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VK-4502 Vorne: "The Berlin Hedgehog" FINISHED PICS!

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  • Member since
    January 2007
VK-4502 Vorne: "The Berlin Hedgehog" FINISHED PICS!
Posted by the doog on Monday, June 10, 2013 7:52 PM

Hi Guys,

HI--ANYONE WHO'S TRYING TO VIEW THIS POST, PLEASE BE PATIENT;  ['VE APPARENTLY "EXCEEDED BANDWIDTH" FROM PHOTOBUCKET WHICH MUST RESET NOW LATER IN THE MONTH. DOESN'T REALLY MATTER, AS I WON'T BE UPDATING TIL I ET BACK NEXT WEEKEND. THANKS FOR AL THE VIEWS, COMMENTS AND YOUR INTEREST!!! BE BACK SOON!!

Well, I'm back in the saddle again with a build I've been working on for a while here---slow going, as I've been having a number of setbacks with it. Repainting, experimenting, and having to rebuild lost parts. I've finally got it to where I can show some progress.

First of all, the surface of the model is too smooth for a big steel beast...I had to fill in the joint between the first hull addition that you put on.

I used my Dremel to bump and grind in some texture to the hull.

Not sure if you can make it out here....

Next---I"m adding zimmerit from Tamiya putty. Just trying something different; usually I use Squadron's White Putty. There's really no difference at all, in my opinion, after using it. These are Tamiya's Zimm rakes,

Got some "Field-applied" *** going here. The three protoypes built were allegedly used in combat at the end of the war; I want to portray mine as being dressed for war, with some late-additions of zimm and a cool paint scheme.

Next, the bottom of the Trumpeter model has no detail. I used the bottom of the HobbyBoss "Hintern" model as a template for the mods,

This kit has, oddly, a turret interior---but no hull interior. I decided to build it anyway, as an exercise. This was where I did some experimenting--I used the hairspray method to do some weathering on the floor. I mixed my own primer color from Tamiya, and had a few go-arounds of stripping it all to get a "right" color and weathering mix. All the parts were reduced to sub-assemblies to facilitate the painting and assembly.

My experiments with the hairspray chipping. I reduced this somewhat since the photo.

I had to paint the shells before I could put them in the racks. I like the green shells as portrayed in front of the Panzermuseum in Germany. he others, I painted steel, as metal shortages saw these shells made of steel later in the war.

The turret top,.

Top & bottom

The lower turret basket, finally painted, weathered and put together. I plan to add some minor dirt to this as well, from the crew's boots.

The turret basket installed. The fit is tricky here; it was a chore to get this all lined up and every part connected and painted properly. I broke off all of the seat mounts at one point or another, and had to rebuild them all. Ugh!

Well, that's it or now---I have to work on the gun assembly next. I expect that to take a week or so with my schedule lately. Indifferent

Thanks for looking in, guys! Any comments and critiques are always welcomed and appreciated! Smile

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: On my kitchen counter top somewhere in central North Carolina.
Posted by disastermaster on Monday, June 10, 2013 8:30 PM

AH Yes, At Last!

                       http://www.sclero.org/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/emoticons-yes.gif

 The turret was specifically designed by Krupp for this vehicle so don't forget to delete the shell ejection port (behind the ventilator) on top of the turret.

I'm still a staggerin' around the kitchen countertop with mine.........


 https://i.imgur.com/LjRRaV1.png

 

 

 
  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Monday, June 10, 2013 9:50 PM

Very cool project! So this was the prototype that lost out to the Henschel King Tiger? And it actually saw battle in the end days of the war?  Sweet!

BTW, beautiful work so far...

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    November 2008
  • From: Central Florida
Posted by plasticjunkie on Tuesday, June 11, 2013 5:04 AM

That is great that the manufacturer provides a complete turret interior. I wish Academy would have done the turret detail in my 1/25 Panther that I'm working on. I specially like how your ammo came out. Beer

 GIFMaker.org_jy_Ayj_O

 

 

Too many models to build, not enough time in a lifetime!!

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Tuesday, June 11, 2013 9:02 AM

Thanks for looking in, guys! And for the chuckle, Steve!

Lee, yup, that's the one that lost out to the Henschel. Reports say that it was used somewhere south of Zossen as part of a Kampfgrup Kaether in the last days of the war. Unfortunately no pics of it have surfaced, but where it was destroyed was right next to where the Maus was discovered, so it's possible that it was simply overlooked in the Maus fervor?

Thanks, too, plasticjunkie. I like those green shells too. Something different! The interior is cool too, but I don't know how much good it's going to do without a hull interior. I want to show it off, but don't know if that's doable without a hull interior.

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Tuesday, June 11, 2013 11:15 AM

Karl, it looks like not much of the hull interior would be visible anyways. At least not the drivers compartment. I did not notice any upper hull hatches on the pieces you posted the photos of. Looking down thru the turret hatches, the turret basket will obscure 90% of the view into the hull, and Ibet once the main gun breech is in place it will take up most of the rest of the 10%.

I suppose you could add a firewall for the engine compartment into the hull aft of the turret area and add some gizmology there... perhaps some ammo stowage racks on the hull lower side walls as well

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Wednesday, June 12, 2013 6:32 AM

Carlos, yeah, I thought about that, but I"m already into this build for way more time than I like, and besides, I don't have a plan to exhibit the interior any more than it will be visible. This vehicle strangely has no hull hatches for the driver, so you can't even see in the hull. I"ll just go with it as is, and leave the turret hatches open.

  • Member since
    March 2013
  • From: Puebla, Mexico
Posted by garzonh on Wednesday, June 12, 2013 9:12 AM

I need to try this hairbrus spray technique, the wearing of the interior looks perfect!. Too bad you will  not be able to display it...

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Texas
Posted by wbill76 on Wednesday, June 12, 2013 4:29 PM

Very nice build and interior work there Karl! Yes I hear you about tackling detailed stuff only to have it break or need rebuilding as you move along but would never know about the issues based on the finished and painted interior. Beer

  • Member since
    May 2003
  • From: Mexico
Posted by rtvmodeler on Thursday, June 13, 2013 10:46 AM

Yes Excellent detail and zimmerit. 

Regards!
Rodolfo

Current Project:

Figures from Dragon, "German 6th Army, Stalingrad 1942-1943", 1/35

  • Member since
    December 2006
  • From: N. Georgia
Posted by Jester75 on Thursday, June 13, 2013 3:53 PM

Along for the ride! Excellent work so far doog! I really like the turret interior!

Eric

 

  • Member since
    November 2004
  • From: Cat Central, NC
Posted by Bronto on Thursday, June 13, 2013 5:49 PM

Nice interior work.  Do you have any references that this vehicle had zimmerit applied?

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Thursday, June 13, 2013 5:59 PM

Thanks for looking in, guys!

Garzonh, if you haven't tried the hairspray method yet, there are a number of good links on this site that can show you how. It's definitely a technique that today's Armor modeler should have under his belt! Thanks for the Yes!

Bill, thanks, buddy; nice of you to say that. It's been a tedious process with the assembly and painting requirements, but it's a relief to have it finally done!

Thanks too, Rodolfo, for the nice words!

Hi again, Eric--nice to have you along! Thanks for looking in!

Bronto, no, information on this vehicle is quite sparse. But as it's a prototype, I"m venturing my own story and interpretation of it. It will be a vehicle--one of three, apparently,--that was brought out of the shed to fight for the defense of the Reich. They threw a coat of zimmerit on it (as that was  the norm when it was produced) and repainted it and sent it out to the front. Since there's no hard documentation of it, I'm taking an imaginative interpretation of it---that's what's so fun about these paper/prototype panzers!

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: On my kitchen counter top somewhere in central North Carolina.
Posted by disastermaster on Sunday, June 16, 2013 2:28 AM

   http://www.thedigichick.com/forums/images/smilies/impatient.gif

    http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/basketball/dribbling-smiley-emoticon.gif

              http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/nervous/waiting.gif

                   http://pidgin-themes.org/themes/smileys/Hyves%20Kwekker/Hyves%20Kwekker/smiley_poker.gif

                     http://www.rocketryforum.com/images/smilies/xmas/8975.gif

                          http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/laughing/animated-laughing-smiley-emoticon.gif

 https://i.imgur.com/LjRRaV1.png

 

 

 
  • Member since
    July 2006
  • From: New Jersey
Posted by redleg12 on Monday, June 17, 2013 5:44 AM

Karl - Nice to see you back again. Looks like you got a ton of work done. love the interior work. Ammunition looks great. All of the hull work with the Zimm is fabulous. Looks like another Doog special off to a great start.

Rounds Complete!!

"The Moral High Ground....A Great Place to Emplace Artillery."

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Monday, June 17, 2013 5:25 PM

Thanks, Steve and Mike! Good to hear from a pair of old-timers from the Good Ol' Days!  Big Smile

I'm surprised that the zimmerit is going over s well.  This ain't the easiest vehicle to zimm, and I wasn't sure of it at first. But, hey....I won't argue with ya's! Yes

  • Member since
    September 2006
  • From: Dripping Springs, TX, USA
Posted by RBaer on Tuesday, June 18, 2013 7:16 PM

Geez, doog, it'd be a shame to not be able to see the interior of the turret, after you've done such a nice job of it. Maybe some black plastic bulkheads to blank off the hull interior? It would be nice to be able to leave the rear turret hatch open, too.

Zim looks real good, too.

Apprentice rivet counter.

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Wednesday, June 19, 2013 8:33 PM

Hey thanks, Russ. I've given it a fair bit of thought, and I"m pretty sure that I"m just going to leave the hatches open and that'll be the extent of it.The rear turret hatch, too!  Wink New update coming right up....!

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Wednesday, June 19, 2013 9:22 PM

Well, as you will soon see, 'm off onto a sort-of "maverick-y" adventure here; the Quest for Something Different.!

I've been wanting to give this build something different, and I'll be honest--with so many prototypes and paper panzers out there--and all the subsequent wild paint schemes---it's been hard to think of something original-yet-plausible. I've been working away here, made a few missteps, and am finally correcting course and think that I'm on to something "different".

First, some construction updates:

Here's the nice gun breech to be painted and added to the turret interior:

Next, I've added a ring of .015 strip to the turret ring because the turret really scraped the hull--I mean, it REALLY was low! I also added two tools to the rear hull panel on either side, and light wiring with terminal "buttons".

The turret sits at a more realistic height now.

I also used a Dremel to chamfer the hull sides, as the turret just barely cleared the sides.

You can see how close the turret comes to the side.

The underside looks good now with the added detailing and the new Dark Grey paint as a base coat.

I cannot tell a lie---in my quest for originality, I had a few missteps. Here's my concept for this tank: 

        Historically, the prototypes were not accepted as production Tigers, and the remaining turrets were placed onto Henschel hulls and they became the "Porsche turret" Tigers. The hulls were left in storage at Kummersdorf Testing Grounds until the very last months of the war. At some point, Kummersdorf was "raided" for spare vehicles and armaments--anything that could be thrown at the advancing Russians. There are reports of a "Tiger" being used from Kummersdorf in the final battles---could it have been a prototype with a refurbished turret added?

In any case, the protoype would have presumably been painted in Panzer Grey, as the first tanks were completed in October 1942, and Dark Yellow was not standardized until Feb 1943. My model postulates that the hull was painted thus; later, zimmerit was applied-whether as a testbed for eventual widespread use, or in maybe as a practice hull for  workers? Maybe it was even added before being sent out to face the Russians in 1945, as the superstition regarding the magnetic mines remained entrenched. The model will be painted with this narrative in mind.

My first experimental scheme was a two-tone green with "Czech cream" hard edge lines painted via the Silly Putty method:

After shading, it looked like this:

Hmmmm.....it looked like Salvador Dali got into the paint shed...

...so I tried to tone it down with Schoklolade Braun....

Cool, but not plausible in my eyes. It was into the Mean Green bath, and stripped......sigh....Crying

Back to the drawing board, I envisioned now painting the zimmerit "zimmerit color", under which would be the original base color of Pz Grey. What I intend to do is to show a thin Dark Yellow/Pz Green hard edge pattern over the added zimmerit hull sides, and leaving the hull top and suspension in grey. Kinda like the workers got whatever small stock of paint they could procure and painted what they could before rolling  it out to the front ASAP. The turret will sport a normal 3-tone, as if it were added from a reconditioned wreck that had acted as a donor tank.

So, are you following me? Good! Big Smile I started back with the base coat:

Next, I painted the zimmerit a grey-tan. Use Tamiya thinner to keep the fast-drying Tamita paint "wet" while you brush paint.

I added chips for variety and interesting visuals....

Here, I'm masking off top surfaces to paint highlights. This is how you "color modulate" using an airbrush...

Masks come in all shapes and sizes....

I've shaded the top, and actually even added some weathering filters from Adam Wilder's new line. This is because I want to simulate a coat of camouflage paint that will have gone over an already-existing hull. So the finish has to be somewhat advanced to get the proper effect. The chipped zimmerit parts have been given a light acrylic drybrushing to simulate leftover zimmerit dust or whatever putty-like material it was made of?

Here's where I"m at now. Getting ready to add the camo colors!

Let me know what you think of the concept, guys. I'm trying to "think outside the box" on this one and pull ff something original! Comments and critiques warmly welcomed! SmileBeer

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: On my kitchen counter top somewhere in central North Carolina.
Posted by disastermaster on Thursday, June 20, 2013 12:32 AM

the doog

 I've added a ring of .015 strip to the turret ring because the turret really scraped the hull--

I'm a draggin' with the Dragon kit and haven't run into a problem with that or the commander's hatch..........

 It didn't have the track bumpers on the bottom of the sponsons http://www.smileyvault.com/albums/userpics/12962/bump~0.gif so I just made my own.

the doog

        Historically, the prototypes were not accepted as production Tigers, and the remaining turrets were placed onto Henschel hulls and they became the "Porsche turret" Tigers. The hulls were left in storage at Kummersdorf Testing Grounds until the very last months of the war. At some point, Kummersdorf was "raided" for spare vehicles and armaments--anything that could be thrown at the advancing Russians. There are reports of a "Tiger" being used from Kummersdorf in the final battles---could it have been a prototype with a refurbished turret added?

  And so we have the Kummersdorf division.....  a motley http://ollr.createaforum.com/Smileys/users/ollr/smiley-rocker.gifcrew of various tanks including a sherman and a t-34.

 Well here's a partial from the list of resources I have available ......here goes,

http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/prestonjjrtr/Funny/SmileyHappyDance.gif

 The Special Henschel turret  was especially designed for the VK4502 by professor Porsche and would mount the 8.8cm Kw.K. L/71.

 68 rounds for this gun were carried in the tank. 42 in horizontal panniers along the superstructure sides, 10 horizontally on the floor and 16 rounds stored horizontally in the turret.


 As for the hull, work continued into the middle of 1944. By that time the vehicle had hydraulic drive, new suspension, a 900 metric horsepower air-cooled diesel, and heavier armament .....

      and so and so.....
                                   http://www.augiedoggy.com/Smilies3/SewingMachine22222222.gif and so...

the doog

Hmmmm.....it looked like Salvador Dali got into the paint shed...

...so I tried to tone it down with Schoklolade Braun....

Cool, but not plausible in my eyes. It was into the Mean Green bath, and stripped......sigh....Crying

Gee doog, Looks pretty cool - I actually like it......

the doog

Here's where I"m at now. Getting ready to add the camo colors!

Let me know what you think of the concept, guys. I'm trying to "think outside the box" on this one and pull off something original! Comments and critiques warmly welcomed! SmileBeer

The gray will look good I'm sure.......http://forums.easypooltutor.com/images/smilies/smiley_wink.gif

Hey, I heard a while back that someone put a copyright to that phrase....... "think outside the box", imagine that!

Looking forward to the finale!

http://forums.collectors.com/i/expressions/clown.gif

 https://i.imgur.com/LjRRaV1.png

 

 

 
  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Texas
Posted by wbill76 on Thursday, June 20, 2013 6:40 PM

Sounds like a good plan to me Karl! Looking forward to seeing this one come to life even more. I do have to say though that I did like that pattern you scrapped...had some real eye appeal. Wink

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Friday, June 21, 2013 8:30 PM

Hey, thanks for that info, Steve--cool stuff to know. And I hope you're working on that baby again. It'll be cool to have two of them on the site at once!

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Friday, June 21, 2013 8:35 PM

Thanks, Bill!

After looking at it, I felt that that pattern looked a little too unorthodox when it was done. The lines of the third color also came out too wide--I had problems getting used to painting in the darned humidity and heat down here--I shoulda thinned the paint a little more and gotten finer lines.

Ever since AMPS I've been second-guessing everything I do now. So much pressure to excel! I have to keep reminding myself that that's not the point of the hobby! Propeller

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Saturday, June 22, 2013 8:58 AM

A small painting update---please note that if you can't see my photos for whatever reason, I got an alert from Photobucket that "You are close to exceeding your bandwidth limit for the month" (which I find awfully hard to believe, as I've NEVER even come close to that even when this site was a LOT more active?!) Hmm If I exceed it, I'll have to upgrade after b*tching to Customer Service!

Anyway,....a small painting update here;

     I wanted to portray a vehicle which had been base-painted in gray, and then hurriedly brush-painted in the last dwindling reserves of Dark Yellow. I Started with Tamiya Buff, Dark Yellow, and White, with a small pool of Tamiya thinner to aid in keeping the fast-drying Tamiya paint "wet" while brush-painting.

I started painting with the middle-tone Buff...

And then randomly added in lighter / darker tones, going or variation and trying to picture a 30inch man painting in swaths with a tiny brush. I figured he would have tinned the paint a lot at first to make it go farther, and then put some last strokes of whatever untinted reserves were left at the bottom of the can.

Here's where I am so far...a good starting point for weathering after I add some green camo.

Hope you can see my pics and comment! Thanks for looking in, guys!

  • Member since
    July 2003
  • From: On my kitchen counter top somewhere in central North Carolina.
Posted by disastermaster on Saturday, June 22, 2013 1:50 PM

What a bummer with photobucket and yet a clever go-around with the picture. Love that gray.

http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u244/heydoog/VK4501%20Vorne/17DYpaint5c_zps0269033b.jpg

Looks like you're finally on the right track, tread, link or whatever.......http://i717.photobucket.com/albums/ww173/prestonjjrtr/Smileys/duh_7b.gif

 https://i.imgur.com/LjRRaV1.png

 

 

 
  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Texas
Posted by wbill76 on Saturday, June 22, 2013 4:41 PM

Got to love PB! Wink Making good progress Karl, no pressure sir, just go with the flow and explore! Nice work on the foundation. Beer

  • Member since
    July 2004
  • From: Sonora Desert
Posted by stikpusher on Saturday, June 22, 2013 9:46 PM

This project is defintely unique. I like this paint job better than the original camo scheme that you had.

 

F is for FIRE, That burns down the whole town!

U is for URANIUM... BOMBS!

N is for NO SURVIVORS...

       - Plankton

LSM

 

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:46 AM

Thanks, Steve! You'd better be working on yours too! Stick out tongue Thanks for the affirmation! Beer

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:48 AM

PropellerThanks too, Bill, for the positive waves!

I'm riding them on a styrene surfboard!

  • Member since
    January 2007
Posted by the doog on Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:51 AM

Carlos, thanks for that affirmation as well. Glad to know that it's got some positive response!

I've got what I hope is a heck of a cool vision for this model. I hope I can carry it of the way I envision it---stay tuned!

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