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Is it possible to take the kit too far?

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  • Member since
    May 2011
  • From: Canada
Is it possible to take the kit too far?
Posted by HisNHer Tanks on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 8:57 AM

Ok I know that some will respond with variations on 'well no one is forcing you' and 'do what feels right for you', but I find it hard some times to muck in on some threads because I feel a bit lost.

 

Over at Track 48 (great place), I have been reading the thread on Sherman tracks (and how to make sure they sit flat properly), and it's just hard to see myself truly being that worried.

True, if they are wrong, then they are wrong. But, how far is too far?

I was reading through the thread on how to make the fix, and I can't seem to get past wanting to yell, 'are you guys really that crazy?'.

98% of the people that will end up in a position to see my Tamiya Shermans won't know it is a Sherman, and likely will be lucky to get passed knowing it is American because it is American green (I doubt most would know the real name of the colour). So the need to get the track utterly and perfectly flat in the run, such that I will fiddle with shims to get that last microscopic shift in location, SEEMS INSANE.

What can I say.

I personally think spending potentially twice the out of the box price on a kit (when you factor in the cost of aftermarket add ons), is potentially a bit loopy in some cases. But if the person likes that little extra tweak, I suppose it is no biggie.

Granted, I consider paying 40ish for a Tamiya tank ok, but paying 80-90 ish on it as a result of buying extra tid bits that only get bought from being fussy, just means I don't have TWO Tamiya tanks kits instead.

My idea of a good idea on aftermarket items, is to get variant parts for kits that simply don't exist to begin with. Case in point, currently eyeballing a Brummbar item to allow me to make a Brummbar from a Tamiya PzIV base kit. And in that way, I can give the fugly 1/35th scale Tamiya Brummbar the boot.

But I have been reading a lot of comments in recent time, and it's not easy to want to share, when I consider how most of my stuff is out of the box, did my best effort, did the painting as well as possible, but simply didn't mind that the kit has some issues some have dug up thanks to a magnifying glass and as micrometer.

Ultimately my goal is finish the kit, then photograph it under nice conditions (some sort of diorama setting of a generic sort) such that a person needs to ask 'is that real?'.

No one is going to really notice the tracks on the Tamiya 48th scale Shermans are a hair raised up incorrectly in almost all viewing conditions. And the time devoted to these levels of absurd attention likely are just ensuring your stash never gets done or expanded much eh guys.

I could almost make a case, that some of us in the hobby are in need of help :)

Tamiya 1/48th scale armour fan

  • Member since
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Posted by Anonymous on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 9:02 AM

...yes...and no...

  • Member since
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  • From: Rothesay, NB Canada
Posted by VanceCrozier on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 9:06 AM

HisNHer Tanks

...I could almost make a case, that some of us in the hobby are in need of help :)

maybe

On the bench: Airfix 1/72 Wildcat; Airfix 1/72 Vampire T11; Airfix 1/72 Fouga Magister

  • Member since
    February 2011
  • From: San Antonio
Posted by MAJ Mike on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 9:33 AM

Certainly.

 

 

 "I'd "I'd rather be historically accurate than politically correct."

"Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc!"

  • Member since
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  • From: Washington, DC
Posted by TomZ2 on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 10:03 AM

Please see my thread Bugs Bunny Moment”. I’m not going to cross-post it. The crux is “What am I doing?!?”.

Occasional factual, grammatical, or spelling variations are inherent to this thesis and should not be considered as defects, as they enhance the individuality and character of this document.

  • Member since
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  • From: Houston, Texas
Posted by Medicman71 on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 10:11 AM

I do like to add aftermarket stuff to my kits only where they need it. (See Tomcat nose). But I try not to go overboard with it.

Now there are kits that you can't get any aftermarket stuff for such as the Italeri MV-22 Osprey. Had to scratchbuild that stuff. It isn't perfect but it looks great to me.

I'm no rivet counter either. If it looks right then it's good enough for me.

Building- (All 1/48) F-14A Tomcat, F-16C Blk 30, He 129

 

  • Member since
    July 2013
Posted by DURR on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 1:23 PM

things like after market treads are ok if the box ones r wrong     but... putting 'WORKING'  metal ones on for the sake that they move  well lets get on the floor and play with our model  and roll it around

  • Member since
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  • From: The Great North Woods, Maine
Posted by Chazzer on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 1:37 PM

GONE!

ChazzerBlack Eye

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 7:10 PM

Well, everyone has a "personal standard", but in my mind it's called :Taking pride in your work". YES, I would fiddle with a track to get it perfectly flat and straight.

I've gone through hell to fix some tracks, ad the end result was a model I was quite proud of. But that's my admitted personal standard, which may be different from yours.

It would be nice to read some more serious responses.

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 7:19 PM

Although slogging it out in the trenches scratch building & toiling with AM goodies will add a considerable amount of time to a build. 2X - 4X longer than OOB is a good estimate.

 

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

  • Member since
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  • From: Green Bay, WI
Posted by redraider56 on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 7:21 PM

the doog

Well, everyone has a "personal standard"

Thing with me is that I'm not sure what my personal standard is, and therefore whenever I try to do something extra I dont know if I'm doing too much or should stick to what I know.....it just keeps going round and round and I never get anything done

-Matt

On The Bench: 1/48 HK B-17G "Man-O-War II"

On Deck: 1/48 Tamiya P-38H, 1/48 Revell PV-1

 

 

 

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 7:45 PM

redraider56

 

 the doog:

 

Well, everyone has a "personal standard"

 

 

Thing with me is that I'm not sure what my personal standard is, and therefore whenever I try to do something extra I dont know if I'm doing too much or should stick to what I know.....it just keeps going round and round and I never get anything done

In that case, it probably comes down to what modeling does for you in terms of filling a need in your life.

For me, it's a distraction, but more than that--it's a lucrative hobby that I make money from by selling articles. So I can't afford to have my standards be lax. No one is inspired by sloppy or unimpressive models. (Not saying yours are! Wink)

I am an artistically-minded person, so I take great care to try to produce something "artful"--and in that regard, it doesn't really matter how long it takes. It's all about the end result being impressive.

  • Member since
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  • From: Ohio
Posted by B-17 Guy on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 8:53 PM

Content removed

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Posted by the doog on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 9:01 PM

Post edited upon request.

I"m just a happy doog. Big Smile

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  • From: AusTx, Live Music Capitol of the World
Posted by SteveM on Wednesday, June 22, 2011 10:33 PM

I photograph my projects really close. I will definitely notice things like out-of-scale thickness at that vantage point, and it will bug the heck outta me. I do what I can to keep it looking as real as possible, at that close range, to try to fool my own eye. If that means fiddling with tracks, using PE, or shaving a StuG fender down to card stock thickness, I find it worth it. The payoff is for me.

Steve M.

On the workbench: ginormous Kharkov dio

 

  • Member since
    May 2011
  • From: Canada
Posted by HisNHer Tanks on Thursday, June 23, 2011 8:18 AM

Using THAT image to convey these words "To each his own"" is indeed tasteless and not even remotely clever.

Makes me wonder at what the person routinely considers 'funny' and whether I would routinely like their concept of humour.

Tamiya 1/48th scale armour fan

  • Member since
    January 2011
  • From: The Great North Woods, Maine
Posted by Chazzer on Thursday, June 23, 2011 9:52 AM

Guys, I had NO idea. I'll get rid of it if I can. It was not to offend. I am so sorry. I just thought it said "to each his own" . It wasn't meant to be funny to begin with. It wasn't meant as humor. I thought it was clever. But now knowing what is is I am mortified! Please forgive me.

ChazzerBlack Eye

  • Member since
    January 2011
  • From: The Great North Woods, Maine
Posted by Chazzer on Thursday, June 23, 2011 10:27 AM

I was on my way out and I turned back and felt compelled to say how embarrassed, sorrowfully and stupid I feel. I consider myself to be a fairly sensitive guy as you can see from my thread history. I can't say enough how sorry I am. When I searched for the words that said "to each his own" this picture along with a few others popped up. I chose it thinking it was old and in German, not thinking it was what it was. Key word "not thinking". I am mortified! Once again I'm sorry. I can't seem to say it enough.

Scott

ChazzerBlack Eye

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Hancock, Me USA
Posted by p38jl on Thursday, June 23, 2011 10:30 AM

Chazzer

I was on my way out and I turned back and felt compelled to say how embarrassed, sorrowfully and stupid I feel. I consider myself to be a fairly sensitive guy as you can see from my thread history. I can't say enough how sorry I am. When I searched for the words that said "to each his own" this picture along with a few others popped up. I chose it thinking it was old and in German, not thinking it was what it was. Key word "not thinking". I am mortified! Once again I'm sorry. I can't seem to say it enough.

Scott

You should be able to go back to the post, and click the options. and edit it.. Yes  I think you did ok with the apology.

[Photobucket]

  • Member since
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  • From: The Great North Woods, Maine
Posted by Chazzer on Thursday, June 23, 2011 10:33 AM

Thanks. I edited it. It's gone.

ChazzerBlack Eye

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Hancock, Me USA
Posted by p38jl on Thursday, June 23, 2011 10:39 AM

Yes

[Photobucket]

  • Member since
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  • From: Rothesay, NB Canada
Posted by VanceCrozier on Thursday, June 23, 2011 10:48 AM

Chazzer

I was on my way out and I turned back and felt compelled to say how embarrassed, sorrowfully and stupid I feel. I consider myself to be a fairly sensitive guy as you can see from my thread history. I can't say enough how sorry I am. When I searched for the words that said "to each his own" this picture along with a few others popped up. I chose it thinking it was old and in German, not thinking it was what it was. Key word "not thinking". I am mortified! Once again I'm sorry. I can't seem to say it enough.

Scott

No problem Scott, gotta keep an eye on google sometimes, especially when it starts switching laguages on you!

On the bench: Airfix 1/72 Wildcat; Airfix 1/72 Vampire T11; Airfix 1/72 Fouga Magister

  • Member since
    January 2003
  • From: Washington, DC
Posted by TomZ2 on Thursday, June 23, 2011 10:51 AM

Scott, your action underscores the substrate of the topic, we all get lost in the moment.

Now if everyone affected would just to a quick Edit in their posts (as there does not seem to be a way to do this en masse) and delete the image? Pax.

Occasional factual, grammatical, or spelling variations are inherent to this thesis and should not be considered as defects, as they enhance the individuality and character of this document.

  • Member since
    June 2010
  • From: Austin, TX
Posted by DoogsATX on Thursday, June 23, 2011 11:00 AM

I think "too far" is too subjective to really draw a line in the sand.

I mean, a few months ago there was MIG-something or other in FSM that was crazy-detailed. Hundreds of parts...IN THE WHEEL BAYS! Some elements shaved off and made to scale thickness with PUTTY! I couldn't even fathom how to do that. The build was stunning, but to an extent I do have to question the builder's sanity.

That said...I'm totally planning on drilling out the wing guns on my P-51 WIP and replacing them with slide-fit micro-tubing. Which is kind of silly, yeah, but will look oh-so awesome when all is said and done. I'm contemplating filling all the wing panels forward of the gun bays, too, but haven't made up my mind there. I read recently an observation that the wear and tear of mission hours, plus the various painting and stripping (as with invasion stripes and such) probably knocked a lot of that filler out, but I'm not an expert enough to believe or not believe it. 

On the Bench: 1/32 Trumpeter P-47 | 1/32 Hasegawa Bf 109G | 1/144 Eduard MiG-21MF x2

On Deck:  1/350 HMS Dreadnought

Blog/Completed Builds: doogsmodels.com

 

  • Member since
    May 2011
  • From: Canada
Posted by HisNHer Tanks on Thursday, June 23, 2011 11:05 AM

Glad this has had a happy resolution. I retract my admonishing comment.

Tamiya 1/48th scale armour fan

  • Member since
    March 2008
  • From: Ohio
Posted by B-17 Guy on Thursday, June 23, 2011 2:06 PM

I too retract my comment and fully and humbley accept the apology offered as perfectly acceptable.

As for the original intent if this thread. My personal problem I have is when I spend a ton of time on one area then virtually ignore others. Right now, I have 24 1/48th scale B-17 engines on my bench, all of them are gonna get wired up, have the 2 piece metal ring added, AND have scratch built prop governors added, again, 24 of them. BUT....will I add brake lines to the landing legs? Maybe.

  • Member since
    May 2010
Posted by JoeK on Thursday, June 23, 2011 3:23 PM

I don't know if there is a "too far" for me.  What I have done is try to do the next kit a little better than the last. I can look at my first model through my last and see the progression. I am not to the point where I am ready to put a $20 after market barrel on a $40 tank, but I also don't just take the barrel off the sprue and mount it to the turret right away either.

I guess I will know "too far" when I get there, but for now there is still much more I can improve on.

 

Joe

 

  • Member since
    March 2010
Posted by shoot&scoot on Thursday, June 23, 2011 8:21 PM

All modelers have what I have come to call "degree of stupidity" when building.  For example a person who builds OOB and does a stock paint job has a low DOS and somebody that does the aforementioned MIG build has a very high DOS.

I fall somewhere toward the high end of DOS and have discovered what I call "DOS creep" in that the DOS seems to go up with each model I build as I notice more and more details through my 10x Optivisor.  For the life of me I can't figure out how to stop it!  My hat's off to the people who have a certain point to where they take their builds and go no further but I am also blown away by the person who will spend thousands of hours and dollars to create their perfect opus.

Disclaimer:  I am NOT calling any body stupid but for lack of a better word "degree of stupidity" seems to work.  But most of all, beware "DOS creep"!

                                                                                        Pat. 

  • Member since
    May 2011
  • From: Canada
Posted by HisNHer Tanks on Friday, June 24, 2011 6:09 AM

Ooooooccasionally I will find myself carefully filing and cleaning off mold seams from things like leaf springs on a 72nd scale vehicle. Yes I know, making a model is a personal thing and a challenge. But eventually you need to realize why you are making the model.

It's so someone can look at it and go wow did you make that?

And of course that is your moment.

So if the mere idea of them picking it up and looking under it makes you cringe (mainly because they just picked up your friggin model.... why do idiots think we want them to pick up our damned models eh?), then it is possible a lot of the work being done, is portentially stupid.

In recent years I have learned to master the art of 'get real' when it has come to how far is too far.

I already know how good of a modeler I am. I also know I was a lot more enthusiastic 20 years ago when my eyes were a lot younger too :) I've been paid to make things in the past. I've even done this hobby professionally for a time.

Today though, it's about not dying with kits unfinished :)

Nobody really cares if you have a 'stash' guys. It's the truth. We'd be impressed if you had them all finished.

Tamiya 1/48th scale armour fan

  • Member since
    September 2007
  • From: Truro Nova Scotia, Canada
Posted by SuppressionFire on Friday, June 24, 2011 6:39 AM

HisNHer Tanks,

Nobody really cares if you have a 'stash' guys. It's the truth. We'd be impressed if you had them all finished.

Agreed,

I find the more kits I own the harder it is to complete them! Its distracting to know there are fresh canvases molded in styrene when getting bogged down on a current project.

Ooooooccasionally I will find myself carefully filing and cleaning off mold seams from things like leaf springs on a 72nd scale vehicle.

That affliction to me is more personal satisfaction. Knowing I did everything possible to clear the 'clean build' phase of the build. On larger scales like 1/25 I ponder how to scratch build the springs instead of just cleaning up the kits offering. The fine line is to just do it vrs cleaning for a few hours only to scratch build anyway.

Learning from past time consuming decisions I weigh the options before commencing scratch building. 

1st Will the work be easily viewed & appreciated?

2nd How much better will the part actually be scratch built vrs OOB?

3rd Scratch building is my favorite aspect of model building so why not?

4th Will this deviation from OOB take to long & get shelved or completed?

Sometimes there are no easy answers. One day I hope to build a kit OOB for therapy.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/razordws/GB%20Badges/WMIIIGBsmall.jpg

 

 

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