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Military/Fashion Protocol Question

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  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Military/Fashion Protocol Question
Posted by Tojo72 on Saturday, September 08, 2018 7:10 PM

Some time ago I purchased one of those navy blue ballcaps that show a ships name,number,and silhouette,the kind you might see in a museum gift shop.I had mine embroidered with my fathers ship.I wear it occasionally in memory of my father.I didnt think anything of it till a few people at the state fair thanked me for my service,I thanked them and told them that I didnt serve but that it was my fathers ship.Is it improper for me to wear the cap.What would you guys who served think of that.

Thanks

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Saturday, September 08, 2018 7:18 PM

I didn't serve so I can't answer your question. I do however think that when I see someone wearing one, I assume it was their ship.

No harm, no foul in my opinion but a little confusing.

I have a couple that say more than the ship name and hull number. For instance I have one for the USS Pampanito because I contribute to the cause. It says "USS Pampanito Breakfast Club" since that event where they hooked me, a breakfast on board, was where I was given the hat.

A solution might be to add the phrase "Dad's Ship" or some such.

 

Just my 2 cents.

  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Saturday, September 08, 2018 7:22 PM
I've been to the USS New Jersey and the USS Midway and they sell similar hats in the gift shops,thats why it didnt concern me.

  • Member since
    March, 2007
  • From: Northeast WA State
Posted by armornut on Saturday, September 08, 2018 7:41 PM

   No problem, your honoring your father. Those hats could be easily purchased on a "Tiger Cruise", if one wanted. Your an honest man Tojo and I don't think your being disrespectful. 

we're modelers it's what we do

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Saturday, September 08, 2018 10:45 PM

Seeing how many museums sell such caps to the general public, and if you’re not trying to pass yourself off as a veteran, I’d say no harm, no foul. If someone does the ‘thank you for your service’ bit while you’re wearing the cap, just quickly respond that your father served on that ship. 

A few months ago on my way to a local eatery I saw a guy wearing an 82nd Airborne shirt as we walked towards one another. Being a former paratrooper myself, I immediately sounded off to him with an “all the way!”. He looked at me confused until I pointed to the logo on his shirt. He then said, ”that’s my brother who was there”. No offense taken on either side.

I wear Flying Tiger shirts now, since my son is in the Air Force and assigned to that Wing. If anybody asks, I tell them he is serving there, and I bought the shirt while visiting his base. Of course it probably has some folks scratching their heads if they don’t ask and notice the jump wings tattoo on my forearm...

perhaps you could add a “in memory of (dad’s name and rate) USN year X to year Y” embroidered on the rear.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    October, 2004
  • From: Orlando, Florida
Posted by ikar01 on Saturday, September 08, 2018 11:27 PM

When I see people with hats like those usually I automatically think that they had been assigned to that ship.  No problem.  I wear a hat for the vietnam war and have a few pins on it to indicate my role in the war.  Notably a M-16, Security Police badge, police qual. badge and one with the Air Force emblem.  When I see someone with a A.F. hat I might ask them what their job was just in the hopes of talking to someone with a common background.  It's similar to running into someone with a hat or shirt from the state your were from.

It's only when I find someone wearing things to make themselves look like they were in and involved and it's obvious from what they are saying that are faking it to make themselves look big or for private gain that most vets would say something.  

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Sunday, September 09, 2018 12:12 AM

It's a good topic Tojo.

My late FIL wore ballcaps all the time that he got for a lot of various things. Everything from Knight of Columbus to Reno Air Races, a bunch of other stuff.

I tend towards Baseball Teams.

Someone once mistook me for Mike Krukow, but otherwise no issues.

 

 

 

  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Sunday, September 09, 2018 5:16 AM
Thanks for the advice gentlemen

  • Member since
    March, 2013
Posted by patrick206 on Sunday, September 09, 2018 2:18 PM

Tojo - I served, I see nothing other than your respecting and honoring your Fathers service with that cap.

That you saw fit to do that says it all,  if someone does say thank you, your answer of "it was my Dad's ship, he served on it," would surely be taken as your remembering Dad. I'd say that's something very nice, I thank you for doing it.

Patrick

 

  • Member since
    November, 2008
  • From: Central Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Sunday, September 09, 2018 3:27 PM

I have several from the ships that came to Miami years ago and purchased their hats at the ship’s gift shop.

My favorite one is the USS Saratoga. When she anchored off The Port of Miami the Navy hosted LEO Appreciation  Day so us being  cops my buddy and I took the ferry to the ship. Later in the afternoon the seas got pretty rough and it was announced that it was too dangerous for ferry operations so a  large group of civilians spent the night on the ship. The Navy was feeding us every hour! My buddy and me made friends with a Tomcat pilot who took us to different parts of the ship off limits to visitors. We even got to see his Tomcat parked below. The bunks were very tight but I slept like a baby.

I also don’t wear the hats but have them in my closet.

 GIFMaker.org_jy_Ayj_O

 

 

Too many models to build, not enough time in a lifetime!!

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Sunday, September 09, 2018 5:11 PM

I don't follow any protocol of wearing military ballcaps or t-shirts/sweatshirts. If I like it, I wear it. End of story.

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Sunday, September 09, 2018 7:37 PM

BlackSheepTwoOneFour

I don't follow any protocol of wearing military ballcaps or t-shirts/sweatshirts. If I like it, I wear it. End of story.

 

yes, but it can lead to confrontations at times with grumpy old veterans. Unit shirts and caps can be a touchy area. Some guys can have a chip on their shoulder. 

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Monday, September 10, 2018 12:12 AM

I understand that. BUT... if bought in gift shop say USS Intrepid Air Land and Sea Museum in NYC, it's a sovenier. 

The only ones I won't wear nor buy are the ones that are labelled Veterans with the ship, armed service, conflcit event (Vietnam, Korea, etc...) squad/squadron for where they served.

Everything else is fair game. That's just my opinion.

  • Member since
    July, 2016
  • From: Malvern, PA
Posted by WillysMB on Monday, September 10, 2018 11:59 AM

I do a fair amount of reenacting with two groups, both are sticklers for accuracy and proper respect. I have a named 20th AF set of Class A's that I wear for "formal" occasions and a set of 15 Corps field dress for "normal" events where I have my Jeep. Wearing either into a restaurant or similar location can be interesting. "Thank you for your service" is very common and I always indicate back that I'm a reenactor, usually doesn't make any difference to the person. Several times the waitress has given me the veterans discount, which I always decline, except a couple times the manager has insisted saying, "you're honoring the WWII vets and we would like to do the same."

Most interesting time though was when I was invited to a formal Naval retirement ceremony in the chapel at Valley Forge on Veterans Day. Our group had been asked by the park to put on a military timeline from Rev War to Korea and I knew it was going to be very difficult to change before the retirement event, so asked the honoree if it would be proper, and would he mind, if I wore my WWII AAF Class A's. He checked with his CO, and came back with "absolutely." Sitting in the chapel with a fair number of Navy brass in full dress was quite an experience. I was called out by the MC as representing the WWII vets there on Veterans Day, made me stand a little taller...

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Monday, September 10, 2018 1:37 PM

Now there is an interesting point- re enactors. Wearing a “historical” uniform of a bygone era, obviously that individual is not serving currently. At least to anyone with knowledge of current uniforms. (Now if the US Army goes back to ‘Pinks & Greens’ as the current SMA wants to do that could become an issue) And in the cases that you mention Willys, it boils down to intent and how one reacts when approached. 

Which brought back a memory. In 2004 when my Guard unit was federalized under Operation Enduring Freedom for deployment, we were first sent to Camp Roberts CA for a couple weeks. During that first weekend there was some sort of re enactment event there, and for some reason, they were feeding those guys with us in the chow hall. It was kind of funny to see guys in WWII field uniforms amongst all the real GIs in BDUs...

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    March, 2009
  • From: Yorkville, IL
Posted by wolfhammer1 on Tuesday, September 11, 2018 9:01 PM

This thread brought to mind a funny story from a simpler time.  Growing up, I had a friend and fellow modeler who was stationed at an Air national guard base.  He invited me out one summer day for a tour, knowing I was an aviation geek.  I put on my camo painters cap I had gotten from a recruiter at a career fair and drove out to the base.  The guard at the gate goes to wave me through.  I stopped and corrected him, and he called my friend to escort me.  No big deal then, almost 30 years ago, but today, I can't imaging the storm that would have occurred if i had accepted the wave through.  As far as wearing caps and what not, I say go for it.  My dad served in Korea and has a Korea vet cap which he proudly wears all the time.  I've been mistaken for a vet myself a couple of times, wearing souvenier shirts from the Air Force academy.  So long as you are honest that you are honoring your dad, so be it.  No body should have any issues.

John

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by seastallion53 on Tuesday, September 11, 2018 9:05 PM

As an ex navy man as long as you don't wear a uniform or make people think you served i see no stolen valor.

  • Member since
    January, 2018
Posted by Jet Jaguar on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 9:33 AM

I'm a cyclist, and this topic brings something to mind.  I have a US Navy cycling jersey, but I hardly ever wear it because although I work for the Navy, I never served in the Navy.  I'm just a civilian employee.  It's not an official uniform or anything, and I bought it in a regular bike shop so it's clearly sold to the general public, but it still doesn't feel right.  I don't want people to think I'm pretending to be a sailor.

- Bob

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 9:45 AM

Considering just about 90% of the population where you live aren't "military fashion police" per say when it comes to wearing anything military related - be it you served or a civilian employee for the military. So I don't care what anyone thinks or say. It's your money, you bought it because you think it's cool to show your support and wear it. End of story.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 2:17 PM

BlackSheepTwoOneFour

So I don't care what anyone thinks or say. It's your money, you bought it because you think it's cool to show your support and wear it. End of story.

 

So I'm not trying to provoke you or anything, but that's an attitude that seems to discount the concern of the OP. I see you're a Black Sheep, but that might not be what he needs.

 

Bill

  • Member since
    January, 2013
Posted by BlackSheepTwoOneFour on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 2:31 PM

No provocation taken. Nor my screen name has anything to do with being a rebel. I just like the Black Sheep Squadron. Just stating the fact one shouldn’t worry about offending others by wearing military related clothing/ball caps. There is enough PC as it is in this world. Choosing whether or not to wear certain clothes shouldn’t be examined under the microscope nor crucified for the sake of not offending others. 

 

 

  • Member since
    March, 2003
  • From: Western North Carolina
Posted by Tojo72 on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 2:47 PM

BlackSheepTwoOneFour

No provocation taken. Nor my screen name has anything to do with being a rebel. I just like the Black Sheep Squadron. Just stating the fact one shouldn’t worry about offending others by wearing military related clothing/ball caps. There is enough PC as it is in this world. Choosing whether or not to wear certain clothes shouldn’t be examined under the microscope nor crucified for the sake of not offending others. 

 

 

 

Just to be clear,I certainly don't stand with the PC crowd,there is so much deviation from common sense these days.My original question was for guys who might have served to get their thoughts on the matter and what was considered protocol.I was not concerned about offending some person,activist,peacenik who might be offended by my the act of wearing something military.It was strictly about vets and whether or not it could be construed as trying to be something I wasnt.

Cheers and thanks for all the input Beer

 

 

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 4:17 PM

GMorrison

 

 
BlackSheepTwoOneFour

So I don't care what anyone thinks or say. It's your money, you bought it because you think it's cool to show your support and wear it. End of story.

 

 

 

So I'm not trying to provoke you or anything, but that's an attitude that seems to discount the concern of the OP. I see you're a Black Sheep, but that might not be what he needs.

 

 

Bill

 

Now there is another valid point. 

A new guy here just may come to the conclusion from the screen name that he is or was a veteran of that unit. If that new guy was a veteran of VMF/VMA/VMFA-214 and finds out that he is not, the new guy could potentially take some offense- why is one calling them self this when they never were one? Not taking either side, but raising awareness.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    June, 2014
  • From: New Braunfels , Texas
Posted by Tanker - Builder on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 4:21 PM

Hi;

 Number one , You work for the Navy i.e. D.O.D. A Generic navy hat is Not incorrect . I have all types including Corps and navy caps from ships and units I served with and on . I also served on some of those ships as a Marine and a Sailor too . I wear them all and thank the younger bucks for being there .

 Number two , Wear what you want , Just be ready to defend your choice to disgruntled old Salts , Leathernecks or Army guys . Oh Army Air Force and Air force too . Although I don't know what they would be disgruntled for . That's their problem , Not yours .

If you wera a Navy or Corps ballcap you are , as I see it honoring me just putting it on your head !  T.B.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 4:34 PM

stikpusher

 

 
GMorrison

 

 
BlackSheepTwoOneFour

So I don't care what anyone thinks or say. It's your money, you bought it because you think it's cool to show your support and wear it. End of story.

 

 

 

So I'm not trying to provoke you or anything, but that's an attitude that seems to discount the concern of the OP. I see you're a Black Sheep, but that might not be what he needs.

 

 

Bill

 

 

 

Now there is another valid point. 

A new guy here just may come to the conclusion from the screen name that he is or was a veteran of that unit. If that new guy was a veteran of VMF/VMA/VMFA-214 and finds out that he is not, the new guy could potentially take some offense- why is one calling them self this when they never were one? Not taking either side, but raising awareness.

 

Devil Stik, are you trolling the dude?

  • Member since
    July, 2004
  • From: Sunny So. Cal... The OC
Posted by stikpusher on Wednesday, September 12, 2018 5:48 PM

No definitely not trolling. Blacksheep and I have known one another for quite awhile here. I like to think that we are on good terms. I am just putting the same basic situation into a different context. Clothing as opposed to screen names. Especially when a stranger is involved. 

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Thursday, September 13, 2018 3:11 PM

It's an interesting discussion in a broader sense.

For instance, if I wear a Stanford football hat, I'm a fan (which I am). If I wear a Stanford logo hat, I'm a grad (which I am not). If I wear my old Stanford Indians logo hat, well that's another story.

 

  • Member since
    December, 2003
  • From: 37deg 40.13' N 95deg 29.10'W
Posted by scottrc on Thursday, September 13, 2018 4:52 PM

I got a ships cap when I went on a dependants cruise. They gave one to everybody.    Wearing fatigues with no ratings is also fine.

Same with civilian appearal with the branch of service logo, you are showing support although you were never offical part of the service.

What I wouldn't do is wear any part of a dress uniform, actual unit patches or identification, ratings, or any service awards, that, I feel, is crossing the line and should be reserved to those who took the oath and served.  

 

 

  • Member since
    August, 2017
Posted by laskdjn on Thursday, September 13, 2018 5:31 PM

As a Marine in the 3rd Assault Amphibian Battalion for 5 years, I honestly see no problem with it as long as you're not trying to insinuate that you yourself have actually served, which by what you've said, you did quite the opposite.

 

The ones that burn me up are the ones that actively try to steal valor.

  • Member since
    September, 2012
Posted by GMorrison on Friday, September 14, 2018 10:10 PM

I was at an event yesterday and a guy who I know is not a member of, was wearing an ICE cap. Now, isn't that sort of illegal?

I was wearing a US Open 2000 ball cap, but I don't think anyone mistook my white butt for Tiger, who I watched win by 15 strokes at said event.

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