy some day.

  • Member since
    February 2003
  • From: Copley, Ohio
Posted by wayne baker on Monday, March 11, 2013 11:19 PM

Was at the Arizona two weeks ago.  We were sad and disappointed.  People acted like they were at some tourist trap or amusement park, letting kids run wild, rather than at a memorial or cemetery

smg.photobucket.com/.../Vacataion%202013.

 I may get so drunk, I have to crawl home. But dammit, I'll crawl like a Marine.

  • Member since
    March 2009
  • From: Yorkville, IL
Posted by wolfhammer1 on Tuesday, March 12, 2013 11:38 PM

That is a real shame.  I have visited the Arizona, and had the good fortune to be on the first tour of the morning.  What an impact entering the memorial with no one else there.  If anyone is going, try to get ther early if at all possible.  It is worth it.

  • Member since
    March 2004
  • From: Spartanburg, SC
Posted by subfixer on Wednesday, March 13, 2013 10:10 AM

I agree with wolfhammer, go early. But it is still hit or miss with the tours, though. Some people just have no class at all. Like going to the movies, sometimes you just have to deal with the anal orifices.

I'm from the government and I'm here to help.

  • Member since
    July 2012
  • From: Douglas AZ
Posted by littletimmy on Wednesday, March 13, 2013 11:28 AM

As a kid ( I think I was 10 ) I visited the USS Missouri while she was docked in Bremerton WA.  I remember standing silently over the plaque on the deck where the Japanese signed the surrender. Now that I,m older I still wonder what it was like to be onboard while she was fireing those   " mighty" guns.

 Dont worry about the thumbprint, paint it Rust , and call it "Battle Damage".

  

 

    

  • Member since
    March 2009
  • From: Yorkville, IL
Posted by wolfhammer1 on Monday, March 18, 2013 12:04 AM

I remeber visiting the Alabama when I was about 10,and being amazed that the shell was bigger than I was.  I cannot imaging what it must have been like when all 9 went off at once.  I have had the honor to see 3 of the 4 remaining battleship classes that are museums, the only one I have not seen is the Texas. Those ships are amazing.  While I cannot recommend the movie for its story or its realism, the movie Battleship has some truly entertaining scenes and the song Thinderstruck by AC/DC at a really appropriate time.  In addition, they used some real vets in the movie, which adds something to it.  

  • Member since
    August 2008
Posted by tankerbuilder on Tuesday, March 26, 2013 10:01 AM

I was reading all your comments and was touched .

    I forgot to mention that I did get to see the memorial in HIROSHIMA and the ARIZONA within weeks of each other .OH BOY  ! what an emotional impact that was .OH , and at the ARIZONA there was a group of older JAPANESE fellows and their wives .They bowed and held place for a full minute BEFORE straightening up .I asked one of them (their english was surprisingly good ! ) why they bowed that way (I knew the meaning of it ) He explained that they did so to HONOR and SHOW RESPECT for those who died here !

     I too stood near the plaque on the " MIGHTY MO " in BREMERTON .She was listing slightly and sitting in the mud (it was low tide ) That made me angry and then I was only 18 ! There are so many places and so many stories . I was at an ALAMO SQUADRON / I.P.M.S. show where a TUSKEGEE PILOT was present . His eyes got moist talking about the BOMBERS he escorted there and back . This is what " HALLOWED GROUND " Means to me  And always will , Thank You All for sharing  , and I look forward to more . OH, Yes  !  I CRIED  too , at the VIET NAM VETERANS MEMORIAL .

  • Member since
    March 2009
  • From: brisbane australia
Posted by surfsup on Monday, May 27, 2013 6:28 AM

For me it was going to the Australian War Memorial in Canberra. To stand next to a Lancaster and realise how big they were. Seeing a Japanese Midget Sub up close and they call them Midgets. They are bigger than you think. The Red Barons Flying Boots and Control Column of his Aircraft when he was Killed. The feared German 88 and a 109G plus a 262 and a 163. Saburo Sakai's Zero. The most Haunting area was the Medal Hall. Approx 90/95 % of all Australian Victoria Crosses are there. The most saddest display Item would be the shot up Carley Float from HMAS Sydney sunk Nov 19 1941with all 653 Hands.

If i was your wife, i'd poison your tea! If Iwas your husband, I would drink it! WINSTON CHURCHILL

  • Member since
    June 2008
  • From: Piscataway,NJ
Posted by jtrace214 on Monday, May 27, 2013 7:28 AM

Being from a very old town (1666) there is alot around here.Just 10 minutes away is Washington rock where General Washington watched the British troops around New Brunswick,the USS New Jersey is about an hour away and a good museum. Monmouth Battlefield is nearby and the large battlefields in Pa are nearby,I have been to them all and are very humbling....

John

the pic to the left is my weekend condo lol

  • Member since
    November 2003
  • From: Naples, FL
Posted by tempestjohnny on Monday, May 27, 2013 9:28 AM

I'm in central Ct. Very close is battleship cove. New London Groton boat yards. New England Air Museum. Going to DC with my sons boy scout troop end of June. Can't wait. John

 

AT6
  • Member since
    December 2005
  • From: Fresno
Posted by AT6 on Monday, May 27, 2013 10:31 AM

In 1989 I got to see Goliad where Col. Fannin and his men were brutally murdered in what could be considered an early war crime. Too bad one of our Presidents gave the old butcher's leg away.

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